"Muslim cabbies Want to Discriminate Against Customers"

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Red Mile Style

You're missing the point completely. I used that as an example, it might have been extreme, but the underlying theme is: if it's against your religion, why should you be forced to do it? What is this? Pre-occupied Iraq?

If you're so against freedom of religion, maybe it's YOU that is in the wrong society.

I never said anything about the middle east. I think right wing christian extrmemists can **** off as well.

Its you who is completely missing the point. The new world is all about freedom. Everyone's freedom. My freedom to go drink. My freedom to try and hail a cab. The cabbie's freedom to deny me service. I'm fine with that. Just don't ask for some special expemption when you deny me that service. Did you even read the article? Did you even read my posts??

Also, its not like the passengers are forcing cabbies to drink. They're not being asked to break their religious belief in any way shape or form. I never even said the cabbie should be forced to take someone. If they are uncomfortable with taking someone, great, don't take them. Just live with that decision, know you will lose the business, and carry on.

[edn88]

If you are going to live in the USA (or any country really), you should be prepared to follow the customs and 'morals' of that country. If not, you really do not belong there - look for another country. If there are not enought cab drivers then the price of cab driving will increase to manage supply and demand (the beauty of a market based economy)

I cannot even begin to imagine how many religions there are in the USA, but I guess that most of them conflict with one another in some way. What is typical is that the moral majority rules the day so you have to be prepared to follow the majority. I don't agree with all things that the 'Christian Majority' have declared to be right in Canada and USA, but in the interest of not going to jail, keeping a job etc, it behooves me to follow the rules.

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by ken0042

It's not that people are against freedom of religion; it's that if somebody has certain beliefs; don't take up a job that might make you go against those beliefs.

As another example; if my religion says that gambling is evil, I wouldn't get myself a job working at a convenience store that also sells lottery tickets.

Good point Ken... BUT...

I still have a problem with "well, if you're this religion... just don't be this... or you shouldn't do that" Why should someone's religion determine their career choice? I mean, I remember a few years back when there was this big hoo-ha about mounties not being allowed to wear turbans. So, does this make people who wear turbans any worse of an RCMP officer than those who don't? No, so who gives a crap if they wear a turban? Apparently a lot of people for no apparent reason, which is kind of the same thing I see here. Who gives a crap if they don't pick up people who are carrying liquor?

[ken0042]

However with your RCMP example, you are saying that the turban wearing RCMP member can do the exact same job as the (let's just say) white guy. The fact that the one guy is wearing a different object on his head in no way impacts his duties as a police officer.

In this case, why does one person's rights have priority over mine? I forget how the old saying goes but it's something like "your right to swing your fists in the air ends at my face." Meaning yes you can flail your arms in the air, but not at the expense of somebody else's rights.

As for who cares, how about those of us who often purchase alcohol?

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by ken0042

However with your RCMP example, you are saying that the turban wearing RCMP member can do the exact same job as the (let's just say) white guy. The fact that the one guy is wearing a different object on his head in no way impacts his duties as a police officer

Not true. A person with a turban can do more. For instance, they can be a mop.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by ken0042

In this case, why does one person's rights have priority over mine? I forget how the old saying goes but it's something like "your right to swing your fists in the air ends at my face." Meaning yes you can flail your arms in the air, but not at the expense of somebody else's rights.

As for who cares, how about those of us who often purchase alcohol?

Um... I don't think taxi service is a right guaranteed in the Constitution. They as private businessmen have the right to refuse service to anyone, save based on race, age, sex, etc... I don't believe that refusing to have someone carry alcohol into your business is a violation of a right.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Red Mile Style

Why would anybody in their right mind purposely be racist when it would clearly affect them financially? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

You need to learn how to be tolerant, tolerant to other people's religions, morals, races, etc... Not every Christian is white, and you're completely assuming that absolutely no Muslim is white. Your arguments are just showing out how blatently discrimatory you are.

You are so far out to lunch it is unbelievable. No where.....I mean no where did I even come close to saying or implying that all Christians are white and no Muslims are white. The point that you cannot get is that if a white christian decided to come out with some stupid ass policy like this there would be a total out cry about Racism. Just like the Muslims did with the pope.

As far your mumble jumble about racism and profits......

People couldn't give two ****s about money when it comes to racism>>>>

You think people won;t be racist if they are going to make money???? This statement alone shows how completely out to lunch you are.

I will tell you what.....you go talk to the people of Britian and see how they feel about their country now. Come talk to me after that.

[ken0042]

Good point Sowa. However to be a taxi driver requires a license from the city (at least in Calgary.) And there is a limited number of licenses available for the protection of the taxi drivers' livelyhood.

Perhaps "right" is a bit strong of a word, but if they want protection from competition, they should also have to follow certain rules. And if one of those rules is "no discrimination based on somebody's legal and non-dangerous cargo" then they should follow it.

At some point we as a society have to say stop. We as Canadians (or in this case Americans) are very accomdating people. But where does it end. Can the garbage man refuse to pick up my garbage because it contains empty liquor bottles and he finds that offensive? Garbage collection is not a "right" either; but it is a government regulated service.

[8 Ball]

Can they refuse me a ride if I had a porkchop for lunch?

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by 8 Ball

Can they refuse me a ride if I had a porkchop for lunch?

I can't see why not if they can refuse you for having consumed alcohol

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

You are so far out to lunch it is unbelievable. No where.....I mean no where did I even come close to saying or implying that all Christians are white and no Muslims are white.

So, I guess you don't remember these posts:

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Exactly

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Can you imagine the out roar if a white Christian decided to do something like this?

I don't think you understand that this has absolutely NOTHING to do with a person's race or ethnicity. It has to do with the cab drivers conflicting moral beliefs with certain passengers. It is against their religion, what exactly are you suggesting? That a law be implemented making their religious beliefs void? How very totalitarian of you.

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

The point that you cannot get is that if a white christian decided to come out with some stupid ass policy like this there would be a total out cry about Racism. Just like the Muslims did with the pope.

You just can't stop making this a racial issue, can you? You just had to add that "white" in there. This is not a racial issue, why can't you seperate the colour of a person's skin and their religion? Muslim cab drivers are not distinguishing between a color of someone's skin, but rather their actions - which is what should be done everywhere. This has absolutely no correlation between the incident with the Pope either. You're categorizing all Muslims under extremist. Following their religious practices and a backlash over what some religious leader said are two completely seperate scenerios.

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

As far your mumble jumble about racism and profits......

People couldn't give two ****s about money when it comes to racism>>>>

You think people won;t be racist if they are going to make money???? This statement alone shows how completely out to lunch you are.

And you still can not distinguish between not allowing people who drink alcohol and a person's race. There is nothing discrimatory about what these cab drivers are doing, there is a lot discrimatory about what you're saying though. To imply that there is some kind of alternative motive for not allowing paying customers into their cabs, is ridiculous. It would not be in their best interest to do this, but what you fail to realize is that some people on this planet have these nifty little things called "morals" that are more important to some than money... obviously not you as you clearly lack in that department.

For the last time, they are not being rascist, they are following their religious beliefs. If a Muslim got into their cab after drinking, chances are they would not let them in (and chances are they would not know if they were muslim or any religion for that matter).

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

I will tell you what.....you go talk to the people of Britian and see how they feel about their country now. Come talk to me after that.

Right, so what the **** does this have to do with anything in this thread? Sure, people in the UK probably racial profile a lot more now. There is a lot more racism and discrimination towards Muslims there now. What are you trying to get at? That all Muslims are like that? The only thing this statement is accomplishing is your evident hatred towards anyone who is different. What about the Oklahoma city bombing, maybe we should all start hating white, Christian males between the ages of 18-35 too...

I think you are now on ignore, people like you just outrage me. Your blatent prejudices are anything but civilized or what living in North America is SUPPOSED to be about. Fine, you hate that you might be discriminated against because you will have a hard time finding a cab in Minniapolis - so now you know how much it outrages you to be judged upon (even though it's based on your actions, not on factors you can not choose) maybe you should stop with the outdated views?

[Vulcan]

This story doesn't ring true. How would the cabbie know what the passenger has in their luggage? I can see the cabbie refusing service if the passenger was so drunk that they didn't zip their suitcase and the liquor fell out. I think some writer has an axe to grind with these Somali's and readers soak it up in these anti-Islamic times.

[badnarik]

the cabbies would be discriminatory by making a choice; however, they would not necessarily be prejudiced unless they are assuming people have alcohol because of the way they look.

if they have regulations on the number of cabs in the city, then the regulations are your real problem.

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

I can't see why not if they can refuse you for having consumed alcohol

You can't see why not because you don't know anything about their religion. I believe it says something along the lines of not being around alcohol and people who have consumed alcohol.

Don't you think it would be better if you learned a little bit about the religion itself BEFORE making your judgements about it?

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by ken0042

However with your RCMP example, you are saying that the turban wearing RCMP member can do the exact same job as the (let's just say) white guy. The fact that the one guy is wearing a different object on his head in no way impacts his duties as a police officer.

In this case, why does one person's rights have priority over mine? I forget how the old saying goes but it's something like "your right to swing your fists in the air ends at my face." Meaning yes you can flail your arms in the air, but not at the expense of somebody else's rights.

As for who cares, how about those of us who often purchase alcohol?

I purchase alcohol much too frequently, and I have felt the pains of trying to catch a cab at 2:00 am on First St. in the middle of winter many a time, but I would rather have cabbies out there taking care of those not drinking so that non-practising Muslims can be freed up to take care of my drunken friends and me.

Personally, I could care less if these cab drivers want to deny fares. If it's wrong to them, I would hate to see how they would drive/interact with their passengers if they could not distinguish between who they should or should not drive. Forcing these people to go against their beliefs doesn't exactly make me feel safe if I got into a cab.

As someone already mentioned, taking a cab is not a right - but practising your religious beliefs is. If some religion had to have human sacrifices, then yes, I can see that as compromising your rights, but a taxi? I don't think so...

Don't get me wrong, I think this situation sucks, especially considering 98% of the time when I take a cab I am intoxicated, but who I am to tell people what religious beliefs they can or can not follow?

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Red Mile Style

You can't see why not because you don't know anything about their religion. I believe it says something along the lines of not being around alcohol and people who have consumed alcohol.

Don't you think it would be better if you learned a little bit about the religion itself BEFORE making your judgements about it?

Yeah, but Muslims don't eat pork either...they were trying to make a point with the porkchop for lunch comment...or maybe you need to learn a bit more about the religion.

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Yeah, but Muslims don't eat pork either...they were trying to make a point with the porkchop for lunch comment...or maybe you need to learn a bit more about the religion.

Really?!?!?! Muslims don't eat pork?!?!?!

<insert DUH emoticon here>

I am pretty sure there are different rules about pork and alcohol. Whereas Muslims are against mind-altering substances, pork is not eaten for different reasons.

I would personally prefer if cabs didn't pick up people who ate pork... serves you right for eating something that lives in it's own feces... gross.

[Red Mile Style]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

This story doesn't ring true. How would the cabbie know what the passenger has in their luggage? I can see the cabbie refusing service if the passenger was so drunk that they didn't zip their suitcase and the liquor fell out. I think some writer has an axe to grind with these Somali's and readers soak it up in these anti-Islamic times.

This makes sense. A way of diverting attention to non-issues.

Hey, who cares about the damage the occupation of Iraq is doing in terms of deaths and the horrendous damage to the economy - Gays are trying to get married!

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

This story doesn't ring true. How would the cabbie know what the passenger has in their luggage? I can see the cabbie refusing service if the passenger was so drunk that they didn't zip their suitcase and the liquor fell out. I think some writer has an axe to grind with these Somali's and readers soak it up in these anti-Islamic times.

Let's all go back to the article.

Most duty free purchases are not in your luggage. You carry your purchase in a plastic bag.

I do not see in the article where cabbies are refusing to transport drunk pasengers.

And clearly the story does ring true, because it is happening in other cities under a "Chapter two".

I see two issues here - the right of the cabbie to refuse service and their desire not to be bumped to the back of the line.

Look at the example the article uses to show how refusal of service is becoming a problem - blind passengers with seeing eye dogs? Or some of our own examples - Black men in NYC or women in short skirts.
I do not think that a member of the Aryan Church could use freedom of religion as a defense against a discrimination charge.
However, could a cabbie refuse service to someone brandishing a gun or knife? I would think that they could out of concern for their own safety.
As a government regulated industry I am sure there are rules in regards to this, and at worst a driver could lose his licence.

Now at the airport, should there be a taxi line for cabbies who will take passengers with alcahol and a line for those who won't? Of course not. If, at the airport, you refuse a passenger for any reason (has alcahol, is only going a short distance, etc.) you go to the back of the line and suffer. Many religiously observant people make sacrifices - I take up to 14 unpaid days leave every year to observe religious holidays - this would have to be one. If it means that the cabbie has to give up taking fares at the airport, then so be it.

ALso, take a moment to think about the other side - A passenger knows that the taxi with the blue light is a new "no alcahol/dogs/short skirts" cab, what if they refuse to take that cab? Will people be calling taxi services and asking for a "non-muslim" cab?

[Frank the Tank]

I wonder if Lenny Kravitz will write a song about this?