[PGT] Avs 4 vs. Av-nots 2

[Rutuu]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

This is a market that has a hard time attracting players. Asking those that have expressed strong desires to be here could make it even harder to attract and keep players

We have a hard time attracting players without paying more. There's a distinction there. Being player friendly hasn't really gotten us anywhere, and it's kind of bs when we let the team facilities sink to bottom of the league, in my opinion negating any goodwill we have built up.

[Rhett44]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

No he said this

“With that said we knew Kadri didnt want to go anywhere and we were told by Craig that he wasn't trading him. What "could" have been will have to remain just that”

When he’s been clear he doesn’t want to go I’m not sure why you ask him to waive. He’s set up roots here. He wants to be here. And there is something to be said for that given the number of players who haven’t wanted to be here. Same with Coleman.

This is a market that has a hard time attracting players. Asking those that have expressed strong desires to be here could make it even harder to attract and keep players

I can definitely see that view point and I appreciate your opinion.

I just see a bit of a different vision for the team than management does. I really think we have one of the least talented rosters in the league, and Wolf has single handedly dragged us to the playoff race.

I just don't see the point in keeping older declining assets if there is a chance to trade them. Kadri, Coleman, Anderrson have all had their moments of great play. It isn't about them being bad, it is about accepting our reality that we should be rebuilding.

And I know we will never rebuild, it's just frustrating as a fan who wants to win the cup and doesn't care about sneaking into the playoffs. I want us to eventually build a contender and im afraid this route is more of the same old Flames.

[Monahammer]

Its not bull#### to want the team to make moves to succeed more in the long run. Holding on to aging players at a critical deadline is pretty self defeating when you could have reaped some value out of them. There is maybe some esoteric value in keeping them to show loyalty, or respect, or whatever. I can't support the notion that they're teaching young guys anything really worth while personally. But it's moot, it's done. We don't need to keep beating it over the head. The deadline has passed.

[Royle9]

This team just isn’t good enough.
They’ve ridden a hot goalie all year long and he’s the ONLY reason the Flames are where they are. It’s simply not sustainable and Pinders been catching #### for this all year.

Without Wolf they are bottom 5 which is on par for where the hockey minds had the flames pegged this year. No firepower, no superstars, just a bunch of hard working guys and some young up and coming guys who have helped propel this team into a spot at times too.

The north/south system has to be dropped ASAP if they hope to make a push here, the team isn’t strong enough on the forecheck nor fast enough to drive the corners and retrieve pucks. How many times a night do you see them shoot it in from the blue line but never make it in fast enough to get pressure/possession? I’d say at least 85% minimum.

The team has a ton of forwards who excel at east/west lateral play making, most notably Huberdeau and Frost and when they get the rare chance to use it, it’s very effective. But for some reason the system much like Daryl’s is solely based on getting pucks deep… see point 1 on why this is ineffective.

This further reinforces how much Wolf deserves the Calder, he’s single handily dragging a team who has no reason to be there into a playoff spot. The goal differential alone is laughable, and their special teams equally so.

Honest question: When is the last time the Flames had a STRONG powerplay? Like top 5 in the league strong? How on earth can we not find a coach to help with this…

I’m trying so hard to be optimistic, I really am.
However losing our 1st round pick to either squeak in or narrowly miss just screams typical flames for me. More of the same mediocre play with no chance at drafting those superstars in the first few picks.

I’m not sure I want Huska here when Zayne comes up, his system just saps the creativity out of guys.

[flambers]

If they find a way to back into a wild card spot,

It will be a quick dismal,

I get the Flames, have to play this style, however yesterday's game. Flames were really lucky they were still in the game,

Ava's should have won, by a much larger score....

Road trip could be interesting,

[Toonage]

I saw the Huska hire as him being the guy to get this team through the rebuild and bring along the kids into the NHL. When the team was ready to compete he’d likely be moved out for a more experienced coach. Though with the Flames who knows who’d that be.

I wonder if Wolf’s progression has inadvertently fast tracked everything. And yeah when Parekh shows up next year maybe that speeds it up more. And they’ll also be dipping into free agency with their available cap space.

Point being I do wonder if next season is the last for Huska even though the plan was probably for 5 seasons or more.

[Paulie Walnuts]

The mandate is to squeak in from up top. Huska is coaching the team to keep his job.

The year should have been about installing a system the team can grow with and developing guys. Instead we want to grit and grind our way into a wc2 spot so we can get swept in round 1.

Retooling the team is going to be a huge face plant when you have nothing to retool around. We don’t have a Crosby, MacKinnon etc to retool around.

It is what is at this point. With Edwards here we will never rebuild the team.

They called up Hunt ffs.

[Ped]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Hunt is outscoring Kerins

Sure, but one is 29 years old, the other is 22. Should the Flames have traded for Andrew Poturalski, Chris Terry, Matej Blumel, or Matthew Peca? They're all outscoring Kerins too.


Dryden Hunt has always been fairly productive at the AHL level. At the NHL level, not so much.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

So, what exactly was the point of not trading Anderssen, Kadri and Coleman?

To give us a chance at a Stanley Cup push? With this roster?

It's cool that you're flipping the same argument to things that no longer can be done instead of things unlikely to be done.

Fresh.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Hunt had a breakaway chance and a couple of hits, but also was late out to Lindgren on his seeing eye screen shot goal.

Rooney is...what it is at this point. He's at least a decent penalty killer. Been doing a pretty good job of that lately.

Lomberg had some time with two skill guys and the puck just died on his stick every time. Didn't even bring the energy or fire tonight.

Klapka has a glimpse now an then, but is always skating at least a step or two behind, and is thinking the game 2-3 steps behind, especially defensively.

Really growing to dislike Miromanov. The first Parker goal happens because he pretends he is a forward and is down below the offensive zone faceoff dot, forcing Huberdeau to cover his position. Not only does he not get back in time to help Huberdeau, but Jake Bean was doing...whatever the #### he was doing. When Huberdeau is the last man back covering defensively, you have to openly question just what the #### the decision making was for the two defensemen leading up to that unfortunate bounce.

Hanley is a gamer. He's not highly skilled but he plays a smart game and contributes positive minutes throughout. He made one bad play to go for the big hit and then was out of position on Parker's 2nd goal. Not someone you typically see out of position.

Let's be honest, the way Backlund, Zary, and Pachal have played of late, it's not like most of those players were a significant downgrade in replacing them. It's a team full of 3rd and 4th liners or AHL tweeners, with a few 2nd line players. Swapping out a 3rd or 4th liner for a 4th liner or tweener isn't a big difference.

Still, they have to find ways to score if they're serious about making the playoffs. There's no way the make it scoring 2 goals a game.

Yeah I don't think the difference last night was shiny AHLers.

The Flames are thin in offensive talent, and lost a key piece to keep games low scoring.

There isn't any ready made forward sitting on the farm that would have changed last night's outcome.

[Enoch Root]

Now that the Avs are getting goaltending, I think they are the best team in the league.

WPG, DAL, COL.. the cup will be decided in the Central

[Enoch Root]

I thought the Flames gave a really good effort actually. If not for that play behind the net and the puck coming out front to set up the 3rd goal, I honestly think the Flames would have come back and won that - or (more likely) lost in OT.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Royle9

This team just isn’t good enough.
They’ve ridden a hot goalie all year long and he’s the ONLY reason the Flames are where they are. It’s simply not sustainable and Pinders been catching #### for this all year.

Without Wolf they are bottom 5 which is on par for where the hockey minds had the flames pegged this year. No firepower, no superstars, just a bunch of hard working guys and some young up and coming guys who have helped propel this team into a spot at times too.

The north/south system has to be dropped ASAP if they hope to make a push here, the team isn’t strong enough on the forecheck nor fast enough to drive the corners and retrieve pucks. How many times a night do you see them shoot it in from the blue line but never make it in fast enough to get pressure/possession? I’d say at least 85% minimum.

The team has a ton of forwards who excel at east/west lateral play making, most notably Huberdeau and Frost and when they get the rare chance to use it, it’s very effective. But for some reason the system much like Daryl’s is solely based on getting pucks deep… see point 1 on why this is ineffective.

This further reinforces how much Wolf deserves the Calder, he’s single handily dragging a team who has no reason to be there into a playoff spot. The goal differential alone is laughable, and their special teams equally so.

Honest question: When is the last time the Flames had a STRONG powerplay? Like top 5 in the league strong? How on earth can we not find a coach to help with this…

I’m trying so hard to be optimistic, I really am.
However losing our 1st round pick to either squeak in or narrowly miss just screams typical flames for me. More of the same mediocre play with no chance at drafting those superstars in the first few picks.

I’m not sure I want Huska here when Zayne comes up, his system just saps the creativity out of guys.

If I could thank this post multiple times I would. Well said!

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Rutuu

We have a hard time attracting players without paying more. There's a distinction there. Being player friendly hasn't really gotten us anywhere, and it's kind of bs when we let the team facilities sink to bottom of the league, in my opinion negating any goodwill we have built up.

Jiri is right that Flames’ management have to be conscious of the market and its place in the league pecking order. But I agree with you that ownership haven’t really done their part in making Calgary the most attractive destination.

A couple years ago, the Athletic’s staff did a ranking/draft of NHL franchises. The interesting thing about it is the on-ice product was only part of the exercise. The elements they assessed and ranked were:

* Market
* Ownership
* Management
* Star player

No surprise, the Flames finished around 25th in most desirable market. Can’t do much about that. More concerning is they finished bottom-third in ownership. That just compounds the structural handicap the franchise faces.

Maybe things will turn around with the new arena. But the fact it’s going to open about a decade later than it should because of Edwards’ big-dog shenanigans has already hurt the franchise. Then there’s the word you hear that the team skimps on off-ice resources and facilities.

So yeah, owing to the market management has to try to be team-friendly to the on-ice talent. But ownership hasn’t held up its end of the deal.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Agreed. And that still means that the Flames need to try and play any advantage they have. So small things like Conroy flying out to get Farabee an Frost matter. Other players pay attention. I think Conroy, and his personality, is something that can work in their favor.

Similarly, the stuff that happened last year with Markstrom won't help. So I'm sure they were trying to avoid anything like that with Kadri.

Again, he's a guy that
- Signed here
- Moved his extended family here
- Has stated, with clarity, he doesn't want to be traded.

So going to him and asking him to waive - isn't a good look.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Agreed. And that still means that the Flames need to try and play any advantage they have. So small things like Conroy flying out to get Farabee an Frost matter. Other players pay attention. I think Conroy, and his personality, is something that can work in their favor.

Similarly, the stuff that happened last year with Markstrom won't help. So I'm sure they were trying to avoid anything like that with Kadri.

Again, he's a guy that
- Signed here
- Moved his extended family here
- Has stated, with clarity, he doesn't want to be traded.

So going to him and asking him to waive - isn't a good look.

I've always assumed that those that see things like this as black and white would find they'd be very much a shade of grey if they actually had the job.

Trade all the veterans. Don't trade any of them.

There are so many variables in play.

But I get it ... fans are fans. They get to argue about details, it's fun.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Jiri is right that Flames’ management have to be conscious of the market and its place in the league pecking order. But I agree with you that ownership haven’t really done their part in making Calgary the most attractive destination.

A couple years ago, the Athletic’s staff did a ranking/draft of NHL franchises. The interesting thing about it is the on-ice product was only part of the exercise. The elements they assessed and ranked were:

* Market
* Ownership
* Management
* Star player

No surprise, the Flames finished around 25th in most desirable market. Can’t do much about that. More concerning is they finished bottom-third in ownership. That just compounds the structural handicap the franchise faces.

Maybe things will turn around with the new arena. But the fact it’s going to open about a decade later than it should because of Edwards’ big-dog shenanigans has already hurt the franchise. Then there’s the word you hear that the team skimps on off-ice resources and facilities.

So yeah, owing to the market management has to try to be team-friendly to the on-ice talent. But ownership hasn’t held up its end of the deal.

Stampeders graded out last in the CFL this season on the CFLPA report card getting low grades for skimping on quality of meals, medical staff, and family treatment, etc. If you follow the tea leaves it leads to one man at the top and the way he runs his businesses. Based on geography alone, the Flames have an uphill battle competing against big market teams but when you throw in a reputation of frugalness, it becomes that much more difficult for Conroy to sell Calgary to big name players.

[Goriders]

Oh well. Need 10 wins. Better start soon.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Stampeders graded out last in the CFL this season on the CFLPA report card getting low grades for skimping on quality of meals, medical staff, and family treatment, etc. If you follow the tea leaves it leads to one man at the top and the way he runs his businesses. Based on geography alone, the Flames have an uphill battle competing against big market teams but when you throw in a reputation of frugalness, it becomes that much more difficult for Conroy to sell Calgary to big name players.

Or he has a ranking in sports franchises between ones that make money and ones that don't?

The CFL has fallen on bad times. They can't make a new building work, and I don't blame the city for not wanting to build one.

The Stamps may be well down the list in budget split now.

[Finger Cookin]

Losing Backlund and Zary from a thin top 9 group, games are going to be rough. Even once Zary returns, even if Backlund returns before the end of the season.

The kids on the team are learning that NHL hockey in March is not that same as it is in November or December. They need these reps and tough games to take that away and prepare for the tough sledding in future seasons. Because it will only get tougher as they progress into April, May, and with any luck June down the road.

But it's a good thing we don't only have kids on the roster right now. Wolf is one we have that's a game changer, but the others are not there yet or here on the roster yet.

Last 7 games:
Weegar 1 G 6A
Huberdeau 3 G 3A
Kadri 3 G 2 A

7 of our 15 goals in the last 7 from players "on the wrong side of 30". Glad we have some vets to help navigate the stretch to the end of the season.