“Dismantle the Police” politician attacked

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Minneapolis proposal was to dissolve the police department. Other campaigns called for funding cuts. Or to abolish the police altogether.

This notion that nobody really wanted to defund the police is gaslighting.

Are you implying that I suggested no one wanted to defund the police? Because that would be gaslighting.

Keep practicing cliff.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by btimbit

You guys are also vastly overestimating the danger. I don't get to carry a weapon and deal with these people daily, and pretty sure the times I've been killed to death is zero

This (if we’re to believe you’re actually alive) + the fact that police officers themselves agree there are elements of their job that are better handled by social workers, mediators, psychologists, whatever.

It’s kind of corny to pretend that moving funding toward a more context-appropriate way of dealing with issues of the public means less officers on the street. It’s literally the opposite, police will be able to police.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

This (if we’re to believe you’re actually alive) + the fact that police officers themselves agree there are elements of their job that are better handled by social workers, mediators, psychologists, whatever.

It’s kind of corny to pretend that moving funding toward a more context-appropriate way of dealing with issues of the public means less officers on the street. It’s literally the opposite, police will be able to police.

Exactly. This would actually free the police up to deal with actual crime rather than playing social worker

[Locke]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Look no further than medics too. They run into these situations alone all the time, very, very rare that they get attacked.

If someone calls for EMS they want and need help.

Police is a whole other thing.

[PepsiFree]

The public, in general, is probably wildly ignorant to how many other professions deal on their own with dangerous situations people would automatically associate with police, and how often the police deal with situations completely outside their education and ability.

But suggest fixing that?

“We’ll see how bad you want the police defunded when yer house gets robbed and nobody comes to help!” Like, honestly, how stupid.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Locke

If someone calls for EMS they want and need help.

Police is a whole other thing.

In most cases in these situations it's usually a third party that calls for EMS, bystanders or passerbys, most of the time the people in danger don't even want them there

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by btimbit

The abolish the police movement definitely exists, and is BS, but that's very different from the defund the police movement.

At the height of the movements’ popularities, the loudest proponents of each were virtually indistinguishable from each other. It’s hard to come back from being associated with a bunch of nutbars when you looked and sounded the same to most people. That’s the ‘toxic’ element that has derailed the movement politically.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Locke

Yeah. And you dont know any of that is true until you actually get there.

What kinds of questions do you think emergency operators ask when they take these calls?

I wouldnt go.

I’m not surprised by this revelation.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I’m not surprised by this revelation.

In Locke’s defense, the solution to “hey, we need to calm these people down” is typically not “let’s get their income tax guy over here, that’ll bring down their blood pressure”.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

At the height of the movements’ popularities, the loudest proponents of each were virtually indistinguishable from each other. It’s hard to come back from being associated with a bunch of nutbars when you looked and sounded the same to most people. That’s the ‘toxic’ element that has derailed the movement politically.

Absolutely. The 'whoever shouts loudest wins' approach will never work, just tunes people out

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

In Locke’s defense, the solution to “hey, we need to calm these people down” is typically not “let’s get their income tax guy over here, that’ll bring down their blood pressure”.

What if an audit is what’s causing their distress?

[PepsiFree]

At the same time, the movement was at it’s peak emotionally because of highly publicized incidents of police killing citizens, so you can probably forgive them for not treading more carefully.

[TorqueDog]

The kind of ‘audit’ causing a domestic is usually of someone’s naughty text messages to the neighbour, so again, Locke’s out.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

At the same time, the movement was at it’s peak emotionally because of highly publicized incidents of police killing citizens, so you can probably forgive them for not treading more carefully.

Of course, especially in Minneapolis. Doesn’t mean the damage isn’t done, unfortunately.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

What kinds of questions do you think emergency operators ask when they take these calls?

STOP ASKING SO MANY STUPID QUESTIONS I"LL TALK TO THE PO-PO WHEN THEY GET HERE FOR #####'S SAKE WHY AREN'T THEY HERE YET JUST SEND THE #####ING COPS! *Click*

<.< >.>

FWIW, I've long been on the 'defund' train. Police do way too much because they are a 24/7 service. I'd love to be able to tell more folks "Police don't deal with those matters, please hold while I transfer you to 'different dept'.

Our 211 initiative for mental health has been showing some good dividends so far, too.

https://newsroom.calgary.ca/call-div...iative-update/

[81MC]

Originally Posted by Locke

If someone calls for EMS they want and need help.

Police is a whole other thing.

I think this is pretty damn relevant.

EMS, even if you don’t want them there, are only going to do some much and usually it’s aid.

Cops? Maybe they’re going to confiscate your obviously stolen goods, or make you move from the doorway of the business you’re ####ing over, or maybe they’re about to arrest you on an outstanding warrant, or you’re a suspect in a crime, or you’re getting a fine or something.

I sure as hell don’t mean to discredit the #### our very valuable EMTs do. But I honestly think a cop is far more likely to be immediately met with hostility than them.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by 81MC

I think this is pretty damn relevant.

EMS, even if you don’t want them there, are only going to do some much and usually it’s aid.

Cops? Maybe they’re going to confiscate your obviously stolen goods, or make you move from the doorway of the business you’re ####ing over, or maybe they’re about to arrest you on an outstanding warrant, or you’re a suspect in a crime, or you’re getting a fine or something.

I sure as hell don’t mean to discredit the #### our very valuable EMTs do. But I honestly think a cop is far more likely to be immediately met with hostility than them.

That was my point though, medics don't get attacked because they're viewed as being there to help. People view the police as there to 'get' them, so if a situation doesn't call for that, why not have social workers or other community assistance teams respond instead. The "Well they'd just get attacked too" argument doesn't work for me because I deal with these situations every day, and that's just not what happens.

[Zulu29]

Well, well from what I’ve observed the last several years EHS, bylaws and Fire will often “stage” near a call for service they’ve received and will not approach without police if it involves someone on drugs/homeless/etc. Can’t say I blame them but it really does drain police resources.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Zulu29

Well, well from what I’ve observed the last several years EHS, bylaws and Fire will often “stage” near a call for service they’ve received and will not approach without police if it involves someone on drugs/homeless/etc. Can’t say I blame them but it really does drain police resources.

We only do that if the call indicated there's visible weapons present

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by btimbit

We only do that if the call indicated there's visible weapons present

That makes a sense. Wish that was the case here.

[Harry Lime]

De-fund was always a branding nightmare. De-militarize would be a better way to go, especially in the States.