As an Albertan, would you EVER support seperation from Canada?

[Resolute 14]

Except Alberta isnt an important fish in Canada.

We're like the divorced dad paying child suppport. We have no rights, but long as we keep paying, we'll be somewhat left alone.

Miss one payment, however, and lord help us.

[Cowperson]

As The Economist said last week, this country is damned fine and Canadians are generally pretty damned cool but this swell place is in danger of being ripped apart by stagnant, disfunctional politics.

A few years ago, a guy like me would have scoffed at the notion of Alberta separating. Nowadays, guys like me are giving it serious thought. The Economist was talking about a guy like me.

Cowperson

[KipperIsGod]

The only thing I like about Canada is our hockey team..but besides that, dont really care. I say we should seperate.

[Flame On]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

As The Economist said last week, this country is damned fine and Canadians are generally pretty damned cool but this swell place is in danger of being ripped apart by stagnant, disfunctional politics.

A few years ago, a guy like me would have scoffed at the notion of Alberta separating. Nowadays, guys like me are giving it serious thought. The Economist was talking about a guy like me.

Cowperson

Seems a little vague and fence sittie to me CP. You'd consider it, isn't that what everyone here is being asked to do in this thread?

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Shawnski

Nice...

If I had used that same set of words with any minority candidate, or Svend Robinson, or Brison, or any lady candidate, would I not be absolutely flamed here?

No, not at all...... but let it be a white male candidate for PM from the CPC.... and that is OK....

Disgusting.

Give it a rest Shawnski. You know very well that this type of talk goes both ways all the time yet you only jump out and point it out when it's against your beloved CP party. Where are you when people are calling the left wing parties communists? You seem to have no problem with that.
And your little story illustrating welfare recipiants as lazy, and immagrants as drug dealers was quite classy too.

Don't act high and mighty, like you're above that kind of comment.

[Igottago]

This is ludicrous...the liberal party has devestated Albertans enough to want to seperate from the country? Are you freakin' kidding me? And then we'll have our own olympic teams too, like Quebec? Sure, there are regional differences in Canada, but they have always been, and can still be worked out to maintain the federal identity of Canada. I mean really, have your lives been so handicapped by being part of Canada, and under the liberal government? Separation is a pretty extreme reaction...things in Alberta must be really ****ty for a lot of us to want to do that. Unbelievable.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

You're gonna have a real hard time proving that.

Albertans for the most part have no problems with immigrants... if they work hard and add something to the country, like they are supposed to. The ones that live off the system are the ones that draw ire. I'm a "true" Albertan (little bit of a redneck sometimes too..) and many of my friends are Asian and Brown, and none of them have ever faced any racism cause of their color that they have disclosed in any conversation on the topic.

I mean, complaining about Asian drivers or joking about cabbies being predominantly brown is far from racism if thats what you're getting at.

They have never experienced any racism, or never told you about it? I know this is getting off topic, but there's plenty of racism in our city. I'm a born and raised Calgarian, but I've certainly experienced my fair share of racism in this city that I don't feel when I travel to larger, more metropolitan cities.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Igottago

This is ludicrous...the liberal party has devestated Albertans enough to want to seperate from the country? Are you freakin' kidding me? And then we'll have our own olympic teams too, like Quebec? Sure, there are regional differences in Canada, but they have always been, and can still be worked out to maintain the federal identity of Canada. I mean really, have your lives been so handicapped by being part of Canada, and under the liberal government? Separation is a pretty extreme reaction...things in Alberta must be really ****ty for a lot of us to want to do that. Unbelievable.

Ok, lets work out our differences. You go call up Ontario, Quebec and Ottawa and tell them that we have grievances and wish to rectify them. See how far that gets you.

Whether it actually comes to seperation or not, the only way the imbalances within this nation are going to be addressed is if Alberta starts to fight. As ridiculous as Duceppe and the BQ are, a similar effort from an Alberta based provincial party might help pressure the rest of Canada into considering changes.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Igottago

This is ludicrous...the liberal party has devestated Albertans enough to want to seperate from the country? Are you freakin' kidding me? And then we'll have our own olympic teams too, like Quebec? Sure, there are regional differences in Canada, but they have always been, and can still be worked out to maintain the federal identity of Canada. I mean really, have your lives been so handicapped by being part of Canada, and under the liberal government? Separation is a pretty extreme reaction...things in Alberta must be really ****ty for a lot of us to want to do that. Unbelievable.

The Politics and the way they do business in this country HAVE to change. Period.

There are far too many regional interests in this country, and there seems to not even be an effort to try to hold this country together.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Snakeeye

Ok, lets work out our differences. You go call up Ontario, Quebec and Ottawa and tell them that we have grievances and wish to rectify them. See how far that gets you.

Whether it actually comes to seperation or not, the only way the imbalances within this nation are going to be addressed is if Alberta starts to fight. As ridiculous as Duceppe and the BQ are, a similar effort from an Alberta based provincial party might help pressure the rest of Canada into considering changes.

Well, you need the right political voice...not the conservatives as they are right now. The rest of Canada think's we're backwards hicks because of the conservative party and the somewhat ignorant element that can be found within....we're not going to win any hearts, or seats for that matter out east, with this crappy party as our representation. But hey, maybe it's an accurate representation? I wouldn't want to listen to us either...elect/form a realistic party, with a more modern and tolerant vision, and more professional/capable leadership, and the west shall recieve at least some more influence in parliament. You know, I don't totally disagree with some of reforms that should be made(the senate for example). But some of the socially backwards crap that seems to eminate from Alberta's party of choice will never get my vote. And this us vs them attitude perpetuates the problem.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

They have never experienced any racism, or never told you about it? I know this is getting off topic, but there's plenty of racism in our city. I'm a born and raised Calgarian, but I've certainly experienced my fair share of racism in this city that I don't feel when I travel to larger, more metropolitan cities.

My goodness....well if YOU say so...

Racism is not a soully Albertan trait no matter how "cosmopolitan" you consider the rest of the country is. It certainly IS NOT more prevalent here than the rest of the country. Is it more probable that since you live(have lived) in Calgary longer you met up with it more? Or possibly habit areas where it would be more prevalent? Areas that you wouldn't visit in another city?

It wouldn't take very long living in Montreal to learn the french word for nggr! "We don't run after nggrs" Montreal cop prior to shooting a black man in the back.

[Thunderball]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

They have never experienced any racism, or never told you about it? I know this is getting off topic, but there's plenty of racism in our city. I'm a born and raised Calgarian, but I've certainly experienced my fair share of racism in this city that I don't feel when I travel to larger, more metropolitan cities.

This might sound petty, but the only racism I've seen is against myself by our own "fair system". I'm a white, english speaking, middle class male. I've been denied federal scholarships, despite more than adequate grades cause I don't speak french or I'm not status first nation, I've been denied jobs cause I'm not an ethnic minority, I've been searched by customs because I "can't take them to court for racial profiling", and so on...

There's racism everywhere, and maybe you don't feel it while travelling, cause you're there for a short period of time, while you live here, giving you a much wider frame of reference. Think its bad here... try being a black man in the Southern US, or a blonde woman in Mexico and Latin America.

[Hakan]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

This might sound petty, but the only racism I've seen is against myself by our own "fair system". I'm a white, english speaking, middle class male. I've been denied federal scholarships, despite more than adequate grades cause I don't speak french or I'm not status first nation, I've been denied jobs cause I'm not an ethnic minority, I've been searched by customs because I "can't take them to court for racial profiling", and so on...

There's racism everywhere, and maybe you don't feel it while travelling, cause you're there for a short period of time, while you live here, giving you a much wider frame of reference. Think its bad here... try being a black man in the Southern US, or a blonde woman in Mexico and Latin America.

Spare me the self righteousness. In fact this post makes me sick. Equating your 'white man's burden' with the real hardships that many aboriginal and immigrant people face is just plain sickening.

Get a grip. Read a book on racism before you litter this board with your bile.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

This might sound petty, but the only racism I've seen is against myself by our own "fair system". I'm a white, english speaking, middle class male. I've been denied federal scholarships, despite more than adequate grades cause I don't speak french

It doesn't just sound petty.

Maybe you should have learned another language if the scholarships didn't come your way. The person that got your scholarship obviously did.

[Shawnski]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Give it a rest Shawnski.

No thanks.

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Where are you when people are calling the left wing parties communists?

Was I one of them? How does that even remotely compare to "disgusting pig of a man"? Or are you saying that if I think you are "left wing", I can substitute "disgusting pig" instead without any recourse? Hmmm? That OK by you?

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

And your little story illustrating welfare recipiants as lazy, and immagrants as drug dealers was quite classy too.

That "little story" was about an ant and a grasshopper. One of many emails "jokes" I get on a daily basis that I simply copied for everyone. How YOU interpret it is another matter.

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Don't act high and mighty, like you're above that kind of comment.

Put me on ignore if you like. I wasn't even responding to YOU anyway. And next time you think it worthy of jumping into something that doesn't involve you, don't bother, I won't hear you.

Have a nice day.

[shoestring]

Not wanting to get into this mudslinging but as I have stated before
put Cascadia in front of me and I am outahere.
BC,Alberta,Washington,Idaho, Montana and Alaska maybe Sask and Oregon.

Till then it is pretty tough task to leave as a single entity/province.
20 -30 years from now it could be happening,even in America.

I would support seperating if we had even more than Quebec has now.
But we as a province have much less. Our infastructure is minute compared to Quebecs, they have controlled many Fed intiatives for decades.
Pension,kids,municipalties,trade, etc and on and on.
Quebec shouldn't seperate just like we shouldn't think about it.
But if a governing body makes it harder to placate it's own citizens you have to look at being your own governing body.

Whatever Alberta is fortunate to do,let's drag Sask along.

While I am stating political bullcrap; Alberta should invest all that extra dough into water. As it comes out of our mountains virtual pure, we should learn how to maintain that purity right into sask and beyond. Become the number one R and D fellers in the world for and about water.Huge industry now and bigger fifty years from now. and We are working right from a source.

[Flame On]

Pig pig pig, man man man, Harper Harper Harper
:baby:

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Flame On

Seems a little vague and fence sittie to me CP. You'd consider it, isn't that what everyone here is being asked to do in this thread?

You're missing the point . . . . its a significant change, movement, that a common, average, Albertan joe like myself would even give it serious thought. You're seeing that trend in the polls as well.

Cowperson

[Shin Pad]

I've wanted Alberta to separate ever since the days Trudeau introduced the NEP, and more so now than ever. I hope the Liberals do get in - it will fan the flames for separatism here even more, and we may finally do it.

Right now, our votes here in Alberta don't mean anything. The Liberal government in Ottawa is totally corrupt, and the "cattle" down east are going to elect them again - it just makes me sick. Separation is the answer - the sooner the better.

[Thunderball]

Originally Posted by Hakan

Spare me the self righteousness. In fact this post makes me sick. Equating your 'white man's burden' with the real hardships that many aboriginal and immigrant people face is just plain sickening.

Get a grip. Read a book on racism before you litter this board with your bile.

Spare me your self-righteousness. Just because it serves a purpose doesn't mean its racism. Look up the definition. Getting advantages or disadvantages only because of the colour of your skin is racial discrimination. I don't think I'm hard done by, but those things are examples of institutional racism. I know a hell of a lot more about racism than you. You're probably one of those people who gets their hair up anytime someone makes a comment about a visible minority, but still makes comments about Americans being rednecks, warmongers and other forms of stereotypical, racist comments.

Oh, and Rouge... I do speak another language. Its not french, so it doesn't really help.