Calgary Flames All Time Roster - #1 Center

[MrMike]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Are we looking at this as the four best, like if we were building an all-star team? Or the four best in terms of role?

I like Monahan, but if we are protecting a lead late in the game and want to put a center out there to try and pin the players in their zone, block shots, and wear down the opponent, I would prefer to have Otto, Conroy, or even Yelle on the ice.

All star best of the best. We aren't coaching looking for a shut down line late in the game. This is a favourite or best or whatever make you pick them.

That is up to you man. Pick who you want.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by troutman

Joe held out on the team too.

Didn’t quit in the middle of the season while under contract

[FireGilbert]

^Yeah I’m picking best of best. Nothing wrong with liking a defensive player but I want the best offensive players on a best of team.

I’d also have the same philosophy picking an all star or national team. You can always coach skilled players to play defence but you can’t teach defensive players to be skilled.

[Eric Vail]

Originally Posted by troutman

Joe held out on the team too.

I understood Gilmour's quitting on the Flames more than Joe's. Gilmour looked up in the stands and saw the Flames ownership wining and dining the arbitrator the night before the event that ruled in the Flames favour. That would make me bitter against the organization too.

Nieuwendyk held out on the Flames purely for money at a time the Flames were desperate for what he could give them.

I loved Nieuwendyk when he played for the Flames, but I hated how he gave up on the team.

When it comes to contributions to the cup, Gilmour was on the first line with Mullen and Patterson. They were excellent defensive players and one of the best lines in the NHL. Nieuwendyk was not as good defensively, and while he could provide offense, he could also be shut down. Gilmour scored 22 points in 22 games and was a +12, leading the Flames. Nieuwendyk scored 14 points and was a zero in +/-, only three Flames were worse.

Gilmour was the best two way centre the Flames have seen and the best overall centre as he was outstanding at both ends.

Maybe many don't like Gilmour because he allegedly had sex with his underage babysitter in St. Louis. That would be a good reason not to vote for him.

[Sandman]

Jeff Shantz.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

I understood Gilmour's quitting on the Flames more than Joe's. Gilmour looked up in the stands and saw the Flames ownership wining and dining the arbitrator the night before the event that ruled in the Flames favour. That would make me bitter against the organization too.

Nieuwendyk held out on the Flames purely for money at a time the Flames were desperate for what he could give them.

I loved Nieuwendyk when he played for the Flames, but I hated how he gave up on the team.

When it comes to contributions to the cup, Gilmour was on the first line with Mullen and Patterson. They were excellent defensive players and one of the best lines in the NHL. Nieuwendyk was not as good defensively, and while he could provide offense, he could also be shut down. Gilmour scored 22 points in 22 games and was a +12, leading the Flames. Nieuwendyk scored 14 points and was a zero in +/-, only three Flames were worse.

Gilmour was the best two way centre the Flames have seen and the best overall centre as he was outstanding at both ends.

Maybe many don't like Gilmour because he allegedly had sex with his underage babysitter in St. Louis. That would be a good reason not to vote for him.

Eh?

The Flames offered $400,000, Gilmour asked for $700,000 and the arbitrator awarded the feisty forward $625,000.

Gilmour quit on the team in the middle of the season and threatened to go play for the national team...literally went to the dome early in the morning and grabbed his gear to do so.

[Sainters7]

Originally Posted by Leeman4Gilmour

Gilmour will get my vote to be on the all time roster (not ahead of Nilsson), but my problem with him is I think of him more as a Leaf than a Flame.

Yeah, but I think that also has a lot to do with the Toronto-dominated CBC narrative, and the excitement from their 1st 2 true playoff runs in forever under him. For Calgarians, he scored the Stanley Cup winning goal - and the empty netter to seal it - in our (and his) only Cup win.

In early quarantine when CBC was re-airing all the classics, they had some from that 89 playoff run, he was our best forward in some of those games. I deff see him as a Flame as well as a Leaf.

[united]

For me it's all about the players who do the most to help you win regardless of offensive talent or lack of. All that matters is effectively outscoring the opposition. Those are the best players.

How they get there holds no relevance. Being effective is being effective. Do so via pure skill run-and-gun offence? Great. Do so by grinding and shutting down the other team? Great. Net contribution at both ends of the rink is equally valuable, but pure points with forwards is focused on so much by the casual media.

At the end of the season, a line that puts up a big flashy 100-goal number but also gives up 100 goals gets the individual plaudits and media attention but ends up watching the final four from the couch, whereas the line that sacrifices some offence in order to play a complete game and scores 80 goals but gives up 50 is probably in the hunt for the ultimate prize while being largely ignored by the media. All things equal I go with the more skilled, higher event player, absolutely, but the defensive aspect is oddly overlooked.

I often wonder just how much the ultimate team-first guys like Bergeron and Kopitar as two examples (and many before them) give up in the way of pure offensive numbers over their careers as a whole by playing a complete game. 10 points a season? 20? Very difficult to quantify, but it's a big number. In the end they get their credit when their teams inevitably experience success to the surprise of the points-focused media. Meanwhile guys like Draisaitl who only care only about inflating their individual numbers despite playing even hockey, costing themselves any hope of team success, are all the media can talk about. Bizarre game.

[mennoknight]

1) Gilmour
2) Nieuwendyk
3) Nilsson
4) Otto

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by CSharp

Or overrated. The problem with Kent Nilsson was that he was truly talented. However, he never panned out for the Flames or the North Stars until he went to the Oilers playing with superstars. He never really showed up for the Flames when it counted. Maybe being dubbed as the Magic Man, he made himself disappear and appear as necessary.

He definitely wasn't a leader come playoff time, but his two Calgary playoffs that made it beyond a round were similar to his time in Edmonton when it came to points per game, and standing within each team's playoff leaders.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by FireGilbert

^Yeah I’m picking best of best. Nothing wrong with liking a defensive player but I want the best offensive players on a best of team.

I’d also have the same philosophy picking an all star or national team. You can always coach skilled players to play defence but you can’t teach defensive players to be skilled.

Pretty hard to get pure offensive players to play defense well though, you need to have a balance.

If I had to choose between Sundin or Bergeron it's a pretty easy decision.

[EastCoastFlamesFan]

Wow. Thought this would be a lot closer. I voted Killer but am not upset with Nieuwy as 1C and Killer as 2C. 3C and 4C will be fun.

[looooob]

Originally Posted by EastCoastFlamesFan

Wow. Thought this would be a lot closer. I voted Killer but am not upset with Nieuwy as 1C and Killer as 2C. 3C and 4C will be fun.

I think the outcome is pretty reasonable. you can debate the merits of either player but given that Nieuwendyk had essentially twice the number of GP and Points I think this seems fair


a totally different poll (which would be fun) is to do the same exercise but just using a players peak best season on the team

[Eric Vail]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Eh?



Gilmour quit on the team in the middle of the season and threatened to go play for the national team...literally went to the dome early in the morning and grabbed his gear to do so.

An off-season salary dispute with Flames' general manager Doug Risebrough carried into the 1991–92 season. Gilmour, who was playing the option year of his contract at a salary of US$450,000 was unable to reach a deal with the team on an extension. The dispute went to arbitration where the Flames offered a raise to $550,000 while he asked for $1.2 million and was expecting a settlement worth around $800,000.[37] The arbitrator's decision, made in December 1991, amounted to $750,000 per season for two years, but left Gilmour angry and bitter. He alleged that executives with the team and league had tampered with the process – the arbitrator attended a Flames game with team management on the night before the hearing, while NHL President John Ziegler sent a letter to the arbitrators.[38] Gilmour, who remained active with the Flames throughout the process, had scored 38 points in 38 games. Following the decision, he requested a trade out of Calgary and threatened legal action. Gilmour led the Flames to a 3–2 overtime victory over the Montreal Canadiens with a goal and an assist on New Year's Eve then walked out on the club on January 1, 1992.[39] He later called the choice to walk away from the team to be one of the toughest decisions he had ever made.[40]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doug_Gilmour

The breakdown in relationship between Gilmour and the Flames is totally on Risebrough and the Flames shoulders. I don't blame Gilmour for being mad at what had gone on.

For Nieuwendyk, he quit on the team when he had a binding contract and there had been no shenanigans.

Nieuwendyk entered the 1995–96 season unhappy with his contract status. Unable to come to terms with the Flames, he had gone to arbitration, and was awarded a contract worth C$1.85 million, but insisted on renegotiating the deal into a long-term contract extension.[27] He refused an offer of a three-year, $6 million contract from the Flames, and as the dispute dragged on, chose not to join the team when the season began.[28] He remained a holdout until December 19, 1995, when the Flames traded him to the Dallas Stars in exchange for Jarome Iginla and Corey Millen.[29

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Nieuwendyk

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by looooob

I think the outcome is pretty reasonable. you can debate the merits of either player but given that Nieuwendyk had essentially twice the number of GP and Points I think this seems fair


a totally different poll (which would be fun) is to do the same exercise but just using a players peak best season on the team

Yet, Gilmour put up more pts/game, on the shut-down line, while maintaining a twice as effective +/-. He wasn't here for a flash in the pan, he was here for our MOST successful years.

[Poe969]

Part of me blames Gilmore for how Bennett turned out.