Friedman's 31 thoughts: April 30

[Strange Brew]

You can’t really talk about moving Stone in the same way you talk about moving Brodie or any of the other defenseman. A $3.5 million cap hit for a guy who ended the season 9th on the depth chart isn’t a valuable asset. He’s not returning anything of value if they can even move him.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

You can’t really talk about moving Stone in the same way you talk about moving Brodie or any of the other defenseman. A $3.5 million cap hit for a guy who ended the season 9th on the depth chart isn’t a valuable asset. He’s not returning anything of value if they can even move him.

The only way Stone would get moved is if a team was desperate for a #4/5 right handed defenseman. Maybe he's a #5/6 now, but Stone is still a good player in my eyes. He just needs a different team to prove himself, he and Brodie are both probably going to be moved this summer. Stone will fetch a mid round pick. Though, I do believe that we might keep Stone as the #6/7 in case we have a major injury. We're due for a big injury somewhere in the lineup.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by getoverit

I wouldn’t mind a Rittich/Talbot combo signed super reasonable. Ex Oilers always seem to do well and has shown he can. Be new to him to actual have defensemen in front of him lol.

Move on from Smith

Rittich needs a guy who can push him. I am not convinced Smith is the guy to do that. Smith on a 1 year deal would make it clear who the number 1 guy is next season.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Flames can't afford to lose more assets at this point to drop salary. So much has been spent in acquiring middling players like Elliott, Lazar, Smith, Hamonic, Stone that organizational depth is pretty weak. Need virtually every pick we have to retool, and need to sell the Stones, Froliks, Hamonics for picks asap.

Give your head a shake

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

This type of thinking stems from the Corey Pronman school of player evaluation, which promotes very clear ideas about what makes an ideal NHL player. Some posters set such an inordinately high value on skating and speed that they become practically oblivious to all the other attributes that numerous NHL players will use to attain success. So, even though a player like Hamonic is a perfectly fine skater, because he doesn't produce a tonne of offence his best attributes are ignored by observers who seem to see only speed and skill.

How about the fact that he shoots right and Brodie shoots left?

Left: Gio, Brodie, Hanifin, Valimaki, Kylington

Right: Andersson, Hamonic

Unless we want 5 lefties and 1 righty in our top 6 why would we pick Brodie over Hamonic? (I didnt include Stone because I feel he isnt part of the plan - others like Fantenberg, Prout and Yelesin are unknowns)

[gamesaver]

1. Sign Tkachuk, that's obviously the number one priority.

2. Trade Brodie. Honestly he was a turnover machine last season. So many goals against because of him.

3. Sign Rittich and someone not named Smith. No hard feelings against Smithy, but I would like to see someone younger with more upside next year. 37 years old goalie coming off a terrible season? If they sign him I will have to think its because he is an old friend of Brad, and thats actually what I don't like about it. Yes, he was a stud in the playoffs. But without Rittich he wouldn't have a chance to play in the post season becuase of how he wasn't able to stop a beachball for most part of the regular season. It's hard to forget about that.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Some interesting thoughts in this thread about our defenseman going forward. My two cents:

-Stone's value dropped because he missed nearly the entire season with serious blood clot issues. That's the primary reason he dropped down the depth chart. He started the season playing regularly and was just fine.

-Hamonic is still a solid 2nd pairing d-man who does a lot of heavy lifting in his own zone, especially down low and in front of the net. We don't have enough defensemen who can do that, so you have to keep him unless you have prospects coming in who can do that kind of work. I don't see any at the moment. I get that he's getting older and we need to be wary of decline, but I'd be totally fine with him on another 3 year deal.

-Hanifin's value is in his zone exits and possession numbers. He's consistently on the right side of the ledger, and he always makes great decisions to get out of his own zone smoothly. His offensive production will come with age and experience, but he's never going to be the goal scorer Hamilton is/was. But then, who is? I'd like to see Hanifin work on learning the Hamonic style of game. He tends to lose coverage down low during a quick cycle, which leads to some big chances when he's on the ice. I firmly believe that can be learned and that Hanifin has the skills to be a #2 d-man down the road.

-Pump the brakes on Kylington's NHL capabilities. He's still borderline because he struggles under pressure and doesn't have enough NHL size to be a regular. I think he's still a very useful player, but he's not as complete as Andersson or Valimaki

-I see Valimaki/Andersson as our 2nd pairing of the future. Probably 2 seasons from now.

-Brodie is definitely the most likely player to be shipped out. He's reached his peak usefulness as a player and the major turnover gaffes are becoming semi-regular. While he's still a pretty good player overall, I think he's the easiest one to move in a trade for a decent return and also the easiest to replace in the lineup. Top pairing 5 on 5 minutes will be hard to replace internally, but I think it can be done between Andersson and Hamonic. Brodie's time on the 2nd PP can easily be replaced by Andersson, Hanifin, even Valimaki. I don't remember Brodie playing a lot of PK time.

-IF we do trade away BOTH Brodie and Stone, it really hurts our organizational depth that has been built up. I don't know enough about the other players in the system to say for certain they can handle NHL minutes. That's why I think the Flames hold on to Stone for the final year of his contract and hope that he recoups some value throughout the year. Two positives comes from keeping Stone: 1) we still have a solid injury replacement should we have a long playoff run, and 2) on the off chance we aren't a playoff team, Stone can be dealt for an adequate return at the deadline.

I'm betting this is our defense on opening night:

Giordano-Andersson
Hanifin-Hamonic
Valimaki-Stone
Kylington

[1qqaaz]

I think Hamonic would probably re-sign for a reasonable amount. He brings dynamics that the team is otherwise short on. He's in the right age-range to eventually be surpassed by Andersson or Valimaki.

I think it would be difficult to justify keeping Brodie over Hamonic, and I don't think many people are making that argument.

Arguing in favor of Brodie over Hamonic would be like having a lion fight a 600 lb tuna in the ocean.

[Flames_F.T.W]

Hamonic brings A LOT to the table that we don't have an abundance of. He's gritty, tough as nails, hates losing and is the closest thing we have to a shutdown D. He's also great in the community and by all accounts a great teammate.

We have several D in our system who can do what Brodie does (maybe even better and with less costly mistakes), but we don't have someone who can replace what Hamonic offers. He also wants to be here. I don't think there's much debate about who we would keep between Brodie and Hamonic.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Move on from Smith. The downward facing snow angel has run its course. I would question Treliving's competence if Smith was brought back in any capacity. Smith does not address any need on this team going forward.

Brodie is the one guy that should definitely be moving at the draft. We have a Brodie replacement in Kylington. Frolik is likely in that same boat as we have a replacement for him in Dube. Both veterans have some value and will help the Flames recoup some of those lost assets over the past couple seasons. Time to recharge the system. Should make the draft interesting.

[CroFlames]

People watched MacKinnon skate like the wind and now think we need to move on from Hamonic.

You need a variety of skills on the back end. The skill set Hammer brings is exactly what you need for a championship team.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I like Hanifin quite a bit as a player. One of the only reasons that I think he might be traded is if he's the final piece necessary to acquire a tremendous upgrade at forward.

I think we’d be selling low on Hanifin just like CAR did with he and Lindholm last summer. Best is yet to come for him IMO. I don’t think he’s going anywhere. You can lump him in with Valimaki and Andersson as our future young defense core.

[Pickle Juice]

I feel like this team has a ton of defensive depth, but I'm still not sure I have seen anyone that has the ability to take over when Gio either retires or starts to play to his age.

I would be looking to try and pair Brodie and say Kylington to get PK out of Nashville. There are Rumors he is available and there is no denying he isn't a true number one pairing deference.

I think he brings some more sand paper to the defense and would give us the predecessor we need once Gio moves on.

Gio - Andersson
Hanifin - PK
Valamaki - Hamonic

And who knows if they can try and persuade Nashville to give us Juuse Saros in the deal it would be a home run. Obliviously the trade would involve significantly more.

Now I get that this would make it harder for us to resign Chucky but I'm sure there is way to fit him in the salary even with PK. (We almost Traded for Stone, so I'm sure there was a plan for Chucky)

This might have been more suited for the trade rumor thread sorry!

[Toonage]

Subban makes $10M

How is that going to work here? And why would the Flames pay a guy $10M to be on the 2nd pair?

[Toonage]

double

[Classic_Sniper]

Yelesin is a RHD with a big shot and won the KHL’s hardest shot competition. He seems to be more of a replacement for Michael Stone than anyone else as they share a lot of similar traits.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Split98]

On some nights, I thought Hanifin was the worst player on the ice. I think his choke in the playoffs flew under the radar quite a bit, and Hamonic went with him. Otherwise, 2 very good defencement that give us great depth and options as we saw great things from them throughout the season.

It's time for Brodie to wear different colours though. He had a bounceback playing with Gio this year, but he was nothing like his first go with that pairing. What we have seen is how atrocious he is without Gio so I think we have to take this uptick in Brodie and get what we can for it. Him with Gio is a waste, as this guy can't stop giving the puck away.

Stone will be very useful to a team somewhere, and do we know what's happening with Fantenberg?

[Toonage]

Hanifin had moments where he was an offensive black hole and a defensive liability. All season really, not just the playoffs. But he's also just 22 and has a ton of talent & potential. Keeping him surrounded by players like Gio & Hamonic will pay off down the road. He'll put it together. Also, the Flames didn't send Hamilton out of town and sign Hanifin as they did just to move him after year one.

[smiggy77]

lol why the F would we trade Hamonic?

People have to understand that there is value in a defensive defenceman.

[Pickle Juice]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Subban makes $10M

How is that going to work here? And why would the Flames pay a guy $10M to be on the 2nd pair?

I think he makes 9 but I'm not going to split hairs between 9 and 10 million, as its definitely a large contract no matter how you slice it.

You could put him on the first line because of his salary or you can place him on the second line based on balancing the lines. I'm pretty sure he plays on the second line in Nashville as well.

I believe the flames are a really good team, but I think they are lacking some gritty skilled players.

Lets put it this way

Valamaki - Andersson
Hanifin - ????
Kylington - ????

That's likely the D pairing in 3 years from now! Very skilled but very soft in my opinion. I'm not saying it has to be PK all I'm saying is that with the wealth of D we do have at the moment, if possible try and pair a couple up to get a defenceman with some grit and skill.