Life Question

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by rotten42

There is also power in leaving the toxic/sh*tty people behind going forward in life.

Only if you forgive them. You never truly leave those people behind if you don’t.

[CaptainCrunch]

I'm going to go where I usually go, because I've been told that I have a shriveled up raisin for a heart anyways and that I am incredibly good at holding a grudge.

But what he is doing is monkey behavior (no not a racist term), if all of your burdens are a monkey sitting on your shoulder, you want to transfer it to someone else.

Because this guy basically dumped on your friendship over money, not once but twice, he was fine about not talking to you, he probably convinced himself that you were the jerk, the idiot, the vindictive bastard, and you know what . . . he lived with that, he wrapped it around himself like a security blanket. He didn't want to rekindle your friendship at all, in fact he probably reveled in the fact that the money held more meaning to him then you.

And then he got sick, and he's seeing the end of the road, and that monkey on his shoulder is getting fatter and fatter, but its not guilt in that monkey, he wants you to feel guilty for throwing away your friendship over money, that's why he didn't say, hey man, I was wrong, I want to make ammends and work to get our friendship back.

He wants you to show up, so you can feel guilty about the past X years that were tossed away over a slight that he probably believes is your fault. He wants that monkey to jump from his shoulder to yours by having you say, "Forget about the money, lets be buddies and I'll hold your hand as you go into the sweet by and by". Then he will feel secure that you will feel guilty about not seeing things his way and that the loss of friendship is on you.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm the guy that believes that humanity is over populated with jerks.

So he goes, he never asks for forgiveness from you or tries to make amends and makes you feel guilty and gives you the monkey to carry.

I mean personally I wouldn't go because I'd want to hear an apology not for the money, but for putting money ahead of friendship and doing it twice, so there's no point.

I'd write a note and send it, and tell him that I'm sorry about what you're going through and I hope that he wins his battle and returns to health, but frankly we're not friends, we haven't been friends for a long time, and I'm refuse to take on the guilt over a lost friendship that was over a long time ago.

On top of that, part of the process of dying is to make amends for past acts and wrongs, and to heal pain, not cause more pain. If there's a soul, part of the process of going is to confront the pain that you've caused, and ensure that you're causing no more pain.

What he's doing sounds selfish, he wants to get over his pain and guilt if he has that by making you accept it.

Send the note, and don't go down to see him, it will only cause you pain and resentment, and maybe him pain and resentment if you refuse to take on the responsibility that he wants you to take on.

If he reaches out again, and says he sorry or he wants to make things right, then by all means go and see him and you can do the past is past thing.

Again Black Heart.

[Backlunds_socks]

Originally Posted by hayduke's dad

A very good friend of mine screwed me over years ago. Long story short he damaged my sea-doo and refused to cover repairs. Cost me about $5000 in the late 90's. After a long battle with trying to work things out he wouldn't move on his stance. Seeing we weren't friends anymore I took him to small claims court. Before it was decided on by judge I tried one last call to work it out before a ruling. Again he declined. I ended up winning. He paid me sporadically $50 a month for a couple years then never paid again. with interest he still owes over $7000 now. I never pursued making him pay or garnishing his wages even after all that he became an officer of the law.

Recently he has been diagnosed with cancer and outlook isn't good. He sends me a Facebook message after not talking for 15+ years saying he misses our friendship and wants to be friends seeing he doesn't know how much time he has left. No apology no sorry.

Am I expecting to much? I feel bad for him as he could die with young kids but he chose not to ever call me back. I am torn in how to reply.

What would you do?

Not reply?

Tell him he was one who chose the path? Good Luck?

Give in and tell him it's ok lets be friends?

A friend in need is a friend indeed.

A small gesture from you can make his transition so much easier bruv

[Wastedyouth]

Hmmmmm, bury the hatchet over some money from 15 years ago or possibly regret never getting closure if he suddenly passes.

I'm not saying you will regret it, but you may, and if you do nothing you will never get another chance to talk about it if he dies.

Why put that on yourself?

Death is so messed up. It wreaks havoc on the mind. Maybe he is sorry and was just reaching out to start the convo?

I say reply and bring it up.

But thats just me.

[topfiverecords]

You're not taking the $7k with you in the end either.

It was a sea-doo. A luxury item. Something everyone can carry on living without.

It's not like you were out $7k. You were out a sea-doo. You had a choice, #1, accept that he can't afford to fix it and you move on as friends minus a sea-doo. Or #2, grind him for the money and be out on the water alone on your fixed sea-doo. You chose number 2.

Sorry, but it sounds probable that because you were a bit of a huge prick about the damage that he curbed his intentions of paying you back. I know if I owed a friend money for something like that and they were reasonable about it I'd be dedicated to paying it back as quickly as possible. If they were a complete dick about it though I could easily get to the point of telling them to screw off.

Reach out, even if just a response to his message is a nice thing to do to ease some thoughts on his side.

Me, I'd rent us sea-doos, go for ride and catch up, tell him I was a dick taking him to court.

[rotten42]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Only if you forgive them. You never truly leave those people behind if you don’t.

I don't really agree. If someone has had a negative impact on my life I have no problem walking away from them and not looking bask. I can think of two people specifically that I thought were good friends but turned out not to be. They caused a lot of grief so I made the decision just to move on. No looking back...no wondering if I made the right decision...no second thought.

It is just something I will do. Remove the negative people from my life and concentrate on the positive people. Forgiveness has nothing to do with it.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Are you kidding me? They went to court, without knowing the whole story we already know that the law deemed the other guy responsible. It's not his fault that he let his friend use it, it was a friend. Turned out the guy did something to screw things up and played the same card you're trying to play now. If someone breaks into your car, is it your fault for parking where you did or for owning a car?

The other guy was clearly in the wrong. Others found him guilty of whatever happened and the guy himself admitted guilt by paying him (what little he did pay).

If the other guy was adamant about it not being his fault, he would have fought it more or not paid at all. Blaming the OP here is insulting.

Not at all kidding.
Flaws in the court system aside.

If the Seadoo was stolen I think it is a completely different issue than the one the OP originally presented, and I would say small claims was probably the wrong route to take in the first place.

If the let him use it that there is personal responsibility for what he chose to do with is property. If he doesn't want to have a friend that would help make him whole that's OK, but he needs to understand he choose for his seadoo to be used by that person and not accepting responsibility for that would be a weight holding down any potential reconciliation.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by HockeyIlliterate

Tell him that you appreciate the head's up regarding his impending death as it will allow you to lodge a claim for the remaining amount of the unpaid debt against his estate.

The callousness of this just cracked me up! lol

[pylon]

Let me add some perspective.

In my early 20's my best friend going back to kindergarten slept with my GF I was living with when I was out of town. We had a massive blowout, it ended the relationship, I was out 10's of thousands of dollars as I moved out of a house we had bought a year earlier, and did some major improvements on. Finished the basement, deck, fence, landscaping etc.... This was a lot more than 7g's on a Seadoo, it displaced my life, and I was pretty damn depressed. I held a grudge for about a decade. To be honest, I was more mad at him, than her.

When we did cross paths in Home Depot I think it was, he looked nervous as hell, like I was gonna punch him out, but I just walked up, shook his hand, and said "Hey man... thanks for helping me dodge that bullet 10 years ago. Looks like we both did." As it turns out, the girl in the middle of this' life ended up becoming a dumpster fire train wreck as the years went on. We chuckled, shared phone numbers, and added each other on Facebook. Slowly we mended things, and let the past be the past. A 20 year friendship wasn't worth throwing away over a stupid mistake made in someones early 20's where we all make boneheaded decisions.

5 years ago our family suffered a pretty big tragedy, and the first guy to jump to the plate and offer assistance, and just be there was him. In that couple weeks, the support and friendship he gave me, out weighed what happened in the past by 1000 X. It was like having a brother step in when I had lost one.

Don't hold grudges, especially over money. People make mistakes, and if I've learned anything over the years, forgiveness is one of the greatest gifts you can give, especially to a dying man.

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by #-3

Not at all kidding.
Flaws in the court system aside.

If the Seadoo was stolen I think it is a completely different issue than the one the OP originally presented, and I would say small claims was probably the wrong route to take in the first place.

If the let him use it that there is personal responsibility for what he chose to do with is property. If he doesn't want to have a friend that would help make him whole that's OK, but he needs to understand he choose for his seadoo to be used by that person and not accepting responsibility for that would be a weight holding down any potential reconciliation.

If one of your friends, not a stranger, someone you consider a close friend, asks you to use your phone the odds are you'll give it to them. If they take it and throw it against the wall and stomp on the pieces then that would be your fault for lending him the phone?

It's funny to see what people say in situations like this because it's the exact same reaction (just in an opposite way) as the internet tough guys, they would forgive and let the money go because it's only money.

Maybe you guys all have amazing jobs that pay you more than you'll ever need and you can throw away money on a whim but I know if someone, especially someone I considered a friend, screwed me out of that much money I would be pissed. If you screw up, own it and do what it takes to make it right. This "friend" didn't do that, he screwed someone over and instead of paying for what he did or even trying to sit down and talk about it after he just vanished. Maybe I've been screwed over too much in life and I'm too cynical but when someone wrongs you, do what it takes to right the situation. You can only turn the cheek so many times.

As for the guy having cancer and being on his way out, it sounds cold but that's on him not you.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by #-3

If the let him use it that there is personal responsibility for what he chose to do with is property. If he doesn't want to have a friend that would help make him whole that's OK, but he needs to understand he choose for his seadoo to be used by that person and not accepting responsibility for that would be a weight holding down any potential reconciliation.

This is your personal opinion, nothing more. If this is how you view things that is fine, but the OP or anyone else is under no obligation to follow your outlook. Your declarative statements also disagree with the law / court system.

[hayduke's dad]

Thanks to all. I didn't think there would be so many replies so quick.

I could have many times over the last 15 years done things to get the money back. I did not even when he is buying new motorcycles, going on big family trips trips to see NHL games. It's not the fact neither one of us could afford the money over the years.

I am in a no win situation. Don't reply I am an #######, reply telling him we aren't friends I am an #######.

Considering he hasn't phoned me in 15 years tells me if he never got sick it would have continued for 20. I may sound like a prick but think this is just a reason for me to join his pity party.

I realized 10 years ago I would never see any money and moved on. Never pursued it as it wouldn't have accomplished anything.

I just need to carefully think out my response if I do because it will be there for everyone to see the way things are today with screenshots and forwards.

[Burninator]

It's possible he wants to apologize in person.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Poe969

If one of your friends, not a stranger, someone you consider a close friend, asks you to use your phone the odds are you'll give it to them. If they take it and throw it against the wall and stomp on the pieces then that would be your fault for lending him the phone?

Gotta say in that situation the guy would not be my friend, and no I would no would not lend someone like that my phone.

If I handed my friend my phone, they dropped it and the screen cracked. I would really hope they would offer to do something about it, but I would not get to the point of taking to them to court for it. I would kind of assume the judge would say something along the lines of,

[you mean, you handed them your phone, they dropped it, and now you think they have entered into a formal contract to buy you a new phone, hahahahahaha].

But clearly, what do I know.

[pylon]

Originally Posted by hayduke's dad

Thanks to all. I didn't think there would be so many replies so quick.

I could have many times over the last 15 years done things to get the money back. I did not even when he is buying new motorcycles, going on big family trips trips to see NHL games. It's not the fact neither one of us could afford the money over the years.

I am in a no win situation. Don't reply I am an #######, reply telling him we aren't friends I am an #######.

Considering he hasn't phoned me in 15 years tells me if he never got sick it would have continued for 20. I may sound like a prick but think this is just a reason for me to join his pity party.

I realized 10 years ago I would never see any money and moved on. Never pursued it as it wouldn't have accomplished anything.

I just need to carefully think out my response if I do because it will be there for everyone to see the way things are today with screenshots and forwards.

I will guarantee you, you will regret it if not now, but one day in the future if he departs and you blow him off or stick it to him. I've had someone exit this world when I was on bad terms with them, it was simply an argument that got ugly and neither of us had the chance to mend it up, and joke about it like we usually did. But one day it was just "Yeah, ______ died yesterday." They are gone, and there is nothing you can do to fix it.

I will also guarantee you, if you just swallow your pride, and resentment, step in, and be a friend, you will never regret it, and you will feel much better about yourself, for burying the hatchet.

The $7000 is gone, maybe you can salvage something out of this thing of greater value.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Playfair

There is power in forgiveness. No matter what he did or if he apologized or not, the one you free by forgiveness isn’t just him - it’s you. Visit the man

why visit? they are not friends and haven't been for 15 years.

I believe in the forgiving part, but no the pretending to be friends part. just respond to the message with a nice message in return.

sometimes the past should just stay there.

[rotten42]

Originally Posted by pylon

I will guarantee you, you will regret it if not now, but one day .

You can't say that. You aren't him. You may react to this sort of thing entirely different than he does. Just because you feel remorse for not reconnecting it doesn't mean everybody would feel the same way. Some people need to check those boxes off (for whatever the reason) and some people are perfectly good walking away from who have harmed them and not feeling a pinch of remorse.

I don't know which way OP is going to go but either way I wouldn't guarantee it. That is purely you projecting your reaction on him.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

It's not like you were out $7k. You were out a sea-doo. You had a choice, #1, accept that he can't afford to fix it and you move on as friends minus a sea-doo. Or #2, grind him for the money and be out on the water alone on your fixed sea-doo. You chose number 2.

Sorry, but it sounds probable that because you were a bit of a huge prick about the damage that he curbed his intentions of paying you back. I know if I owed a friend money for something like that and they were reasonable about it I'd be dedicated to paying it back as quickly as possible. If they were a complete dick about it though I could easily get to the point of telling them to screw off.

Reach out, even if just a response to his message is a nice thing to do to ease some thoughts on his side.

Me, I'd rent us sea-doos, go for ride and catch up, tell him I was a dick taking him to court.

Honestly, you sound like a ######.

Trying to justify not having to pay something back because it's a luxury item? The mere fact that you're willing to state that if you owed someone money, you could easily get to the point of telling them to screw off instead of paying them back because they somehow didn't live up to your standard of reasonable? That's not how life works, and the reason they had to go court in the first place. If a "friend" of mine owed me money and decided not to pay back because he didn't like my attitude, not only is friendship over but he's getting a fat lip. I would hope any friend of mine would also beat the #### out of me if I decided not to pay them back. Especially when we're talking about $7,000 here.

Under the assumption that the friend was in the complete wrong when it came to breaking the sea-doo, he had the opportunity to not only take responsible but keep the friendship intact and didn't.

With that said, I don't think it would hurt to reach out and express your feelings towards your friend. At worst you don't like the response and can walk away in the same position you are now, but the upside is you get back a friend or maybe even some money.

[Cube Inmate]

Cancer diagnosis for someone close to you inevitably leads one to say "life's too short to...<blank>." I would know...I have exactly the same thing going on now, with a friend in his late 30s.

Those who are saying "don't hold a grudge" -- this doesn't sound like a grudge. It sounds like a lesson learned, and the OP moving on.

Life's too short to waste your time on unworthy people. Every moment you waste thinking about someone who discarded you, is a moment you can't spend being a better friend / husband / dad / son / community member / etc. to those people who have actually chosen to be a part of your life.

[Matt Reeeeead]

I think he's a POS, who just so happens to be dying. We all die at some point, and dying doesn't let us off the hook before being jerks.

Ya, he's got other more important issues at this point of the game. I'd take the high road and not make a point of it. But no, he doesn't deserve your friendship, nor does he deserve you letting him off the hook simply because his expiration date has arisen.

Sounds like you are a pretty decent person for even letting this message sway you in any way. I'd personally ignore it and move on.