At least 84 killed in terrorist attack in Nice, France

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The old Russian saying that defense is moral offense is immoral is going to be severely tested. That's multiple mass terrorist events in Europe in a fairly short period of time. At some point there are going to be calls for closing the borders and an offensive against ISIS by Western Powers.

Serious question, what does leading an offensive against ISIS in Iraq and Syria do to stop terrorist attacks in Europe? The genie is kind of out of the bottle when it comes Islamic terrorism. These guys don't need ISIS, it's just an easy cause to swear allegiance to.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

What a world we live in.

I hate this. Why must we resort to violence to express beliefs?

Why can't we go a week without hearing about terror and devastation on this beautiful planet?

We had pokemon go for nearly a week. I was quite happy

[Senator Clay Davis]

I think nik posted it in the terrorism thread, but ISIS is basically on its last legs anyway over in Syria and Iraq. So you wonder if we won't see a surge of attacks now that they are probably on their way out. Police in France were actually talking the other day about new types of attacks we could see, and then we get this. Preventing something like a car crashing intentionally into large crowds is difficult since it's a very easy attack to pull off. France has elections next year so that will obviously be worth watching.

[GirlySports]

75 now. Number keeps moving up

[Street Pharmacist]

Nice is my favourite city on the planet. Beautiful, warm, fun, interesting, delicious, full of hidden history, full of attractive people and most of all, comfortable. I'll be going again and I've been there a few times, this is sad. My wife and I were in Nice during Bastille Day when we were on our honeymoon in 2011. I can't imagine the scene playing out

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Serious question, what does leading an offensive against ISIS in Iraq and Syria do to stop terrorist attacks in Europe? The genie is kind of out of the bottle when it comes Islamic terrorism. These guys don't need ISIS, it's just an easy cause to swear allegiance to.

Personally I don't have the answers. I don't believe its the right thing to do because whoever goes in there is going to get stuck in a historically tar baby that will end up destroying whatever nation leads the way.

I believe though that ISIS is on the ropes in terms of an actual caliphate or country, and that makes them way more dangerous as they and their followers or believers will lash out to maximum effect.

At the end of the day, there is nothing that you can do to stop these terrorist attacks, they're going to keep happening and each success will embolden them.

You can abrogate rights and laws in the name of public safety and in the short term you'll see success but in the long term you will damage a country further.

You can fight a bloodless offensive which usually means you drop a A bomb in the middle of ISIS territory.

You can fight a similar type of asymmetrical war to the terrorist in which you fight a war of intimidation and decapitation and make them fear you.

For a time the American's had stumbled on the right formula after 9/11 when they pursued Bin Laden into the mountains and had him and Al Queda concentrating on survival as opposed to following up 9/11 with more devastating attacks, but they didn't have the will power or political lock jaw to finish the job and let him escape which emboldened the various terrorist groups around the world.

But the easy answer right now is that Europeans and especially French Citizens are going to want to hear their government taking action, and the easiest action is to deploy deploy deploy and kill kill kill.

Sorry for the nonsensical answer, I haven't slept in 2 days.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The old Russian saying that defense is moral offense is immoral is going to be severely tested.

This stuff never seems to happen in Russia.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Russia had problems with Islamic extremists in Chechnya, but it seems to be less of a problem now. There was that incident at the school where over 300 people, more than half kids, were killed. But I would imagine that kind of incident prompted a strong response that minimized the threat.

[wwkayaker]

CNN was reporting that grenades, ammunition, and rifles were found in the truck. WTF?

[Buster]

If you haven't read Scott Adams blog on the strategy underway in the current US presidential race....I can't recommend it more highly.

This one is particularly interesting, given the events of the day:

http://blog.dilbert.com/post/1459106...roposal-update

Basically, Adams (who is refreshingly non partisan), observes that Trump laid the groundwork of his "crazy" muslim immigration policy in anticipation of events like today in Nice. Or Orland. Or Turkey. It's a big master class in confirmation bias. Now, while no one likes the idea of a ban on Muslim immigration, it is currently the only plan that has been suggested by any candidate. (Trump knows that the Clinton/Obama camp and their followers will offer little more than platitudes and hashtags.)

Now, a large percentage of the population now longer views the muslim ban as extreme as they once did.



Neither Adams, no myself are endorsing Trump's policy here, but rather putting for an analysis of the strategy.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

This stuff never seems to happen in Russia.

The Chechnyian wars probably killed over 200,000 since the mid 1990s. Many of them civilians.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

This stuff never seems to happen in Russia.

I believe that the saying was coined after World War 2 where Russia had been invaded multiple times.

You could also suggest that the saying a good defense is offense is very Russian.

[hwy19man]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

75 now. Number keeps moving up

That is unfortunately true, very depressing. http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/at-least...ance-1.2987375

[hwy19man]

Originally Posted by wwkayaker

CNN was reporting that grenades, ammunition, and rifles were found in the truck. WTF?

"The president of the Nice region, Christian Estrosi, said the truck was loaded with arms and grenades."
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/nice-tr...-day-1.3679807

[MBates]

Reports are now at 77 dead. The Guardian has the following posted summary from about an hour ago:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/li...nglais-vehicle

What we know so far

A large truck has ploughed into a crowd celebrating Bastille Day in the French Riveria city of Nice.
The crash, which left at least 70 dead, is being treated as a terrorist attack.
The driver of the truck has been killed by police. They are trying to determine if he had accomplices.
Authorities say the man was firing on the crowd as he drove, and that the truck was loaded with weapons and grenades.
Witnesses said the driver was purposefully aiming the vehicle at the crowd and “zigzagging” so that he could hit as many people as possible. It was reported that he drove into the crowd for 2km.
After the attack, the police advised residents of Nice to remain in their homes.
François Hollande, the French president, is on his way to Paris from Avignon to chair an emergency security and defence meeting at 9am on Friday. The French interior minister, Bernard Cazeneuve, is on his way to Nice.
World leaders, including Barack Obama, have condemned the attack. Donald Trump has postponed the announcement of his running mate.

[Kybosh]

My prediction with all this is that we'll ultimately start having measurement and analytics for literally every facet of life, further eroding personal freedoms. Technology is getting to the point where anything can become a device for measurement with the internet of things. Imagine a world where every door, vehicle, weapon and even human is constantly measured with intricate algorithms calculating trends, storing every single piece of data being generated, and then sending responses to those same devices (i.e. lock the door, kill the engine, disarm the weapon, incapacitate the human). I don't think this is far out of the realm of possibility.

[Methanolic]

Being aware and remotely witnessing what's happening in society on a daily basis is becoming extremely painful and disgusting.

yet another call to the world leaders to make a statement of condolence and solidarity. I'm stunned and speechless and truly fear what's next.


God bless the dead, injured and MISSING

[MBates]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

Looked like a typical smaller European lorry. There is video now on Reddit of the carnage and the actual incident occurring.

I'm used to the blood and guts but hearing the grief of people holding their dead loved ones is too much.

Fox News broadcast video of a person walking along the scene with a phone recording the immediate aftermath with bodies strewn everywhere.

Its horrific. On one hand I find it deplorable that someone recorded that and then Fox broadcast it. On the other hand do people truly understand the abhorrent nature of the crime if they are shielded from reality? I really do not know what to think.

[Sainters7]

Originally Posted by Regorium

60 seems low doesn't it? Or is that what you're implying.

I'm trying to think of a packed area in Calgary. Say the olympic plaza celebrations for remembrance day.

Then imagine a semi going 80km/h going through it without even trying to stop.

I think it's the wording. Here in western Canada, when you hear the word "truck", we picture an F150 or Dodge Ram 2500. That was my first thought too, which made the number seem high. The type of truck it actually was is what we'd call it; a semi.

So sickening. Working downtown during Stampede festivities and stuff like this starts to creep up in your head every once in awhile, I hate it. You can't give in and stay away from big public events, then "they" win.

[metallicat]

So at what point do governments end their policy of not negotiating with terrorists? Whatever the western nations are doing, it's not working. I know you can't just sit down with ISIS leadership (do they even really have any?) but maybe it's time toget creative.