Crosby is garbage, he's slowing down and his production is going down the toilet. The smart thing for the pens to do right now is to trade him for a package of Wideman, Raymond, Backlund and some other scrap pieces.
I would laugh at this but sadly this is too similar to a lot of legitimate trade proposals that people post. nothing gets you a star player like a pending UFA, a bottom 6 prospect, a 3rd round pick, and a bad contract cap dump.
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Donno about that. Had a 104 point season after his concussion problems.
Crosby is 28. Hardly on the downcurve of his career. I think generally speaking a guys prime years have shifted down by a year and a guy's prime start at the age of 24 whereas I used to think it started at 26 a few years ago. Crosby is still in his prime, and a special talent like that will likely be a top notch player until age 32.
To me this is just an extended slump, although he does have 10 points so no need to panic. It's the pens that are experiencing problems as a group.
The average NHLers prime (point scoring wise) actually starts much earlier, around 22, and typically by 26 most players production starts to decline.
The average NHLers prime (point scoring wise) actually starts much earlier, around 22, and typically by 26 most players production starts to decline.
I think there is a different curve between average NHLers and elite ones. The better the player, it seems like the longer peak they have, and also a slower decline.
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I think there is a different curve between average NHLers and elite ones. The better the player, it seems like the longer peak they have, and also a slower decline.
The truly great players rely on hockey IQ and positioning, which doesn't decline with age like speed and shot do. That being said, a concussion or severe knee injury can derail any career.
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The truly great players rely on hockey IQ and positioning, which doesn't decline with age like speed and shot do. That being said, a concussion or severe knee injury can derail any career.
Agreed. Plus they are smarter about keeping in shape or they risk turning into Mike Richards or Dany Heatley.
I think there is a different curve between average NHLers and elite ones. The better the player, it seems like the longer peak they have, and also a slower decline.
The problem with Crosby has nothing to do with Crosby himself. It's fans/media expectations of what they want him to be. The guy is always projected to be the top player in the world season after season. Consistently drafted 1st overall in mock drafts. Publicly proclaimed to be the best year after year.
What's wrong with Crosby is the same thing that was ''wrong'' with Iggy when he stopped being a Hart candidate. The same thing wrong with Greztky when he was no longer winning Art Rosses. The same thing that's wrong with Gio right now. The same thing that will be wrong with Ovechkin once he stops winning Rockets. People's expectations are sky high with people like him. And as soon as he ''comes down to earth'', everyone proclaims something bad must be happening to him.
Maybe he's just a human being and he just might not be the best player in the world at the moment? Maybe all those guys are humans who simply have ups and downs? Crosby has had his ups for so long, he was due for a down year. The best sales guy at your work might consistently smash his quotas year after year. Then one year he's down on his numbers. Is something wrong? Or is he just human?
I'm kind of surprised as well that he's not leading the NHL in points. But I also understand he's just a 28 year old playing a game and he's not going to be at the top forever.
Last edited by Huntingwhale; 11-20-2015 at 05:56 PM.
the graph below is an average of all players...for elites the peak drops off slower, but it's the same story, you're generally at your best from 24-26 and then it's downhill from there. interestingly, Vollman has claimed that this curve is the same for goaltenders, but the problem is that goalies aren't played nearly as early as forwards are, so you don't actually know when you have a good goalie until he's technically past his prime.
I think that while point production declines around that time, the player's overall value improves up until probably age 32 or so. This is because a player's defensive awareness increases over time the longer they're in the league.
Think of a player like Yzerman who didn't come close to his early totals but was certainly a more valuable player in his 30s and that showed in the Wings finally getting over the hump to become a (multiple) Cup winner.
I think, but can't speak for him, that at some point he had a personal desire to be the best player on the ice on any or every given night. You could see that in what he did, not in the highlight reels alone, but also in most other plays.
I think he almost appears like he knows he is the best now, but rather than being offended enough by his lack of production, he is mature enough to think of it as a slump that will eventually come around
I think he needs to feel that sense of urgency, which incidentally is the same problem with the Flames this year
There are a lot of competitive people in the world and nobody is sitting by, waiting and giving you time to pull your stuff together.
I know he has been hurt and his coach is suspect. And the right thing to do is to believe in what the coach wants from the team. But he can't let that muddy his level of compete
If I was Pittsburgh.. I would be ran out of town.. However I would trade Malkin and Letang.. Both players would you get you alot.. Get some depth in Pittsburgh and some prospects in the cupboard.. Depth would give Crosby someone to play with in Pittsburgh.
I think, but can't speak for him, that at some point he had a personal desire to be the best player on the ice on any or every given night. You could see that in what he did, not in the highlight reels alone, but also in most other plays.
I think he almost appears like he knows he is the best now, but rather than being offended enough by his lack of production, he is mature enough to think of it as a slump that will eventually come around
I think he needs to feel that sense of urgency, which incidentally is the same problem with the Flames this year
There are a lot of competitive people in the world and nobody is sitting by, waiting and giving you time to pull your stuff together.
I know he has been hurt and his coach is suspect. And the right thing to do is to believe in what the coach wants from the team. But he can't let that muddy his level of compete
I don't buy it.
I know he has ONE cup. It's huge.
But the desire fore the cup should be enough. If that doesn't motivate him to be his best, then you know what, NO THANKS.
Look at Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabrook.
One cup is never enough. One win. Is never enough. One goal is never enough. That's how a winner thinks.
I don't believe he has reached his goals and given up. I think he has more, a lot more, to give!!
But the desire fore the cup should be enough. If that doesn't motivate him to be his best, then you know what, NO THANKS.
Look at Toews, Kane, Keith, Seabrook.
One cup is never enough. One win. Is never enough. One goal is never enough. That's how a winner thinks.
I don't believe he has reached his goals and given up. I think he has more, a lot more, to give!!
I think he still wants to win, but now it is unfortunately an issue in his head. Maybe it is comparing the team he won with to what he has now, I don't know. Maybe a result of post concussion syndrome. Kariya was awesome for a very short while.
I do think assuming concussion effects are overcome, that he has two potential paths - get back on the horse and expect yourself to be the best, or accept that there are others on the way who want it as badly as you and have teams trending the right direction, and flounder
Then again, there is Lindros who went from dominant to a perimeter player whose skill set was not high enough to overcome the differentiator his kamikaze style offered
Nothing is BS here but we are trying to weigh
- raw skill
- post concussion effects
- coaching impact
- quality and performance of teammates
- personal desire
- personal deterioration from peak years (if applicable now)
I think he still wants to win, but now it is unfortunately an issue in his head. Maybe it is comparing the team he won with to what he has now, I don't know. Maybe a result of post concussion syndrome. Kariya was awesome for a very short while.
I do think assuming concussion effects are overcome, that he has two potential paths - get back on the horse and expect yourself to be the best, or accept that there are others on the way who want it as badly as you and have teams trending the right direction, and flounder
Then again, there is Lindros who went from dominant to a perimeter player whose skill set was not high enough to overcome the differentiator his kamikaze style offered
Nothing is BS here but we are trying to weigh
- raw skill
- post concussion effects
- coaching impact
- quality and performance of teammates
- personal desire
- personal deterioration from peak years (if applicable now)
I disagree whole heartedly.
You started out by saying that after Crosby was (self) recognized as the best player in the world, that he no longer had desire. Now suddenly his Post-concussion syndrome has affected his desire.
I remind you, he was the third leading NHL scorer last season. He has also won ART ROSS and HART trophies since his last concussion.
I also think that it is ridiculous to compare Paul Kariya to Crosby, as Kariya was a very good player, but never considered the best player in the league. He was actually not even qualified after his one and only cup appearance.
