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Old 10-14-2015, 10:22 PM   #41
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I have heard from some people that know a couple players in the Flames organization and what I was told basically Bob is not as well liked as it seems and he can be very mean when dealing with players. Again I didn't hear this first hand but the people that have told me this are reputable people and I trust what I was told. That doesn't mean he is close to being canned but I do think this team will reach a point where they tune him out and he will be gone

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Old 10-14-2015, 10:27 PM   #42
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Sorry, but it's ridiculous to say a team with Doughty, Quick, Gaborik, Muzzin, Toffoli, Carter, and Kopitar is 'not very good.' That is, in fact, a very good roster.
That is, basically, one good line.
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Old 10-14-2015, 10:40 PM   #43
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That is, basically, one good line.
And a Vezina quality goalie and a Norris calibre defenceman.
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Old 10-14-2015, 10:46 PM   #44
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And a Vezina quality goalie and a Norris calibre defenceman.
Do you think either get nominated for those awards this season?
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Old 10-14-2015, 11:04 PM   #45
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Sutter may be nearing the end of his tenure, but I think he has earned a full year to turn it around. The only way it occurs mid-year, is if Lombardi is also let go in a total house cleaning.
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Old 10-14-2015, 11:45 PM   #46
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That's cool and all, and makes it three times in two pages you've expressed it.

As things sit now, Hartley has turned this team around in a very short amount of time and has gotten career years out of a multitude of players. At present, he's widely regarded as the best coach in the league and suggesting he's two seasons away from being fired just seems weird.

The conversation about his shelf life wearing thin is extremely premature at this point, if it's relevant at all to the topic of Sutter at present.
Not sure you get to call someone out for "going to the well" multiple times in a thread when the only reason they are doing so is to respond to people who are challenging the initial post.
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Old 10-15-2015, 12:09 AM   #47
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Not sure you get to call someone out for "going to the well" multiple times in a thread when the only reason they are doing so is to respond to people who are challenging the initial post.
I just did.
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Old 10-15-2015, 01:19 AM   #48
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There's a difference between "losing the room" and not being universally loved by players. Steve Shutt said of Scotty Bowman "You hated him 364 days years, and on the 365th day you got your Stanley Cup ring." There are some players who didn't like Babcock in Detroit, yet Toronto thinks he's their golden ticket. Being too much of a buddy is going to get a coach walked over.

I think Bob has adapted since his earlier incarnation as an NHL coach and he may get on guys, but I don't think he's some Mike Keenan who picks a whipping boy and scapegoats him no matter what he does. Bob is not going to let guys put in a lame effort like they did on opening night and smile and pretend everything is wonderful--in the end I don't think players find that unfair.
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Old 10-15-2015, 07:19 AM   #49
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There is merit to Jack Adams winners getting the axe not long after and that's because it usually goes to a coach that got his team to exceed expectations. It's a double edge sword as he did a fantastic job but the expectations have changed and overachieving teams tend to come down to earth at some point. A year ago today if you told me the 2015/16 Flames would have an 89 point season I would have looked at that positively as this time last year I was thinking the Flames would be in the McDavid sweepstakes. Now an 89 point season would be a big disappointment. I would like to think that barring a total collapse Hartley will survive this season even if they miss the playoffs but as we have seen three games into the season if the players aren't buying in the results are downright ugly for this group.
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Old 10-15-2015, 07:40 AM   #50
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The fact that team won 2 Cups is a tribute to Sutter's ability to coach in the playoffs. He did the same thing in Calgary. The Flames had no business being in the finals in 2004 and were a blown call away from winning the Cup that year.

Great goaltending and great coaching for a 2 month stretch can get you a championship.

Now, with several key players having moved on, they are not even at the level they were before.
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Old 10-15-2015, 08:09 AM   #51
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Lombardi should go before Sutter.

If they continue this way much longer, I think both will be gone at the same time.
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Old 10-15-2015, 08:09 AM   #52
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one thing to keep an eye on is the calendar and american thanksgiving, as most teams who are out of the playoffs by that time usually do not make the playoffs
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Old 10-15-2015, 09:49 AM   #53
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Do you think either get nominated for those awards this season?
Bit early to tell. Ask me again after they've played 7 or 8 games.
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:00 AM   #54
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They're just lucky they struck gold with some of their draft picks (Toffoli, Pearson) and have Doughty otherwise they would be bottom 5 team.
Never understood quotes like these - "If it wasn't for W, X, Y, and Z, they'd be garbage." Well, yeah, but they DO have W, X, Y, and Z.
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:03 AM   #55
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Never understood quotes like these - "If it wasn't for W, X, Y, and Z, they'd be garbage." Well, yeah, but they DO have W, X, Y, and Z.
How many times did Flames fans hear "Yeah but it you didn't have Kipper..."
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:07 AM   #56
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*Orange Julius warning*

I have heard from some people that know a couple players in the Flames organization and what I was told basically Bob is not as well liked as it seems and he can be very mean when dealing with players. Again I didn't hear this first hand but the people that have told me this are reputable people and I trust what I was told. That doesn't mean he is close to being canned but I do think this team will reach a point where they tune him out and he will be gone
I heard the same thing from Hrudey & Ball themselves in a game against St. Louis last season.

Supposedly before a faceoff one of the Blues players asked a Flame how he likes playing for Hartley. His reply was "We hate him"
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:08 AM   #57
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If the flames go through tough times they'll turn on the coach
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:16 AM   #58
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How many times did Flames fans hear "Yeah but it you didn't have Kipper..."
In that case it was completely valid
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Old 10-15-2015, 10:19 AM   #59
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I heard the same thing from Hrudey & Ball themselves in a game against St. Louis last season.

Supposedly before a faceoff one of the Blues players asked a Flame how he likes playing for Hartley. His reply was "We hate him"
Could be just a sarcastic comment.
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Old 10-15-2015, 12:26 PM   #60
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Never understood quotes like these - "If it wasn't for W, X, Y, and Z, they'd be garbage." Well, yeah, but they DO have W, X, Y, and Z.
It means I don't think the kings are as good as they used to be. Yes, they have w, x, y and z still but they don't have a, b, c or d anymore.

I'll break it down:

When they won the cup, they were a different team than they were now, despite still having a few players from that roster. I liked that team better (such a radical opinion, I know).

I didn't realize this was such tremendously difficult concept to grasp.

P.S. Other teams have good players too. You could literally make a smarmy post like that about 25 teams in the league. It's almost like here's more to a team than just it's top 5 players.
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