[Signing] Oilers sign Justin "Norris" Schultz to one year deal

[CaptainCrunch]

You know, Schultz is that amazing guy that's hot garbage no matter what system he plays in.

Under Kruger in a standard collapsing defense, utterly hot garbage

Under Eakins who tries to implement the swarm nuclear hot garbage

Todd Nelson goes to a positional defense complete hot garbage

Under TM who will run a defense of some kind, Schultz will complete the garbage collection by becoming Incomparable Hot Garbage

Edmonton fans can blame Eakins and the swarm for the teams defense woes, but the players that they've drafted were defensive hot garbage under Renney, under Krueger, under Eakins under Nelson, and coming to a hockey arena near you under McLellan.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, Schultz is that amazing guy that's hot garbage no matter what system he plays in.

Under Kruger in a standard collapsing defense, utterly hot garbage

Under Eakins who tries to implement the swarm nuclear hot garbage

Todd Nelson goes to a positional defense complete hot garbage

Under TM who will run a defense of some kind, Schultz will complete the garbage collection by becoming Incomparable Hot Garbage

Edmonton fans can blame Eakins and the swarm for the teams defense woes, but the players that they've drafted were defensive hot garbage under Renney, under Krueger, under Eakins under Nelson, and coming to a hockey arena near you under McLellan.

Unfortunately for them, there has not yet been a system devloped which doesn't require actual effort and a modicum of hockey sense.

[VERVE]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

You know, Schultz is that amazing guy that's hot garbage no matter what system he plays in.

Under Kruger in a standard collapsing defense, utterly hot garbage

Under Eakins who tries to implement the swarm nuclear hot garbage

Todd Nelson goes to a positional defense complete hot garbage

Under TM who will run a defense of some kind, Schultz will complete the garbage collection by becoming Incomparable Hot Garbage

Edmonton fans can blame Eakins and the swarm for the teams defense woes, but the players that they've drafted were defensive hot garbage under Renney, under Krueger, under Eakins under Nelson, and coming to a hockey arena near you under McLellan.

He came highly touted during college days and while in the minors had 48 pts (18 goals) in 34 games for half the year. As a 22 yr old playing under Kreuger he had 27 pts (8 goals) in 48 games extrapolated to about 46 pts (82 gms)-not bad in his rookie season but under Eakins, it was disastrous. In other words, bad coaching does matter to his development as well as not bringing veteran dmen playing top minutes to either mentor him or shelter his minutes while playing as a rookie or sophomore (22-23 yr old dman). Schultz was thrusted into playing big minutes -top pairing type of min. while under Eakins. Not good for his growth and development especially as a 23 yr old dman (did I emphazise as a 23 yr old dman again).

Perhaps he could have been close to a Karlsson under the right environment or perhaps he is only a 2nd pairing guy who was fast tracked into playing top pairing minutes with disastrous results. With poor bad coaching and lack of mentorship to sheltor his minutes under tough oppositons, this certainly hamper Schultz's development as a young dman. Howeveer, it is never too late to start new again under better circumstances and right environment. I would not give up on a young dman with potential who just turned 25 playing under terrible conditions to develop and learn the game properly. It is easy to paint with wide brush the word scapegoat but more diffficult to understand the reasons why his development stalled and or regressed.

[Dajazz]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Unfortunately for them, there has not yet been a system devloped which doesn't require actual effort and a modicum of hockey sense.

You'd come pretty close with the trap, apart from the effort part. I'd kill to see the wunder kids be forced to clog the neutral zone.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by VERVE

He came highly touted during college days and while in the minors had 48 pts (18 goals) in 34 games for half the year. As a 22 yr old playing under Kreuger he had 27 pts (8 goals) in 48 games extrapolated to about 46 pts (82 gms)-not bad in his rookie season but under Eakins, it was disastrous. In other words, bad coaching does matter to his development as well as not bringing veteran dmen playing top minutes to either mentor him or shelter his minutes while playing as a rookie or sophomore (22-23 yr old dman). Schultz was thrusted into playing big minutes -top pairing type of min. while under Eakins. Not good for his growth and development especially as a 23 yr old dman (did I emphazise as a 23 yr old dman again).

Perhaps he could have been close to a Karlsson under the right environment or perhaps he is only a 2nd pairing guy who was fast tracked into playing top pairing minutes with disastrous results. With poor bad coaching and lack of mentorship to sheltor his minutes under tough oppositons, this certainly hamper Schultz's development as a young dman. Howeveer, it is never too late to start new again under better circumstances and right environment. I would not give up on a young dman with potential who just turned 25 playing under terrible conditions to develop and learn the game properly. It is easy to paint with wide brush the word scapegoat but more diffficult to understand the reasons why his development stalled and or regressed.

College is College and the AHL is the AHL, in both leagues a player has a lot more time to make decisions and those with better physical skills tend to rise to the top as they can hide a low hockey IQ if they have a better physical skills set.

Based on his bone headed play in the NHL, versus his decent play in the AHL and good play in college, its easy to conclude that Schultz like Hall and Eberle don't have a great 2 way hockey IQ, in other words without the puck they're dumb as a post.

Schultz especially, he doesn't even understand basic positioning.

Now you can point to coaching, and Eakins wasn't a very good coach. But under Krueger who was considered a very good teaching coach, Schultz might have put up offensive numbers, but defensively he was still a walking disaster with a feel and IQ for the defensive game without a brick.

Remember that Eakins went away from the swarm. Probably because the Oiler players weren't smart enough to figure it out. Even when he went to a more standard defense Schultz still didn't get it. They bought Nelson in and he still didn't get that.

Frankly there's a difference between a player with instincts and a player with IQ. I would class Schultz as a player with offensive instincts but very little hockey IQ, and when combined with his timid I hate body contact mindset he's probably going to end up as a journey man like MAB who will be picked up by teams that need a pp QB who can sit on the bench at even strength because he actually hurts your team with his defensive game.

Frankly I get that its en-vogue to blame Eakins for everything. But the Oilers have had multiple successive coaches working with your so called young guns and they've failed because the Oilers got enamored with these offensively fancy players and made drafting them a priority. Tom Renney was an excellent coach, he's excellent technically and he was considered to be a great fit with young players, but frankly it didn't take long for the snot nosed brat brigade to basically tune him out.

They bought in Krueger another guy who was considered to be a very good teaching coach, and he had some success and then at the end of the season, the snot nosed punk brigade tuned him out, because by that point they realized that the Oilers management group was always going to side with the players over changing the culture in the dressing room.

Then they bought in hot shot Eakins who frankly and I agree was terrible. But all I hear from Oiler fans is its all his fault, but you know Hallsy has this massive will to win, and RNH is awesome, and Eberle is super talented and Yak has all this potential blah blah blah blag blah.

But frankly I don't see that will to win with Hall who is defensively stupid and incredibly lazy without the puck and makes bad and sloppy decisions with it. Sure he scores, but he's a player that as a coach I wouldn't feel comfortable with on the ice when I'm holding a lead. RNH is very good, I like Monahan better, but at least RNH does work without the puck. Eberle is softer then poop after taco tuesday and doesn't want to play defense or get engaged in hard physical battles. Yak has three things going for him. I think he works hard, he skates well in a straight line and he has a decent release. But he doesn't use his linemates well, he's clueless without the puck, he doesn't see the open ice very well and I think he has a very low hockey IQ and poor instincts with and without the puck. He's a player that seems to come to lige a bit when there's no pressure which explains why he's maybe had two good months in his entire career, the last month of his rookie season, and the last month of last season.

Anyways back to coaching, they get rid of Eakins and bring in Neilson and everyone looks at his record and a 80 point pace, which happened well after the Oilers were out of it and in no pressure land and basically played however they want, because defensively they were pretty much as bad as they were under Eakins, in a new simpler defensive system non the less.

The Oilers need to quick blaming Eakins for everything and pointing to TM as a savior.

The Management is at fault and should continue to feel heat as they've put a soft group of forwards together with only one of them having a decent hockey IQ (not counting McDavid because he hasn't played an NHL game yet)

The players, this is a lazy core with a poor cumulative IQ, plus they have an understanding that its the coaches that are going to pay the price enacted by the fans and media and management and not the players.

Yes the fans, for believing the hype that Hallsy and RNH and Eberle and Yak and Schultz are a uber core, they're not, they're an unbalanced core and not a core with a culture of work ethic. But every year we see the waggling fingers and hear about potential, and about how many cups they're going to win and about how it was all Coach X's fault.

Its not all on the coach. Schultz is bad because he's terrible, he's soft and he's a moron without the puck and he's a princess.

I have this expectation that until the Oilers look seriously at this core and balance out this team with a still lousy bottom 6, a atrocious blueline still and questionable goaltending and seriously get to work on balancing this lineup and flushing this team and rebuilding it culture wise that all that's going to happen is this.

July - Sept - We're going to be awesome, McDavid is going to propell this franchise to the promised land

Sept to Oct - Did you see the 8 million, McDavid clips on you tube in the non contact scrimmage, him and Hallsy and Eberle and blah blah blah blah blah are going to light it up man, woot woot

Oct to Jan - Well this is disappointing, they still can't keep the puck out of the net, we're out of the playoff's again,

Jan to April - We're playing for nothing again plan the draft party I give up. Todd McLellan is a lousy coach look at all the potential and they're still bad fire Todd.

You can't just look at the coaching here, you have to look at the players and everything else.

[VERVE]

^ When a team goes through a futile losing period for a few years, many small issues would seemed unsurmmountable. The lack of confidence is one great influence on any player trying to get out of a funk. The whole team was playing with little or no confidence case in point, Dubnyk and they regressed under a terrible support system (from coaching to manangement).

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by VERVE

^ When a team goes through a futile losing period for a few years, many small issues would seemed unsurmmountable...

You say this like its something that happens often enough to know the effects of this level of futility. The fact is, it doesn't. The Oilers are historically bad. So bad that they have effectively broken all metrics that apply to "when a team does . . ." Their situation cannot simply be chalked up to a decade long "funk."

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by VERVE

^ When a team goes through a futile losing period for a few years, many small issues would seemed unsurmmountable. The lack of confidence is one great influence on any player trying to get out of a funk. The whole team was playing with little or no confidence case in point, Dubnyk and they regressed under a terrible support system (from coaching to manangement).

Fair enough, but at that point you have to also have a harsh evaluation of the on ice leadership.

The continual blaming of the management and coaching is fine because god knows they were terrible and we've laughed at them for years. But I will contend that the Oilers on ice leader ship has to take a big sandwich smeared with poop and mustard and take a hearty bite.

The urban legend that Hall is this guy like Mark Messier who will do anything to win doesn't pass the visibility test, the fact is that the core of that team is rotten effort wise and leadership wise, and they haven't addressed it, in fact the guy that basically was a player on Edmonton that I respected because he was that guy, was moved. (Gordon)

I will contend that a team with Hall in a leadership position won't win anything. Look to his play away from the puck, there's no effort.

And again its easy to blame the coaching, but prior to Eakins this team had quit on two very good NHL guys, and it was apparent when you watched them play.

You can blame Eakins for the swarm, but the problems with the Oilers structure and the players that they've picked goes far deeper then that.

From a standpoint of positivity it would probably be better for the Oilers to crack and fail dismally this year so the new management will get around the everything is awesome, everything is cool now that we have another number one pick like McDavid in the lineup mentality and rebuild the Oilers properly.

right now its a hockey card collection, even after the weird deals by Chia.

The hardest thing for any NHL coach is to manage the ego's in the locker room, it almost seems to be a bigger challenge in Edmonton and will remain that way until management gets by their own love affair with their high end selection based talent.

[1991 Canadian]

I like reading some of the Oiler fan comments describing this signing as "no risk". I'm pretty sure having Schultz on your blueline is a risk, regardless of the cap hit and term.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by 1991 Canadian

I like reading some of the Oiler fan comments describing this signing as "no risk". I'm pretty sure having Schultz on your blueline is a risk, regardless of the cap hit and term.

Having Schultz on your blueline is like having a guy carrying a vial of nitroglycerine into a blazing dynamite factory.

[VERVE]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

You say this like its something that happens often enough to know the effects of this level of futility. The fact is, it doesn't. The Oilers are historically bad. So bad that they have effectively broken all metrics that apply to "when a team does . . ." Their situation cannot simply be chalked up to a decade long "funk."

No Text. I am saying that is what happens when you reach this level of futility, bad things happens such as playing with a lack of confidence and support as the team regressed under poor coaching and management. No different than the bad Islanders or Leafs etc. I guess this new season will play out come what may...

[VERVE]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Fair enough, but at that point you have to also have a harsh evaluation of the on ice leadership.

The continual blaming of the management and coaching is fine because god knows they were terrible and we've laughed at them for years. But I will contend that the Oilers on ice leader ship has to take a big sandwich smeared with poop and mustard and take a hearty bite.

The urban legend that Hall is this guy like Mark Messier who will do anything to win doesn't pass the visibility test, the fact is that the core of that team is rotten effort wise and leadership wise, and they haven't addressed it, in fact the guy that basically was a player on Edmonton that I respected because he was that guy, was moved. (Gordon)

I will contend that a team with Hall in a leadership position won't win anything. Look to his play away from the puck, there's no effort.

And again its easy to blame the coaching, but prior to Eakins this team had quit on two very good NHL guys, and it was apparent when you watched them play.

You can blame Eakins for the swarm, but the problems with the Oilers structure and the players that they've picked goes far deeper then that.

From a standpoint of positivity it would probably be better for the Oilers to crack and fail dismally this year so the new management will get around the everything is awesome, everything is cool now that we have another number one pick like McDavid in the lineup mentality and rebuild the Oilers properly.

right now its a hockey card collection, even after the weird deals by Chia.

The hardest thing for any NHL coach is to manage the ego's in the locker room, it almost seems to be a bigger challenge in Edmonton and will remain that way until management gets by their own love affair with their high end selection based talent.

I do not believe Mark Messier would have turned out to be the leader he was if it weren't for Wayne Gretzky. He was the leader and did his talking on the ice. He made everyone better around him. Alot of those players of the 80s-Kurri, Anderson, Coffee, Fuhr, Lowe, Messier, Tik etc turned out the way they did in a big part due to Gretzky.

Now to put a bunch of teenagers ie Hall, RNH Ebs on the ice from 2010 on and hope they became your leaders while playing top line minutes against older players on the top line does not always work (and it showed). They need leadership and mentorship.

I can unequivocally blame the Oilers woes on Eakins during their last two years. He was in over his head. A rookie GM hiring a rookie head coach-disastrous in this case. Once the snowball effect of poor coaching and poor team play takes place, there is no relief in sight until major changes occur.

[CaptainCrunch]

Taylor Hall has been there for 5 years, He had guys like Horcoff, Hemsky, Whitney, he had Renney as his coach in 2010-2011

In 2011-12 he had Ryan Smyth, Horcoff and a bunch of vets and Renney as a coach

2013 he had Smyth, he had Horcoff and a bunch of other veterans in the lineup and Krueger as a coach

In 2013 2014 he still had Ryan Smyth, Boyd Gordon and others, He did have Eakins to spray water at

The next year he only had Eakins for half the season,

So during his career he had veterans to lean on. He had other coaches that weren't Eakins that he also helped to bury.

He's been in the NHL for 5 years and he's still terrible defensively and when you watch him tremendously lazy without the puck. No he didn't have Gretzky mentoring him, but he did have very good veterans in the lineup up until last year, and he didn't always have Eakins as his coach.

Until Hall actually learns to lead by example, show an effort without the puck he has to take a big chunk of the blame. He's a veteran.

He's never evolved.

But he doesn't get looked at seriously by his fans because it's blasphemy to do so, but he among the coaching and management is a big part of the reason for the failure up there, its just that the players aren't held accountable.

This is why the Oilers have a fricken coach carousal

But its not all on the coaches, Eakins might have been a boob, but the players helped that train derail as well.

[OzSome]

I am in Edmonton this week and it is kind of funny listening to some of the Edmontonians on the radio and even people from AGLC warehouse where I am doing some work. Some of them are wondering if Kevin Lowe and McTavish are back because they thought signing Schultz to that amount is laughable. They were saying he was so bad on defense last season and they don't think he'll be improving. I agree that it's ridiculous to sign him for over $3M a season.

[Traditional_Ale]

Does anyone else ever get sick of all the love Captain Crunch has for Taylor Hall? Dicks in the Hall!

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Edmonton fans can blame Eakins and the swarm for the teams defense woes, but the players that they've drafted were defensive hot garbage under Renney, under Krueger, under Eakins under Nelson, and coming to a hockey arena near you under McLellan.

The Oilers were 23rd in goals against under Renney.

19th under Krueger. Which is nearly the same as the Flames this last season.(17th)

Then 30th in back to back years under Eakins.

It's obviously not all Eakins fault but he sure managed to get the least out of the rosters he had.

[AlbertaOiler72]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Taylor Hall has been there for 5 years, He had guys like Horcoff, Hemsky, Whitney, he had Renney as his coach in 2010-2011

In 2011-12 he had Ryan Smyth, Horcoff and a bunch of vets and Renney as a coach

2013 he had Smyth, he had Horcoff and a bunch of other veterans in the lineup and Krueger as a coach

In 2013 2014 he still had Ryan Smyth, Boyd Gordon and others, He did have Eakins to spray water at

The next year he only had Eakins for half the season,

So during his career he had veterans to lean on. He had other coaches that weren't Eakins that he also helped to bury.

He's been in the NHL for 5 years and he's still terrible defensively and when you watch him tremendously lazy without the puck. No he didn't have Gretzky mentoring him, but he did have very good veterans in the lineup up until last year, and he didn't always have Eakins as his coach.

Until Hall actually learns to lead by example, show an effort without the puck he has to take a big chunk of the blame. He's a veteran.

he was tied for first in +/- on the team last year (-1)

he was second on the team in +/- in 2013-14 with Krueger coaching him (+5)

he's had one horrible year in the NHL in +/-...that was last year, Eakins only full year coaching the team...and he wasn't even close to the worst on the team

I'm willing to let McLellan try his hand at coaching Hall, cause I like what he did with him at the World Championships (named to all-star team...all his goals were ES goals)

he'll never be Marian Hossa but neither will Patrick Kane, or John Tavares...he's a scoring winger

meanwhile, Jordan Eberle has been minus double digits in 3 of his 6 season in Edmonton...

[JiriHrdina]

An argument based on plus/minus? How very 90s of you.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by VERVE

Now to put a bunch of teenagers ie Hall, RNH Ebs on the ice from 2010 on and hope they became your leaders while playing top line minutes against older players on the top line does not always work (and it showed). They need leadership and mentorship.

I can unequivocally blame the Oilers woes on Eakins during their last two years. He was in over his head. A rookie GM hiring a rookie head coach-disastrous in this case. Once the snowball effect of poor coaching and poor team play takes place, there is no relief in sight until major changes occur.

I admit I only watch a few oiler games a year but I've seen multiple times where Hall blazes up the ice like a bat out of hell, trys to deke through 3 players, coughs up the puck, then drifts back to the bench while a 3 on 2 goes the other way. At least RNH tries, Hall is a defensive joke.

[GioforPM]

[QUOTE=AlbertaOiler72;5369194]
I'm willing to let McLellan try his hand at coaching Hall, cause I like what he did with him at the World Championships (named to all-star team...all his goals were ES goals)

QUOTE]

He had Duchene and Crosby (both excellent at two-way play) as centres. He played weak offensive teams. And I imagine he was motivated to try harder on D because of the situation.

I doubt McLellan had much to do with it.