Alberta Healthcare premiums to return

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by chedder

Agree on most of this except the cut off at age 65. Income based is more fair. Just because you're 65 shouldn't dictate not paying premiums. If you meet the income threshold you pay. Boomer seniors are some of the richest people in the province and use the healthcare system a lot.

They are also some of the poorest with no means to make a living. Boomer seniors and others are just getting back what they put in earlier, unless you die young everyone gets a turn at paying taxes.

[Lanny's Stache]

They never should have stopped the old one. My company paid the majority of it, so I never thought about it. I would expect that a lot of middle to high earners had the premium covered. But now with all of the cost cutting, I am betting that companies are not going to pay this premium.

I am ok with adding something like this, but they really need to up the threshold for assistance. I remember the old policy was not terribly helpful to those in the lower income brackets. It seemed the minimum income was much too high.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

They are also some of the poorest with no means to make a living. Boomer seniors and others are just getting back what they put in earlier, unless you die young everyone gets a turn at paying taxes.

Must have missed where I said if they're poor they don't pay but just because you arbitrarily make it to 65 shouldn't mean you get a free pass. If you make enough dough you should pay no matter what your age is. And generally as you age you use the health system more so continuing to pay shouldn't be a big deal.

[OMG!WTF!]

I just wish they would find efficiencies within the administration of health care. Forking another billion dollars on the pile isn't going to help anything. There is so so much wasted time and money. It's laughable. We don't seem to realize how expensive free health care is.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

I just wish they would find efficiencies within the administration of health care. Forking another billion dollars on the pile isn't going to help anything. There is so so much wasted time and money. It's laughable. We don't seem to realize how expensive free health care is.

Blah blah blah

Efficiencies

Blah blah blah

Waste

Blah blah blah

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Blah blah blah

Efficiencies

Blah blah blah

Waste

Blah blah blah

He's not wrong, but sadly that's the Golden Goose that no one has found how to get the Golden eggs from

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

We don't seem to realize how expensive free health care is.

And yet still much cheaper than what you get down south. The United States spends 17.7% of its GDP on Health care, which is the highest in the world (and 6% more than the 2nd country, the Netherlands, at 11.9. We're at 11.2).

I'm sure there are ways to make it more efficient, but Health Care in general is never going to be a cheap proposition.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

He's not wrong, but sadly that's the Golden Goose that no one has found how to get the Golden eggs from

Maybe, but I have to say that the Canadian single payer system is about a thousand times (million?) more efficient than the American insurance administration mess. I'm kind of neutral on the whole Private vs public healthcare debate (I see pros and cons in both), but this is one area where the Canadian system wins in a landslide.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Table 5

And yet still much cheaper than what you get down south. The United States spends 17.7% of its GDP on Health care, which is the highest in the world (and 6% more than the 2nd country, the Netherlands, at 11.9. We're at 11.2).

I'm sure there are ways to make it more efficient, but Health Care in general is never going to be a cheap proposition.

I wonder is the US model worth citing?

Are their numbers skewed because of the large number of For-Profit hospitals that charge a bumhole load for services.

[cracher]

Originally Posted by Bill Bumface

I saw Kreutzer before he made it big. Great guy. I go to the doctor once every two years, so for a few thousand reasons I no longer go there.

He is good.

And I agree with you; no need for you to pay to see him. You get free prostate exams anyways with your bicycle seat, taking drops on 25psi tires.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

I just wish they would find efficiencies within the administration of health care. Forking another billion dollars on the pile isn't going to help anything. There is so so much wasted time and money. It's laughable. We don't seem to realize how expensive free health care is.

A lot of the inefficiencies have come form decades of cuts. Cutting senior care so they are stuck taking expensive hospital beds, closing wings of hospitals so emergency rooms backup, leading to needing more EMS becuase they are stuck caring for patients in hallways. My wife spent 2 weeks EXTRA in intensive care because they had nowhere else to put her, not becuase she needed to be there. That's a $2000 a day expense per day. I've (unfortunately) experienced it many areas of healthcare.

There are systematic bottlenecks all over the place that could reduce costs massively, but they require spending money to save money. Unfortunately Prentice is setting up another big one by kicking the Cancer Care centre can down the road. We desperately need this as a purpose built facility, not cobbled together form whateve rspace is left on other facilities. Without it, its just going to be another example of wasted money in an attempt to save a few bucks for a few more years.

I have no idea why this province continues to make the same stupid mistakes over and over, nor why the voters continue to buy into it.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Table 5

And yet still much cheaper than what you get down south. The United States spends 17.7% of its GDP on Health care, which is the highest in the world (and 6% more than the 2nd country, the Netherlands, at 11.9. We're at 11.2).

I'm sure there are ways to make it more efficient, but Health Care in general is never going to be a cheap proposition.

There's really no comparison here since the US (at the time these stats came out) only covered about half of that expense federally. You can't account for rich pople in the richest country buying their own "health care". I'm not sure now, but I know in the past Canada had the fewest doctors and nurses per capita compared to other nations. That tells me there's a lot of administration here.

A lot of the inefficiencies have come form decades of cuts.

Very good point.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

They are also some of the poorest with no means to make a living. Boomer seniors and others are just getting back what they put in earlier, unless you die young everyone gets a turn at paying taxes.

The poverty rate for seniors in Canada today is lower than the poverty rate for 20-somethings. Most of the programs set up to give preferential treatment for seniors were set up back in the 60s when the poverty rate of seniors in Canda was something like 40 per cent. Now it's around 15.

Poor seniors should get a break, but seniors shouldn't get a break just for being old.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The poverty rate for seniors in Canada today is lower than the poverty rate for 20-somethings. Most of the programs set up to give preferential treatment for seniors were set up back in the 60s when the poverty rate of seniors in Canda was something like 40 per cent. Now it's around 15.

Poor seniors should get a break, but seniors shouldn't get a break just for being old.

Seniors who really need it should get the breaks. Problem is there are many who don't need the breaks but still get it. It should be income based and not how old you are.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Dion

Seniors who really need it should get the breaks. Problem is there are many who don't need the breaks but still get it. It should be income based and not how old you are.

Oh don't worry. Rich (not even rich) vaguely self sufficient seniors don't get the pension they paid into for 60 years.

[Dion]

Prentice said his government is not bringing back the former health-care premiums that he described as “actually quite punitive.” He said his government will introduce a health-care levy that won’t be a payroll tax, but provided no other details.

“I think you can view it as a progressive measure,” the premier said.
Finance Minister Robin Campbell told the legislature the former health-care premium was “hard on low-income wage-earners.”

“Let me be very clear that we are not going to entertain a health-care premium that was done in the past,” Campbell said of the old fee that charged Alberta families up to $1,056 annually. “That was a regressive tax.”

http://calgaryherald.com/news/politi...e-he-has-faced

[edslunch]

Clever Prentice. He's changed the topic to health care

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Oh don't worry. Rich (not even rich) vaguely self sufficient seniors don't get the pension they paid into for 60 years.

Don't worry, Most people who are currently seniors paid such laughably low cpp rates for most of their lives that even though "they paid in for their whole lives" they never came close to actually covering the cost of their own pension.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Don't worry, Most people who are currently seniors paid such laughably low cpp rates for most of their lives that even though "they paid in for their whole lives" they never came close to actually covering the cost of their own pension.

Interesting point. Theoretically any large fund, pension fund, reserve fund, investment fund etc, should be hedged for inflation....a $100 contribution in 1965 should have accumulated enough returned income to satisfy its 2015 value. As well, it's all relative as your current 2015 contribution will be laughably low whenever you retire.

What I was trying to say is that the OAS portion of your contribution is not actually a pension or old age security at all. Anyone who has paid any amount into it and then doesn't qualify for getting it back is getting taxed to the tune of about 15% for their entire working life.

So like I said, don't worry, if rich seniors get off the hook for health care premiums, they will make up for it in OAS clawbacks.

[flamesfan6]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

I'm happy with this. I get a $900 health spending account at work. So it won't cost me a thing.

you may want to check your health plan - they may not cover that, my health spending account doesn't cover mine.