Summer 2014 Prospect Ranking Poll Rd11

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by codynw

the other is a shut down defenceman.

Most guys who ended up as shutdown defensemen in the NHL produced better then he did at the junior level and are at least reliable minute eaters... at this point I'm not sure he can stay healthy enough to even do that (only 71 league games over the last three years).

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by codynw

One is a potential top 6 center that should be putting up points, the other is a stay at home defenceman and he's not expected to put up points.

i believe there are statistics out there that show that any impactful dman in the NHL (ie. regular top4) was getting points as they moved up the ranks of youth and minor hockey. Even the most defensive/shutdown NHL dmen put up points in their youth.

Sieloff would be the exception to the rule if he did become an impactful dman, however, i think most people have seen so little of him, it is hard to justify him as an outlier to the rule that the stats suggest.

A guy like wotherspoon put up 30-40 points in his last few years in portland, whereas sieloff never got close.

[bubbsy]

not to derail the thread, as this topic of Dmen putting up points in junior being critical in assessing if a prospect will make it in the NHL is an extremely fascinating one, but here's an excellent article on the topic:

http://thats-offside.blogspot.ca/201...and-draft.html

[Parallex]

Nm. bubbsy linked to it above.

[FlamesAddiction]

I picked Kanzig, but I already changed my mind. I think it should be Jankowski.

[Poe969]

For me, Kanzig will be soon just because I like him and think he has potential. Hopefully Janko pans out but I think he's more important and valuable to the franchise.

[The Fonz]

I personally believe Kulak, and maybe Culkin, should be higher than Sieloff.

[kermitology]

Jankowski. I agree that if Sieloff hadn't missed a year he'd be gone already, but it's a big concern when a guy misses an entire year during development.

[cannon7]

Went with Arnold. The Flames' scouts have him much higher on their rankings.

[Ulrith]

Choosing between Sieloff and Janko and went Sieloff this time. I think the potential is higher with Janko but even after a couple years he still looks fairly underwhelming to me.

[DJones]

Was stuck between Kanzig and Smith, might be just all the negativity on Jankowski but I'm not all that high on him and I haven't seen him play much.

If Kanzig or Smith can put the pieces together they could be difference makers.

Sieloff is somewhere in there too.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

I'm on the Jankowski wagon this round. SureLoss made a hell of a convincing argument regarding rookie to sophomore points production (as compared to Kreider and Hayes).

I think Janko's ceiling might be the highest left on the board. I nearly voted for Knight because he had such an outstanding rookie season and all signs point to him having a career year this season.

[#-3]

Seiloff, he would already be an NHLer if it were not for some bad luck last year.


Also FYP

Originally Posted by Bingo

Results so far

10. Gillies (finished 2nd in 7th, 8th, and 9th round)

[Imported_Aussie]

Jankowski has the highest ceiling, potential top 6 centre, but also with his frame and room for growth, could even slot in as a depth guy. His college program does seem committed to working on his whole game, which is a plus.
It gets tougher from here, as Smith and McDonald have potential but are so raw, they need to keep progressing. The upside is there though, but it gets into a debate between the new draftees and guys like Kulak, Arnold, Ferland and Knight, who have shown that whilst I wouldn't pencil them in as potential top line/first pairing guys, they look like solid depth players. Seiloff, due to missing that year falls in with the uncertain recent draftees IMO. Next few rounds will be a real mixed bag

[Calgary4LIfe]

Jankowski again - see him as having the highest upside left out of any prospect, and IMO his floor is rising and starting to ease the 'bust' scare around him. Think he is going to be a very, very important player for the Flames in the coming years.

Is it just me, or can you legitimately start comparing the prospects in this round and later available in the poll and compare them to the pre-2010 prospect lists? I think Jankowski has more upside than a guy like Chucko, and is a much better skater than Nemisz with softer hands, etc. Go down the list, and Kulak is probably at the same area (maybe slightly ahead) than TJ Brodie was (though Brodie had an incredible development arc after catching on with the Flames). Guys like Ferland, Culkin, Sieloff, Knight (has he ever fallen this year, and for no good reason as he had an EXCELLENT first year), Arnold who looks like a very good 3rd line center that carries a line defensively and has some offensive abilities.. the list goes on.

I would rank the remaining prospects on par to any year in the past prior to 2010, at least for a couple of years. It may not be better than all of those years - or even any - but I do think the rest of the list is somewhat comparable to full lists of many prior years. To think 10 of the Flames' best prospects (arguable, since many people still have a couple in their top 10 not yet chosen, but you get the idea) have already been chosen, and that this remaining list is actually still fairly comparable speaks volumes about how much big of a step organizationally this franchise has taken.

[RyZ]

Janko now, Kulak next. Kulak

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Jankowski again - see him as having the highest upside left out of any prospect, and IMO his floor is rising and starting to ease the 'bust' scare around him. Think he is going to be a very, very important player for the Flames in the coming years.

Is it just me, or can you legitimately start comparing the prospects in this round and later available in the poll and compare them to the pre-2010 prospect lists? I think Jankowski has more upside than a guy like Chucko, and is a much better skater than Nemisz with softer hands, etc. Go down the list, and Kulak is probably at the same area (maybe slightly ahead) than TJ Brodie was (though Brodie had an incredible development arc after catching on with the Flames). Guys like Ferland, Culkin, Sieloff, Knight (has he ever fallen this year, and for no good reason as he had an EXCELLENT first year), Arnold who looks like a very good 3rd line center that carries a line defensively and has some offensive abilities.. the list goes on.

I would rank the remaining prospects on par to any year in the past prior to 2010, at least for a couple of years. It may not be better than all of those years - or even any - but I do think the rest of the list is somewhat comparable to full lists of many prior years. To think 10 of the Flames' best prospects (arguable, since many people still have a couple in their top 10 not yet chosen, but you get the idea) have already been chosen, and that this remaining list is actually still fairly comparable speaks volumes about how much big of a step organizationally this franchise has taken.

Yup. Was going to say something similar. With the top 10 gone, the next 10 looks something like this:

Jankowski
Sieloff
Arnold
Ferland
Knight
Agostino
Wolf
Smith
McDonald
Ramage

and still going strong

I would put that list up against any from the 2004-09 era.

And that still leaves Kulak, Culkin, Cundari, Kanzig, Hickey, Ollas Mattson, Rafikov and Roy, just on the point.

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Yup. Was going to say something similar. With the top 10 gone, the next 10 looks something like this:

Jankowski
Sieloff
Arnold
Ferland
Knight
Agostino
Wolf
Smith
McDonald
Ramage

and still going strong

I would put that list up against any from the 2004-09 era.

Between Phanuef and Baertschi. I think Backlund is the only prospect we had that could top that list.

And I actually have Kanzig near the top of that list. After seeing him skate this summer, I think he has a good chance of doing well with some strong coaching.

[Nehkara]

This vote for me is a hard one. Agostino, Arnold, Jankowski, and Sieloff all in the running in my mind.

I'm going with Agostino.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Janko easy choice for me here.

After that it gets tricky though. I can see arguments for Sieloff, Agostino, Knight, Ferland, Kanzig, Kulak, Culkin, Arnold or even Smith. Tight grouping coming up.