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Old 04-09-2014, 02:59 PM   #41
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Yeah, they had to cancel the SW Ring Road to pay for this. Sorry.
Quite plausible.
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:09 PM   #42
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This is a great example of a false dichotomy.

The alternative to doing something poorly isn't only not doing it at all. We could also select quality pieces and place them thoughtfully. This seems to be a great example of that, hopefully we see more projects like this and less outlandish light fixtures and overpass fish.
This is true; however, I don't hate pieces of art I don't like. No one should be expecting to like every single piece art that goes up, and this also applies for municipal art projects. Again, it's about personal interpretation. Personally, I'd rather have art I don't prefer rather than no art at all.

If there's anywhere in the process that you can improve upon, it's the selection committee that determines what that art piece will be, and the protocol for the design submission itself (do you hire the artist first? Or, do you solicit the concept? Because if it's the latter, you have to pay people for their time and effort).
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Old 04-09-2014, 03:58 PM   #43
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There was a time when everyone hated the Peace Bridge
There was no such time!

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Yeah, it does looks good, actually.

BTW, is Beltline paying all of its cost or is it being subsidized by all Calgary taxpayers? /just kidding/
You're not getting off the hook that easily.

Yes, the beltline is paying for all of its cost, just like Alberta pays for all of its costs. When you're the one everyone is taking money from, even if they give you a little bit of money back you're still carrying your own weight. If you aren't receiving a net subsidy, you're not actually subsidized at all.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:01 PM   #44
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I don't understand why we can't acquire decent pieces of art for cheaper from local or provincial sources? From what I've seen out of ACAD there's some definite talent there... why not give them some real chances to create something instead of sourcing from New York?
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:06 PM   #45
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I don't understand why we can't acquire decent pieces of art for cheaper from local or provincial sources? From what I've seen out of ACAD there's some definite talent there... why not give them some real chances to create something instead of sourcing from New York?
How much do you think a piece of art should cost? Just curious. I'd also like to know why you think this is an outrageous price (it really isn't).
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:10 PM   #46
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I don't understand why we can't acquire decent pieces of art for cheaper from local or provincial sources? From what I've seen out of ACAD there's some definite talent there... why not give them some real chances to create something instead of sourcing from New York?
Why would local talent be cheaper? Do they buy their materials from some secret discount sources? Also, if they are of equal talent, do they not deserve market rates?

I'm in the creative field (former ACAD grad, and current part-time instructor there), and I welcome the international competition in our city. It raises expectations and quality for everyone. And remember, for every outsider that gets work in Calgary, there's a Calgarian doing work in some other part of the world. Welcome to the new global reality.

I don't think this sculpture is necessary the level of a Bean or giant head by the Bow, but it definitely seems like a nice upgrade from another bronze horse, or having some salmon swimming on an underpass.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:11 PM   #47
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I'm planning to use this as a standin when I shoot the sequel to the blob, I will encourage any interested actresses to show up at the casting session at my offices behind the Sheraton hotel on the North End.

Basically its just not my type of art.

It looks like a giant jelly bean after being microwave.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:15 PM   #48
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The only change I would make to the art policy would that the money could be used in another part of the community instead of say at a interchange.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:20 PM   #49
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Great post Table. Couldn't have said it better.

Also, crazy_eoj - what's wrong with sourcing from New York? There's talented people there too, just as there is here. Calgary and Canada are multicultural societies, and international contributions just add to the diversity and enrichment of the cultural mosaic here. This phenomenon should be encouraged.

czay_eoj's logic is akin to building a hockey team with guys only born in southern Alberta. It's a romantic idea, but very limiting and not really a complete recipe for success. You should have a collection of talent no matter where they're from.

One guy from the city said it best (saw this on CBC); if these types of work were commissioned to only locals, there would be about 3-4 very rich artists and that's it. Very interesting point from someone that actually deals with the art community directly.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:27 PM   #50
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Great post Table. Couldn't have said it better.

Also, crazy_eoj - what's wrong with sourcing from New York? There's talented people there too, just as there is here. Calgary and Canada are multicultural societies, and international contributions just add to the diversity and enrichment of the cultural mosaic here. This phenomenon should be encouraged.

czay_eoj's logic is akin to building a hockey team with guys only born in southern Alberta. It's a romantic idea, but very limiting and not really a complete recipe for success. You should have a collection of talent no matter where they're from.

One guy from the city said it best (saw this on CBC); if these types of work were commissioned to only locals, there would be about 3-4 very rich artists and that's it. Very interesting point from someone that actually deals with the art community directly.
Locals only is a bad idea. Hire the best, expect the best. Calgary should be a world class city, so we need world class art. We should pick the best wherever they live.

It doesn't have to be big or complicated, Copenhagen's little mermaid is unobtrusive, doesn't light up, and has been a recognized symbol of the city for 100 years.

We need more things like that, and we should improve the process so we get less blue rings and overpass fish and more iconic items. I'm not sure exactly how it should be changed, but the status quo definitely leaves something to be desired.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:42 PM   #51
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We need more things like that, and we should improve the process so we get less blue rings and overpass fish and more iconic items. I'm not sure exactly how it should be changed, but the status quo definitely leaves something to be desired.
I think you have to look at who the members of the committee are that approve these projects. Maybe the committee members on the arts projects should have some appropriate background and potentially more credibility. Taste in art is very subjective and as such if board members with a certain flair for art are on the board we might get very polarizing projects.

Of the 9 members currently on the board only 3 actually have a credible backyard in the arts.

Last edited by calgarygeologist; 04-09-2014 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:43 PM   #52
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The biggest reason why we don't exclusively source things locally (be it art or industrial machinery) is that protectionism begets protectionism. Sourcing locally is only economically advantageous if we're the only ones doing it. This is why we negotiate trade agreements - we give up our protectionism in exchange for other places giving up theirs, and then everyone ends up wealthier because we get to specialize in things that we're good at, and import the things we're not as good at. If we start sourcing things from locals only, we've broken the agreement, other places will do the same and we'll lose our export markets.
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Old 04-09-2014, 04:56 PM   #53
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The biggest reason why we don't exclusively source things locally (be it art or industrial machinery) is that protectionism begets protectionism. Sourcing locally is only economically advantageous if we're the only ones doing it. This is why we negotiate trade agreements - we give up our protectionism in exchange for other places giving up theirs, and then everyone ends up wealthier because we get to specialize in things that we're good at, and import the things we're not as good at. If we start sourcing things from locals only, we've broken the agreement, other places will do the same and we'll lose our export markets.
That is one important view point but if were aren't putting money into the local market we can't possibly develop a strong local talent. Do we want to focus on exhibiting art or do we want to try to have a stronger, above-ground, art scene for regional talent?
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Old 04-09-2014, 05:04 PM   #54
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Why would local talent be cheaper? Do they buy their materials from some secret discount sources? Also, if they are of equal talent, do they not deserve market rates?

I'm in the creative field (former ACAD grad, and current part-time instructor there), and I welcome the international competition in our city. It raises expectations and quality for everyone. And remember, for every outsider that gets work in Calgary, there's a Calgarian doing work in some other part of the world. Welcome to the new global reality.

I don't think this sculpture is necessary the level of a Bean or giant head by the Bow, but it definitely seems like a nice upgrade from another bronze horse, or having some salmon swimming on an underpass.
For comparison's sake, which pieces of art from the new art fund have been commissioned out of Calgary? Alberta?

Are our students not capable or producing something of similar quality to the half million dollar blue ring?

I just have a hard time believing we need to send this kind of money so far away to produce similar results. I like the newest piece but I'd like to see more of what our local artists could produce as well. Maybe I'm wrong and we really don't have this kind of talent locally.
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Old 04-09-2014, 05:22 PM   #55
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Are our students not capable or producing something of similar quality to the half million dollar blue ring?
ACAD grads and Calgarians are free to enter just like anyone else. If they haven't been winning the competitions...than perhaps the answer to that question is No.

Also, I'm not sure why you expect a Calgarian to product half-million dollar art for less than half-million dollars.

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I just have a hard time believing we need to send this kind of money so far away to produce similar results.
I do know that even with the blue ring, 80% of the funding actually stayed inside Calgary as most of the budget went to fabrication. A 500k project doesn't mean the artist gets to draw a sketch on a napkin and then he pockets 500k.

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I like the newest piece but I'd like to see more of what our local artists could produce as well. Maybe I'm wrong and we really don't have this kind of talent locally.
We have good talent in Calgary. However often times the best creative talent in Calgary leaves for Toronto, New York, Europe etc just because the market here just isn't that receptive to art. We as a city are not known as a great incubator for creative ideas, so often times people move way. I think that is changing...if slowly.

Still that's only one part of the equation. Local talent has to step up their game if they aren't getting the competition wins, and being exposed to good art helps them do that. You either step up your game or go out of business.
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Old 04-09-2014, 06:58 PM   #56
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My favorite thing on Calgarypuck is when people who know stuff, say stuff.
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Old 04-09-2014, 08:06 PM   #57
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Locals only is a bad idea. Hire the best, expect the best. Calgary should be a world class city, so we need world class art. We should pick the best wherever they live.

It doesn't have to be big or complicated, Copenhagen's little mermaid is unobtrusive, doesn't light up, and has been a recognized symbol of the city for 100 years.

We need more things like that, and we should improve the process so we get less blue rings and overpass fish and more iconic items. I'm not sure exactly how it should be changed, but the status quo definitely leaves something to be desired.
I like the overpass art. Making boring industrial things look nice is a good use of the 1%. I definitely at using the money in the area of the project.
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Old 04-09-2014, 08:58 PM   #58
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I'm giving it less than 24 hrs to be urinated on. Once the common shopping cart pushing belt line folk get a shot at its game over. I suggest having the color somehow change to bright yellow in the event of contact with human urine. This will tip off the general public and law enforcement to deal with the situation.

Now that's art
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Old 04-10-2014, 01:11 AM   #59
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Even (Sun columnist) Michael Platt likes it, but somehow that's a slight against the policy that allowed it to exist.
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Old 04-10-2014, 07:03 AM   #60
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Walked by it yesterday, couldn't take a picture as I had a latte in each hand though.

Looks awesome, can't wait to see it finished.
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