Will Gretzky's numbers ever be broken?

[habernac]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

His 50 goals in 39 games was it? That's a tough one to break.

50 goals before January!!!!!! I remember then how insane it seemed. IT's even moreso now.

[albertGQ]

Fun fact: Gretzky's 50 in 39 record. The one Wayne himself says is one of his favourite records and one most say is the hardest to break is actually not an NHL official record. The NHL does not have a record for fastest 50 goals. But they do have one for most goals in the first 50 games of the regular season. Which Wayne holds with 61.

[albertGQ]

Originally Posted by habernac

50 goals before January!!!!!! I remember then how insane it seemed. IT's even moreso now.

He scored 100 points before Christmas that year too.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by username

I remember in Rock em Sock em 3 (yes I'm that old) Don Cherry talking about the only stat that will never be broken and it's hard to argue this:

Bobby Orr finished the 70/71 season a +124

That is incredible, +40 will win it these days.

This was talked about before somewhere, that +124 included PP goals, still a great stat but I suspect Gretzky's +98 in 84/85 without PP goals would have crushed that mark.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by wretched34

Based on career production, had Lemieux stayed healthy, and played the same amount of games as Gretzky, he would have surpassed the Great One in goals, by 227, giving him the all time record of 1121. Gretzky would hold the assists record, by a margin of 284, leaving the points record to Gretzky by a margin of 57.
Lemieux scored at a 0.75GPG rate, compared to Gretzky's 0.60GPG. Gretzky however had 1.32APG compared to Lemieux's 1.12APG. Gretzky's PPG was 1.92, Lemieux's was 1.88.
By Far, the 2 greatest players of all time.

Assuming Lemieux would continue to produce at the same pace is a big if.

Players slow down at the end of the their career. (I know he missed some in the middle too, but not enough)

And you can add 'if's to Gretzky's numbers too

[Locke]

Hockey when Gretzky played and hockey now are so far apart its hard to believe they're even the same game. Barring making hockey nets the size of soccer nets its never going to happen.

That said, its also pretty pointless to trot Gretz's records out and use them as comparisons for anything or anyone other than players who were in the league at the same time as him.

[FireGilbert]

The 51 game point streak is one of his most impressive as well. Lemieux came close and might have broke the record if not for injury though. This would be incredibly difficult to beat in the modern game but is not entirely impossible since you only need one point per game.

I will also add that I do not see any of the single season scoring records, or his assist records being broken but the goals record is achievable. Ovechkin is going to come close but I think Stamkos has a better chance. If he plays until he is 40, he only needs to average about 40 goals per year.

Also, interesting fact, Gretzky would have even more records if he was considered a rookie his first season.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by T@T

This was talked about before somewhere, that +124 included PP goals, still a great stat but I suspect Gretzky's +98 in 84/85 without PP goals would have crushed that mark.

No it didn't.

In the 1971 season Orr was on the ice for 258 goals and 85 goals against. If they counted special teams his plus/minus would be +173.

However, he was on the ice for 79 power play goals which aren't counted in the total and 30 short handed goals.

Using today's conventional +/- we arrive at the +124 rating. ((258-79)-(85-30))http://www.hockey-reference.com/players/o/orrbo01.html

[albertGQ]

Fun fact. Gretzky's 51 game point scoring streak is actually 2 records. One for longest scoring streak & one for longest scoring streak to start a season. He actually scored a point in 9 straight games to end the season prior so if hockey kept stats like baseball, his record would actually be a 60 game point scoring streak.

[FireGilbert]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

Fun fact. Gretzky's 51 game point scoring streak is actually 2 records. One for longest scoring streak & one for longest scoring streak to start a season. He actually scored a point in 9 straight games to end the season prior so if hockey kept stats like baseball, his record would actually be a 60 game point scoring streak.

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten about that. I believe Gretzky himself considers the streak to be 60 games.

The streak is even more impressive when you consider he was so badly injured by the end of it he had to miss 6 games.

[flamesfan1297]

Watch out Gretzky, here comes gaudreau.

[albertGQ]

And he averaged exactly 3 points per game in that streak too.

153 points!

[flamesfan1297]

That's ridiculous. 3 point average per game is amazing, but to keep that going for 51 games is unheard of

[burn_baby_burn]

The game has changed too much for anyone (in today's NHL) to even come close to Gretzky. Goalie training, coaching, and equipment are far more superior. Defensive systems and specialized coaching. The influx of European talent in today's NHL. All the stars aligned for Gretzky to put up those kinds of numbers.

For similiar reasons we will never see anyone hit .400 in MLB either. Unless of course, there are significant rule changes to increase offense in the future.

[albertGQ]

Gretzky is my favourite player of all time so here's another fun fact.

One season where Wayne played 74 games, he got at least one point in 72 of them.
Another season he played a full 80 games and got at least on point in 77 of them.

Now that is just insane.

[BigTuna]

There's just no chance Gretky's point total will be broken. He's ridiculously ahead of everyone and scoring is down so much.

He has more assists alone than anyone in NHL history has total points. think about that for a second...

[wretched34]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Assuming Lemieux would continue to produce at the same pace is a big if.

Players slow down at the end of the their career. (I know he missed some in the middle too, but not enough)

And you can add 'if's to Gretzky's numbers too

Considering Lemieux's health through the majority of his career, I think it's safe to say his production did slow, and the stats take that into account, much like a player towards the end of their career. Had Lemieux been healthy for the better part of his career, those numbers would be higher, then extend the career as long as Gretzky's, and I think he would have blown Gretzky's goal record away by a mile. But even playing injured, which he did for a long time, he was still putting up better GPG totals than Gretzky.

[Dion]

Not with the equipment goaltenders are wearing today.

[Jer Bu]

Total career points? No problem.

Just need a player to put together twenty-nine or thirty 100 point seasons in a row. Start at age 18. Play until your 47, and put up 100 points every single year.

Done.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

The toughest Gretzky number to exceed will be 99.

IIRC, he wore that number with every team he played for in the NHL.

They would have to add an extra digit to the jersey to go any higher, and I just don't see the NHL allowing that.