[Rumour] Update: Devils sold to Josh Harris

[Devils'Advocate]

You can't compare the Rock numbers with Swamp numbers. When they played at Brendan Byrne they had the most expensive seats in the league as they figured they would make more profit selling fewer tickets at a higher price since they were closer to the more affluent neighbourhoods. Now that they are in Newark, they lowered their prices and are trying to draw more fans. You can't compare the two situations.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

You can't compare the Rock numbers with Swamp numbers. When they played at Brendan Byrne they had the most expensive seats in the league as they figured they would make more profit selling fewer tickets at a higher price since they were closer to the more affluent neighbourhoods. Now that they are in Newark, they lowered their prices and are trying to draw more fans. You can't compare the two situations.

Their numbers have been worse in Newark prior to this season...

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by Sec218

Move them back to KC. Bring back the Scouts!

Move them to Quebec blargh blah slobber blargh

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

It was a shorten season coming off a Stanley Cup Finals appearance. The Islanders, already relocating, are coming off 5 straight playoff misses, Dallas missed the last 4 and the Avs iced the worst team Colorado has seen.

If the Devils have trouble getting 15,000 in a full season when they are Stanley Cup favourites like in the early 2000s what's going to happen when they go on a couple years drought?

Who played Pittsburgh in round 1?

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Who played Pittsburgh in round 1?

Islanders did...they were coming off 5 straight playoff misses to start the season. Sorry if not clear.

Edit: Just like Dallas had missed the last 4, they are now at 5 after this season.

And I mean it wasn't until April that the Islanders really entered the playoff race. 75% through the season. Early March, half way through the season, they were fighting for dead last with Florida in that conference so for the majority of this season this wasn't looking any different than the last couple years.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Who played Pittsburgh in round 1?

Who put that series on the schedule before the regular season started? Going into the 2012-13 season, the Islanders had indeed missed the playoffs five years running, and the Devils were coming off an appearance in the Cup finals.

I hope you're not trying to argue that people stayed away from the Devils' home games because they had a message from the future saying that the team was destined to miss the playoffs that year.

[Geeoff]

I would kill for the Flames to have the Devils' consistency. It's ridiculous that they don't make money when they are the 2nd best team in the league over the last 20 years.

[4oh3]

I don't understand why the gta would want 2 teams

[Flashpoint]

The NHL can afford to keep teams in whatever markets it wants.

Indefinitely.

Period.

For one very very good reason. Actually 3 reasons.

Toronto Maple Leafs, is now worth $521 million and generated $81.8 million in operating income last season. The New York Rangers, who are enjoying the benefits of playing in a refurbished Madison Square Garden, earned $41.4 million last year and are the NHL’s second-most valuable team, worth $507 million. And the Montreal Canadiens, placing third with a $445 million valuation, earned $47.7 million. Thus the top three teams posted an aggregate operating profit greater than the rest of the league combined.

Forbes


That kind of income means you can basically do whatever you want with the rest of the league.

[neo45]

I wonder if the Habs will become the second most expensive team if MSG finally goes

[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by Geeoff

I would kill for the Flames to have the Devils' consistency. It's ridiculous that they don't make money when they are the 2nd best team in the league over the last 20 years.

The reason Vanderbeek has to sell is not because of operating profit/losses. It's because they took on way too much debt to build the arena and Vanderbeek suffered HUGE personal financial losses. I do not fear for the long term viability of the franchise in New Jersey.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

I bet the Devils have a new owner before the start of the season.

As for the attendance, last year, despite icing a crappy team, they were right neck and neck with the Rangers in terms of attendance. It was the Islanders that were dead last in the area in attendance, drawing a horrible 13,000 average. I hear far more about the Devils attendance woes than I hear about the Islanders or Dallas or Colorado....

Confirmation bias dude.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

It's not the on ice product, that's for sure. Poor marketing? Errh maybe. Oversaturation? Probably getting warmer.

The Islanders are now going to move to Brooklyn, about a half hour closer to Newark. The arenas are only going to be 20 kms apart.

Poor marketing is definitely part of it, I had a friend who briefly worked in the Devils front office and was extremely unimpressed. Oversaturation? Probably getting colder. There are 22 million people in the NYC metro area, and in terms of fan bases they're pretty spread out.

People love to look at maps and say 'oh the rinks are only x distance apart' but the fact is that the markets are completely different, and they're separated by a river that acts as a bit of a mental barrier to a large part of the market. The Devils don't draw heavily from Manhattan or Long Island, it's not really their fan base. The Devils base is in NJ and the Westchester area of NY (although that's still more of a Rangers area). The Rangers draw largely from Manhattan, Westchester, Connecticut and parts of Long Island. The Islanders draw pretty much exclusively from Long Island. The Isles move will be interesting, but they won't need to keep all of their existing fan base coming if they can successfully pull in those Islander fans who didn't go to games because they live in NYC.

I'd say the largest reason for the Devils less than stellar attendance is the arena location and an inability to get people to look past their perceptions of that location. Newark is not nice. Most people aren't all that excited to drive to Newark on a tuesday night. But, the area around the arena is fine and the access is easy. The Devils seem to have struggled to convince people of this though, which I can't explain.

They've also done a poor job of reaching into the market across the river. It's a pretty easy trip from Manhattan (the return trip needs work, NJ Transit is brutal for scheduling gaps that leave you on a platform for 30 minutes), maybe 20 minutes further than MSG (train is literally directly below the Garden), but people don't seem to even have a Devils game on their radar around Manhattan. There are a lot of transplants here who could easily be swayed to being Devils fans if the effort was put in.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Flashpoint

The NHL can afford to keep teams in whatever markets it wants.

Indefinitely.

Period.

For one very very good reason. Actually 3 reasons.


Forbes


That kind of income means you can basically do whatever you want with the rest of the league.

If the league made that money, you would be right. Instead, it is the three teams that make the money; the league doesn't see any of that profit and has no legal power to take it away. So it's irrelevant to the question of supporting weaker franchises.

[Locke]

I attribute this directly to the phenomena of Patrick Warburton getting more consistent acting work and thus spending less time supporting the Devils.

[Stranger]

Originally Posted by Locke

I attribute this directly to the phenomena of Patrick Warburton getting more consistent acting work and thus spending less time supporting the Devils.

And bring back the green in the jerseys! That should help.

[dustygoon]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

The reason Vanderbeek has to sell is not because of operating profit/losses. It's because they took on way too much debt to build the arena and Vanderbeek suffered HUGE personal financial losses. I do not fear for the long term viability of the franchise in New Jersey.

Yes it is because of operating profits not meeting expectations (attendance, ticket prices, costs, whatever). The debt was layered on using a given forecast of cash flows. A margin of safety was built in. And the cash flows are now worse than those projections even after considering the margin of safety. So too much debt vs actual cash flows that the team delivers.

[sureLoss]

Howard Eskin is reporting the sale of the Devils is done:

Howard Eskin ‏@howardeskin 7m
Sources confirm #sixers owner josh harris has agreed on the money to purchase #NJdevils. The purchase will cover all debt of jeff vanderbeek

Howard Eskin ‏@howardeskin 6m
#njdevil owner jeff vanderbeek has really lost to the bank but #sixers owner josh harris will cover that money. Done deal

[Buff]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Howard Eskin is reporting the sale of the Devils is done:

Howard Eskin ‏@howardeskin 7m
Sources confirm #sixers owner josh harris has agreed on the money to purchase #NJdevils. The purchase will cover all debt of jeff vanderbeek

Howard Eskin ‏@howardeskin 6m
#njdevil owner jeff vanderbeek has really lost to the bank but #sixers owner josh harris will cover that money. Done deal

About time. This saga went on for far too long.

[TurnedTheCorner]

I hope this gets finalized on a Monday.