[News] NHL looking to expand on ‘European business plan’

[BACKCHECK!!!]

Originally Posted by valo403

You pretty much make my point for me right there. One team looks at it like that. The other looks at it as another pre-season game.

I don't care what argument you buy, the fact of the matter is that those games do not matter to NHL teams and are used to prepare for games that do. Talk to me when a European club team beats an NHL team in a game that has equal stakes for both teams.

You seem pretty confident about the motivation levels of the teams involved.

Did you actually watch the Victoria Cup games? Because I did, and they were pretty intense. Ive never heard any of the players say: "Well, going over to Switzerland and playing against the European Champions for the Victoria Cup was okay, but nothing like that mid-season game against Minnesota."

A poster here claimed that if there was a hockey champions league, it would be a bloodbath. And people like yourself are making 'woulda, coulda, shoulda' arguments about how the NHL teams woulda/coulda/shoulda walked all over the Europeans.

I'm just pointing out that there was a champions league. It was not a bloodbath. And it doesn't matter that Chicago woulda/coulda/shoulda won, because Zurich DID win, and that's what counts.

I wouldn't try to excuse it by saying "Oh, well they only won because they wanted it more and worked harder" as if that means they deserve the win less, when in fact it means they deserved it more.

[Joborule]

NHL can only help build interest in Europe and increase the significance of the leagues there. They can't do teams over there though due to distance and timezone disparity.

In the long term, when the quality of skill between all the leagues become more even, maybe the NHL can join with the other leagues in making a true 'World Champion' tournament, where the winners from each league play to be the best of the best. Sort of like a Final Four, with the NHL, KHL and other leagues.

If that's to happen though, I think NHL would have to reduce their regular season schedule down to 72 games or less since you'll be demanding the NHL champs too much playing hockey until possibly the middle of July, and start up their next season in 8 weeks. This tournament would have to end when the Stanley Cup ends now. But due to the fact that the NHL owners may lose money from cutting down from 10 games, and not really gaining anything from this world championship (only one of the 30 teams does get gain), it most likely wouldn't happen.

[Sakari]

You could compare this to how Canada got beat by Russia in the WJC.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

Originally Posted by Sakari

You could compare this to how Canada got beat by Russia in the WJC.

Or World Championships.

[icarus]

Originally Posted by Daryei

I agree. I used to go to watch hockey (any hockey) at F3K in West Kensington. The manager would draw hockey fans from all over London (Russians, Canadians, Swedes, Finns, you name it), and when some Brit came in complaining that they wanted to watch the footie instead, he said that the amount of business he did for tourneys like the World Cup would pay for his TV subscriptions (12 or so satellites on the roof) for the rest of the year.

Is the Famous 3 Kings still like that? It's just up the road from me but I've never gone in because it looks like a total dive. But if it's hockey friendly, I'll be there with bells on!

[Hoser]

I could see an NIT kind of tournament working. Top 4 NHL teams that don't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs, play the top 12 qualifiers from the KHL/Elitserien/DEL/SM-Liiga in a 16 team tournament.
Stanley Cup remains the ultimate trophy in hockey.
You expand the NHL presence in Europe with meaningful games with NHL teams.
Benefit for those NHL that just miss the playoffs, their fans etc. get something to cheer about.
Question is would European teams be slighted by playing "second rate" NHL teams?

[Sakari]

Originally Posted by Hoser

I could see an NIT kind of tournament working. Top 4 NHL teams that don't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs, play the top 12 qualifiers from the KHL/Elitserien/DEL/SM-Liiga in a 16 team tournament.
Stanley Cup remains the ultimate trophy in hockey.
You expand the NHL presence in Europe with meaningful games with NHL teams.
Benefit for those NHL that just miss the playoffs, their fans etc. get something to cheer about.
Question is would European teams be slighted by playing "second rate" NHL teams?

Would they like to play a team with the likes of Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Jarome Iginla, Fleury, Morrow, Letang, etc?

Kane, Toews, Hossa, Sharp...?

Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Fasth?

Probably not.

Then again, sometimes play style>skill.

[Matty81]

Originally Posted by Hoser

I could see an NIT kind of tournament working. Top 4 NHL teams that don't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs, play the top 12 qualifiers from the KHL/Elitserien/DEL/SM-Liiga in a 16 team tournament.
Stanley Cup remains the ultimate trophy in hockey.
You expand the NHL presence in Europe with meaningful games with NHL teams.
Benefit for those NHL that just miss the playoffs, their fans etc. get something to cheer about.
Question is would European teams be slighted by playing "second rate" NHL teams?

That's a really creative idea... hadn't thought of the possibility. Unfortunately the NHL players union would almost certainly kibosh it unless they got megabucks. They seem to view anything that isn't written in to the collective agreement as leverage to squeeze more money out of the system.

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

You seem pretty confident about the motivation levels of the teams involved.

Did you actually watch the Victoria Cup games? Because I did, and they were pretty intense. Ive never heard any of the players say: "Well, going over to Switzerland and playing against the European Champions for the Victoria Cup was okay, but nothing like that mid-season game against Minnesota."

A poster here claimed that if there was a hockey champions league, it would be a bloodbath. And people like yourself are making 'woulda, coulda, shoulda' arguments about how the NHL teams woulda/coulda/shoulda walked all over the Europeans.

I'm just pointing out that there was a champions league. It was not a bloodbath. And it doesn't matter that Chicago woulda/coulda/shoulda won, because Zurich DID win, and that's what counts.

I wouldn't try to excuse it by saying "Oh, well they only won because they wanted it more and worked harder" as if that means they deserve the win less, when in fact it means they deserved it more.

By now you should know that when our North American friends lose to the rest of the world, it's always only because they didn't care to win

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by Hoser

I could see an NIT kind of tournament working. Top 4 NHL teams that don't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs, play the top 12 qualifiers from the KHL/Elitserien/DEL/SM-Liiga in a 16 team tournament.
Stanley Cup remains the ultimate trophy in hockey.
You expand the NHL presence in Europe with meaningful games with NHL teams.
Benefit for those NHL that just miss the playoffs, their fans etc. get something to cheer about.
Question is would European teams be slighted by playing "second rate" NHL teams?

I like this idea and I think that they should have it so IF one of the NHL teams wins the tournament, they get the first overall pick. You need something tangible at stake and I think that would do it.

I don't think the European teams would be slighted. If you look at last season, the four teams in the tournament would be Calgary, Dallas, Buffalo and Colorado. They would get to see NHL stars like Iginla, Morrow, Duchene, Landeskog, Miller, Vanek, etc.

[TheGrimm]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

I like this idea and I think that they should have it so IF one of the NHL teams wins the tournament, they get the first overall pick. You need something tangible at stake and I think that would do it.

I don't think the European teams would be slighted. If you look at last season, the four teams in the tournament would be Calgary, Dallas, Buffalo and Colorado. They would get to see NHL stars like Iginla, Morrow, Duchene, Landeskog, Miller, Vanek, etc.

I am curious, if the winner gets the first overall pick, how do you do the rest? 2nd goes to the 30th place team etc etc? I don't mind it.

I've been thinking for a long time that the NHL needs to do something to give the teams outside of the playoffs something to play for.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Hoser

I could see an NIT kind of tournament working. Top 4 NHL teams that don't make the Stanley Cup Playoffs, play the top 12 qualifiers from the KHL/Elitserien/DEL/SM-Liiga in a 16 team tournament.
Stanley Cup remains the ultimate trophy in hockey.
You expand the NHL presence in Europe with meaningful games with NHL teams.
Benefit for those NHL that just miss the playoffs, their fans etc. get something to cheer about.
Question is would European teams be slighted by playing "second rate" NHL teams?

European teams are 4th or 5th rate NHL teams so why would they be slighted by playing NHL teams?

Champions League won't work because why would an NHL team care about winning a meaningless competition against sub-par competition?

Backcheck can try and rationalize his BS about the Blackhawks caring about winning that game but there is no way they are going all out just like we see guys in pre-season games going half speed to avoid injuries and try to work on specific things getting ready for the season that actually matters.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

I like this idea and I think that they should have it so IF one of the NHL teams wins the tournament, they get the first overall pick. You need something tangible at stake and I think that would do it.

Getting the 1st overall pick would be motivation for the team management and something for the fans to cheer for but not a motivational factor for most of the players. I can't see the players of the 4 best teams not in the playoffs interested in this tournament unless mega money is involved.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

You seem pretty confident about the motivation levels of the teams involved.

Did you actually watch the Victoria Cup games? Because I did, and they were pretty intense. Ive never heard any of the players say: "Well, going over to Switzerland and playing against the European Champions for the Victoria Cup was okay, but nothing like that mid-season game against Minnesota."

A poster here claimed that if there was a hockey champions league, it would be a bloodbath. And people like yourself are making 'woulda, coulda, shoulda' arguments about how the NHL teams woulda/coulda/shoulda walked all over the Europeans.

I'm just pointing out that there was a champions league. It was not a bloodbath. And it doesn't matter that Chicago woulda/coulda/shoulda won, because Zurich DID win, and that's what counts.

I wouldn't try to excuse it by saying "Oh, well they only won because they wanted it more and worked harder" as if that means they deserve the win less, when in fact it means they deserved it more.

You made my argument for me previously.

A lot of the European players are playing the biggest games of their lives, and are not afraid to pay the price to win it.

Does that statement apply to a single player on the roster of that Blackhawks team playing a pre-season exhibition game? Give me a simple yes or no.

[afc wimbledon]

I think it is a foolish assumption to think the KHL has any interest in helping the NHL get a foothold in europe, I doubt they would have anything to do with any 'champions league' that in any way threatened to help put an NHL team in Moscow or St Petersburg

[nik-]

Originally Posted by moon

Champions League won't work because why would an NHL team care about winning a meaningless competition against sub-par competition?

If they don't care, then they lose, and that's their choice. If they made the prize a purse, 50/50 to the team and players, I'm sure they could make them care.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by nik-

If they don't care, then they lose, and that's their choice. If they made the prize a purse, 50/50 to the team and players, I'm sure they could make them care.

Sounds like really compelling hockey there, sign me up. Can't wait to watch a tournament where half the teams have no interest in being there.

[nik-]

I bet in a 16 team tournament the 12 teams from the other leagues would love to take their shot at an NHL team. If the NHL players want to get embarrassed, that's their decision.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by nik-

I bet in a 16 team tournament the 12 teams from the other leagues would love to take their shot at an NHL team. If the NHL players want to get embarrassed, that's their decision.

They already have tournaments featuring the best European teams. If you want to watch Moscow play Berlin you can do that, as I said, it already exists. I for one have no interest in watching Moscow play a bunch of disinterested NHL players who just want to get their season over with.

[nik-]

Then don't watch. I'm betting a lot of people would love to see it, which is why the NHL is discussing it.