The Montreal Student Riots

[Lil Pedro]

Does anyone else find this somewhat amusing: students there are complaining about tuition cost rising, so they take to the streets and protest and stop going to school. When it's all said and done, they're gonna end up paying more money per semester AND will have to make up that semester lost (which means they'll have to pay more money than they first anticipated).
Way to go Quebec university students, way to think this one through.

[Caged Great]

Normally I have respect for people protesting things that they believe in.

This time though, what a bunch of whiners. Maybe those people should go look up costs to any US school, or even ones in other provinces instead and STFU.

[schteve_d]

Just part of the learning process for our dear young Quebecois brothers and sisters. They might as well learn to start whining and causing a selfish ruckus now.

As proper Quebeckers this will likely come in more handy for them than any real education could.

[Stranger]

How many more nights of this before they call in the army to help out?

[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Normally I have respect for people protesting things that they believe in.

This time though, what a bunch of whiners. Maybe those people should go look up costs to any US school, or even ones in other provinces instead and STFU.

You can't always say "those people over there have it worse than I do, so I'm not going to demand better". Heck, the GMG thread is full of people complaining about things when others have it worse off.

Like I said, they could be looking at Sweden or France where there is NO tuition.

[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by Lil Pedro

Does anyone else find this somewhat amusing: students there are complaining about tuition cost rising, so they take to the streets and protest and stop going to school. When it's all said and done, they're gonna end up paying more money per semester AND will have to make up that semester lost (which means they'll have to pay more money than they first anticipated).
Way to go Quebec university students, way to think this one through.

Sometimes short-term pain is worth long-term gain.

Strikes often hurt those participating as they never gain the wages back that they lose during the strike. However, if it produces benefits for those that join the company down the road, then the sacrifice was worth it. If you view the world only in terms of self-interest, then yeah, these students likely won't benefit from their actions. But I think you have to look at what the next generation has to contend with if tuition keeps rising the way that it has across the rest of Canada.

[Northendzone]

phase II of the protest involves the students asking that the government just waive thier requirements for this semester and just issue passing grades.......

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

phase II of the protest involves the students asking that the government just waive thier requirements for this semester and just issue passing grades.......

that should apply to the people who tried to attend class but were threatened or disrupted.

I think that the protestors should have all of their credits deleted and they should have to start over again in grade 6.

[undercoverbrother]

Maybe a bit off topic.

But what is the comparision between schools? I would like to know.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Maybe a bit off topic.

But what is the comparision between schools? I would like to know.

MacLeans has a really good university comparison issue every year, it might be online.

http://oncampus.macleans.ca/educatio...ty-rankings-2/

The magazine itself does a great job of comparing schools, the above is just the rankings.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

MacLeans has a really good university comparison issue every year, it might be online.

http://oncampus.macleans.ca/educatio...ty-rankings-2/

The magazine itself does a great job of comparing schools, the above is just the rankings.

I have looked at that before, but didn't see an actual dollar value.

[CaptainCrunch]

ah, found this on Statscan for you links at the bottom

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quoti...10916b-eng.htm

[CaptainCrunch]

Couldn't find a school by school though

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

ah, found this on Statscan for you links at the bottom

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quoti...10916b-eng.htm

link gives me the option to do a survey

thanks thou

[CaptainCrunch]

http://www.globecampus.ca/navigator/

My post vanished, see at the bottom.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

http://www.globecampus.ca/navigator/

My post vanished, see at the bottom.

so quick comparision......can't see what their issue is

[Devils'Advocate]

Their issue is that they have traditionally had affordable tuition and they would like to see it stay that way. Just because the rest of Canada is willing to go into oppressive debt before even starting into the work force doesn't mean our way is right and their way is wrong.

BTW - My good friend Evan went to jail for pie-ing Chretien over the issue of affordable education. So there were some people that were willing to go to the mat other than in Quebec... just that they are outnumbered by students resigned to paying more and more of the cost because they don't want to make waves.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Their issue is that they have traditionally had affordable tuition and they would like to see it stay that way. Just because the rest of Canada is willing to go into oppressive debt before even starting into the work force doesn't mean our way is right and their way is wrong.

BTW - My good friend Evan went to jail for pie-ing Chretien over the issue of affordable education. So there were some people that were willing to go to the mat other than in Quebec... just that they are outnumbered by students resigned to paying more and more of the cost because they don't want to make waves.

Hate to say it but your friend should have gone to jail. I hate Chretien with a passion, but that's physical assault more then its a acceptable protest, just like these thugs hurling rocks and molitov cocktails.

The government of quebec should have never gone to the table with the protestors as soon as the protests took on a violent edge.

And lets define affordable tuition, if you reduced it by a third there would still be groups whining for less.

Tuition is an investment into your future earning potential. Governments simply don't have enough money to keep subsidizing it at an increasing level, and average Joe citizen is already taxed enough.

The Quebec government is basically broke, so sadly their lavish social programs are going to have to take a hit. And Students are going to have to either pay more, or pay the same and accept less in the ways of service or accesibility to programs.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Their issue is that they have traditionally had affordable tuition and they would like to see it stay that way. Just because the rest of Canada is willing to go into oppressive debt before even starting into the work force doesn't mean our way is right and their way is wrong.

BTW - My good friend Evan went to jail for pie-ing Chretien over the issue of affordable education. So there were some people that were willing to go to the mat other than in Quebec... just that they are outnumbered by students resigned to paying more and more of the cost because they don't want to make waves.

But is a few hundred dollars a term really what separates affordable education and having to go into oppressive debt? Tuition going up by $1000 isn't why people I know who go on a couple of tropical vacations every year and can't be bothered to work during their education are graduating $50K in debt. I know some older people who are still paying off student loans from the '90s in BC when tuition was frozen under $2K a year. It was very affordable back then and people were still going into debt.

It's not like there aren't a lot of ways to mitigate the costs of education. When I went through university tuition was about $5000 a year and I estimate I paid only about 10% of that ($500 a year) out of my own pocket. Scholarships, bursaries, grants from student loans, and tax credits covered the rest.

Living costs were and are the biggest expense and I worked weekends and summers to pay for those. I can understand people in more daunting fields of study (engineering, medicine, law, etc.) wouldn't have time for work during the school year, but most programs with that kind of workload lead to well paying jobs so it's a short term sacrifice for long term gain.

University education should always be affordable for virtually any Canadian citizen, but that doesn't mean it should be extremely cheap or free for everyone. There's no reason an able bodied person without dependents shouldn't be expected to earn money during the summers and live a fairly modest life while in university. There should be more programs to help the people who actually can't live without the help (people suffering in poverty or who have dependents they must support), but that only applies to a minority of students.

[MarchHare]

I went to one of the most expensive universities in the country (Mount Allison) where tuition was more than $6k/year while I was a student, yet I was completely debt-free within a year of graduating. How could I have avoided crushing student debt if my tuition was double the proposed rate that the protesters in Quebec are rioting against? I worked a student job every summer and put every last penny towards my education. No beer money, no spring break trips to Mexico, no luxuries, nothing.

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man complaining about the damn kids these days, but seriously! The protesters are disrupting classes over a mere $325/year tuition increase. That's less than a week's salary working a minimum wage job in Quebec. Nobody who could otherwise afford a university education will be deterred by that trivial amount.

If I was in my final semester of studies and just wanted to graduate so I could enter the workforce, I'd be absolutely furios with the rioters. If the students lose their semester because of the protests, their graduation and entry into the workforce will be delayed by six months. Assuming they could have landed an entry-level job earning $45-50k out of school, they're poised to lose $22.5-25k of lifetime earnings because some troublemakers would rather skip class than pay a mere $325 extra per year.