Revenge of the Sith

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally posted by nfotiu+May 4 2005, 03:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (nfotiu @ May 4 2005, 03:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

You feel nauseous? Why? Cause George wants to make some money?

How about supply and demand? People want it, and George is giving it to them.

I don't blame him one bit.

Pass the Star Wars M&M's please.

It's better than the product placement trend that is so prevalent these days. Until yoda starts drinking a coke in the movie, or obi-wan buys the new BMW land speeder, I don't see the reason to complain. Star Wars has been into the cross-promotion game from day 1. Why not have someone else pay to market your movie? [/b][/quote]
I'm still waiting for the next version of the Empire Strikes Back with the added scene where Lando is seen in his state room contemplating the deal he's made with Vader while drinking a cold Colt .45

Meanwhile Luke is flying to Bespin and doing some light saber maintenance where he's changing the duracell batteries in the hint.

The after Solo is frozen in carbonite, Lando leans over and checks the controls and says he's in perfect hibernation, and quit well protected and Vader quips "secure, like people who have used the Freedom 55 life insurance policy"

To be honest I did like the first two movies, but a lot of people are still judging this on a movie by movie basis, whereas you can't really pass judgement til you see the last movie and we can see how it integrates into the OT.

Just my two cents

[Calgary Flames]

Originally posted by ernie+May 4 2005, 09:45 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (ernie @ May 4 2005, 09:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-MarchHare@May 4 2005, 08:02 AM
What really bugs me is Anakin's character. In the original trilogy we're lead to believe that he was once a good and noble man who fell to evil and temptation. But all we see in Episode II is a guy who's alternatively a whiney brat or an arrogant jerk. There's absolutely nothing sympathetic about his character at all.

It's almost as if he was...gasp...a teenager. [/b][/quote]
No shinguard... The complaints about a 9 year old Anakin in Episode I are equally laughable.

He's a goddamn 9 year old kid!

[Calgary Flames]

Here's a post by Kevin Smith himself in defense of his "Fan boy-ism" Makes some decent points. Bravo Silent Bob!

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/vine/showthr...369#post6546369

Except Jersey Girl...

[MarchHare]

Originally posted by ernie+May 4 2005, 09:45 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (ernie @ May 4 2005, 09:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-MarchHare@May 4 2005, 08:02 AM
What really bugs me is Anakin's character. In the original trilogy we're lead to believe that he was once a good and noble man who fell to evil and temptation. But all we see in Episode II is a guy who's alternatively a whiney brat or an arrogant jerk. There's absolutely nothing sympathetic about his character at all.

It's almost as if he was...gasp...a teenager. [/b][/quote]
He's also a Jedi...maybe I just hold them to unrealistic expectations, but I always figured Jedi weren't supposed to be whiny or arrogant.

It just doesn't make sense to me...we're supposed to believe that Anakin was once a good person, but I saw nothing of him in Episode II to back that up.

[ernie]

Originally posted by MarchHare+May 4 2005, 10:11 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (MarchHare @ May 4 2005, 10:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

It's almost as if he was...gasp...a teenager.

He's also a Jedi...maybe I just hold them to unrealistic expectations, but I always figured Jedi weren't supposed to be whiny or arrogant.

It just doesn't make sense to me...we're supposed to believe that Anakin was once a good person, but I saw nothing of him in Episode II to back that up. [/b][/quote]
Jedi who follow the light side should be above base emotions and actions such as selflishness etc. Those who fall the dark side are susceptible to such things.

[MarchHare]

Jedi who follow the light side should be above base emotions and actions such as selflishness etc. Those who fall the dark side are susceptible to such things.

Fair enough.

I'm still having trouble reconciling Obi Wan's speech to Luke in Return of the Jedi (all about how Anakin was a good man, etc.) to what we saw of Anakin in Episode II. There's nothing to indicate that he ever was that good.

[CaptainCrunch]

I don't think he was a bad person in the second one, but he was a person that was a slave, and even when he was freed he was still a slave.

He was a slave to the jedi council because of his fear of loss.

He was a slave to his mother because he was afraid to lose her.

He was a slave to a feeling of helplessness which explains his lust for power.

He was a slave to emotion

He was a slave to love.

He was never in control of himself, and he was afraid to lose things that he was invested in.

Was he a good man, in AOTC's he had good intentions but no control. See his duel with Dooku, his concern when Padme fell out of the troop carrier, his going across the galaxy to save his mother, and to save his friend, there was nothing bad in there.

His attack of the Tusken's was not really a loss of control, but bad training by Obi-Wan.

The jedi council failed him badly in his training.

SPOILERS










The Jedi council really failed him when they tried to use him against Palpatine who was the closest thing that he had as a father figure, and when they did that they played right into Palpatine's hands, especially when Mace decided to execute Palpatine without a trial. Any trust that young Skywalker had vested with the jedi was destroyed in that moment.

He tried to convince Mace that Palpatine should be arrested and tried and Mace denied that saying that Palpatine was too dangerous and should die now even though Palpatine was begging for his life.

(source from the novel)

He wasn't a bad man, he just never had control

And once you head down the path of the darkside, forever will it control your destiny

[Flames89]

When is it coming out anyway?

[CaptainCrunch]

Nerdy like a fox.

[Rubber Ducky]

Originally posted by fotze@May 4 2005, 09:31 AM
Exactly, it's perfectly within his rights to do so. Good for him. But it's also perfectly within his rights to not do this cheap shinguard, everyfataing time he can. It's also within our rights to be disgusted by a billionaire keep milking his franchise for more and more money.

While "Star Wars" characters have been featured in other advertisers' TV spots to a limited extent in the past, this is the first time they have appeared in our world, not their own fictional galaxy, according to Lucas Licensing president Howard Roffman. It also is the first time Lucasfilm has allowed its world-renowned characters to be featured in so many different commercials at one time as the foundation of a campaign, he said.


"This is the first time we've really allowed people to go further in terms of using the 'Star Wars' characters as icons," Roffman said. "Because they're so much a part of the popular culture, we were willing to let the characters exist in situations other than the way in which you see them in the films. What we're doing this time is a sign of the fact that these are cultural icons that have established themselves over the past 28 years and that allows you to have some fun with it."


Sorry to keep this up, but I have to respond to Fotze. The above quote from the marketing story clearly says that this is the first time that Lucasfilm has gone this far, allowing so many commercials and things to be made.

So it's not every time he can.

This is his last Star Wars movie, so he's really going to go out with a bang. Don't blame him one bit.

[Buff]

Originally posted by ernie@May 3 2005, 11:21 AM
Somewhere along the line the belief became that the Episodes 4-6 were great movies...well acted, well scrpited etc etc when in actual fact they were and always will be well loved and classic CHEESE! Episode I and II didn't change that except for using upgraded special effects. Very few complained about Episode 1 when it came out. Many critics loved it. People loved it (with the exception of Jar Jar...who the kids loved much like kids loved the Ewoks everyone else hated). People saw it again and again. I honestly didn't now anyone who weren't at a minimum entertained by the show. Then some sort of of backlash occurred due to the oversaturation of Star Wars in the media...all of a suden that it had poorly written scenes, there was a mix of bad, decent and good acting etc etc mattered. That was always present in the original ones as well.

It was a worthless movie. It was sooooo bad that Episode 2 was better according to many critics and they only gave Episode 2, 2 stars out of 5. yet looking back the same critics gave the phantom menace, a supposedly worse movie 4 or 5 stars. People went into Episodes 1 and 2 looking for a great movie and were delivered exactly what every other movie in the series has been...cheesy dialogue, some bad acting, some good acting, some annoying characters, some memorable lines and some good fight scenes. Lucas delivered pretty much the same quality of the original trilogy but peoples expectations were astronomical.

Kevin Smith I think understands that these aren't "masterpiece" movies in the classic sense and never have been. They are cheesy. They are fun. Nothing more.

I'll go into this installment with the same headspace I went into Episode 1 and 2: I'll be prepared for some good fight scenes, some cringe inducing lines/acting, and be prepared not to overthink anything and compare it to all things in the Star Wars universe picking up on inconsistencies etc etc etc and hopefully be entertained for a couple of hours as I have been on the other 5 movies. No it won't be a classic in my mind because quite simply I'm not a kid anymore. It takes more than some good fighting and lightsabres to be a classic movie to me now. It does take smart dialog (whether funny, crude, or dramatic) and great performances which Star Wars has never really had. It didn't take that as a kid....a lightsabre and blasters was all I needed and why those original 3 movies are classics in my mind and always will be. I know a lot of kids that absolutely love the Episode 1 and 2 and look at those movies as I did The Empire Strikes Back.

Well said. I went into episodes 1 and 2 expecting to watch Star Wars not Saving Private Ryan, Shawshank Redemption, or [insert name of masterpiece here]. I knew all along that the original trilogy was cheesy, but I still loved the movies. I wondered why they were such popular movies due to their cheesiness. I even was worried when Episode 1 came out because, though I knew that I would like it, I was still worried that I was expecting too much and may not like it.

The biggest difference between the original trilogy and the prequel trilogy is the era that they were released. When Star Wars came out it was groundbreaking technology, it changed the way movies were done. Technology has changed so much that to have such a profound effect is much harder now than it was back in the 70's. The prequels didn't change they way things were done, it didn't come out with anything that people weren't expecting, it was just a pre-continuation of the original Star Wars. Nothing new, nothing special, just average Star Wars.

[Buff]

Originally posted by MarchHare@May 3 2005, 03:28 PM
The biggest problem with Episodes I and II is that they really lacked the snappy dialogue of the original trilogy.

To wit:

"Watch your mouth kid or you'll find yourself floating home."

"We had a small radiation leak, but we're fine here...everything's fine...how are you?"

"Were you afraid I was going to leave without giving you a goodbye kiss?"
"I'd just as soon kiss a Wookiee."
"I can arrange that!"

The closest thing the prequels gave us was:

"We came to rescue you."
"Nice job."

Other than that one line, there aren't really any memorable quotes at all. The banter between Han & Luke and Han & Leia is what made the originals. Even contrast the romance dialogue:

"You like me because I'm a scoundrel. There aren't enough scoundrels in your life."
"I happen to like nice men."
"I'm nice men."

"I love you."
"I know."

vs.

"I don't like the sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating--not like you. You're soft and smooth."

So you're saying that the success of the original series is due to Han Solo and the prequel series needs Han Solo to be liked?

[Hakan]

Saving Private Ryan was a masterpiece?

[snappyk]

I just want to see the frikin movie, I can't wait for it to come out.

[MarchHare]

So you're saying that the success of the original series is due to Han Solo and the prequel series needs Han Solo to be liked?

While all of my examples contained lines delivered by Han, I didn't mean to imply he was necessary to make the prequels enjoyable. What they need, though, is the snappy, witty banter that the originals had. The dialogue in episodes I and II was so wooden and boring, not at all like the first three films.

[Buff]

Originally posted by MarchHare@May 5 2005, 07:52 PM

While all of my examples contained lines delivered by Han, I didn't mean to imply he was necessary to make the prequels enjoyable. What they need, though, is the snappy, witty banter that the originals had. The dialogue in episodes I and II was so wooden and boring, not at all like the first three films.

Well episodes 1 & 2 come from a time when the Jedi were prevalent in the galaxy. You'll have to remember that the Jedi are in control of their emotions and are less suspect to being snappy like Han Solo.

[RougeUnderoos]

With all this Han Solo talk I think I should point out that on Jeopardy the other night it came out that Al Pacino was in the hunt for the role of the dashing smuggler.

According to IMDB so were Kurt Russell, Nick Nolte Christopher Walken and someone named Perry King.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@May 6 2005, 05:28 AM
With all this Han Solo talk I think I should point out that on Jeopardy the other night it came out that Al Pacino was in the hunt for the role of the dashing smuggler.

According to IMDB so were Kurt Russell, Nick Nolte Christopher Walken and someone named Perry King.

I heard in a Walken interview before that he read for the part as a courtesy to George Lucas because the 2 are apparently good friends, but Walken said that he purposely did a lousy job so that Lucas wouldn't want him for the role. He said that he thought the movie was a bad idea but didn't want to insult Lucas by saying no.

[LGA]

At this point in time, I just want to see Darth Maul run around and kill things once more. He was the highlite of Episode 1, that whole movie should of just been him running around killing everything, screw stealth or whatever Lucas was trying to portray.

Episode 1 would've been nice if during the Maul vs. Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, Jar-Jar falls out of nowhere and is impalled numerous times...Bah, I'm going to watch the third one...more for pure action then getting my hopes up, kinda like Blade 3 - Crappy dialogue, Wooden acting, and random action...at least Blade 3 had cheeze fest one liners.

[HOZ]

After looking at the trailer it looks again like Lucas has crapped the bed. Sorry but the batton twirling (instead of sword fighting) and 'Hidden dragon - crouching tiger'-rip off flying trapese acts aren't going to save this load of dung.


Lucas and the prequils are a joke.