[Trade] Oilers trade Taylor Hall to NJ for Adam Larsson. 1 For 1.

[JiriHrdina]

So instead of huffing and puffing respond to posts that aren't absurd.
There are guys that for me that are clearly ahead of Hall:
Benn
AO
Johnny
Forsberg
Landeskog
Marchand

That's based on ability to produce, and all around game.

Other on the list are debatable (e.g. Panarin- not sure what he is yet) and some I would clearly rank Hall ahead (Hoffman, Sharp).

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Don't even know why I bother... this post is absolutely absurd.

So post your own list there, Jay Sherman.

Wow us with the wine of your mind grapes.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

This is far from the worst trade of the last decade. Larsson is currently a good young #3 D, with a decent chance of developing into something better than that. There are lots of trades where front-line players went for scraps that weren't even playing in the NHL a few years later. Forsberg for Erat comes to mind, and that was only a couple years ago.

I hate you. You just made me think of the Gilmour trade. Damn you!

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

So instead of huffing and puffing respond to posts that aren't absurd.
There are guys that for me that are clearly ahead of Hall:
Benn
AO
Johnny
Forsberg
Landeskog
Marchand

That's based on ability to produce, and all around game.

There's just no way you could objectively justify the last three (Marchand is the closest, but he's still a full tier below - also I'm not certain I'd take him over Pacioretty). The only way you can do it is on the basis of your own intuition, eye test, suggesting that you see things that don't show up in actual on-ice results for the team, and so on. People get so married to bias against the other tribe here that they'll just put a 20% discount on a player's skill just because he's an Oiler.

I don't know if Hall's going to produce more, less or the same with the Devils - the Devils are a pretty bad team right now. But he instantly becomes the top LW in the division not named Ovechkin, and I suspect this "Oiler stink" bias will fade over time and people will figure out that he's actually an elite forward in this league.

[JiriHrdina]

You still haven't posted your list.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Adam Proteau@Proteautype
Hearing that 28 NHL GMs and the Vegas expansion team owner just called Peter Chiarelli to confirm he has their correct phone/email info.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

You still haven't posted your list.

Of the LW's in the league right now who are better than Hall? Ovechkin, Benn, and probably Gaudreau, and you could make an argument for Pacioretty. That's it.

[Flash Walken]

Alex Steen is way better than hall.

Give me a 20 goal selke rcandidat over a 25 goal "scorer" any day of the week.

Steen and his line held Toews, benn and league scoring leader Kane to just two playoff goals combined.

It is such an Edmonton thing to say because hall is better because he scores 5-10 more goals than another player who prevents 20-30.

Alex Steen: 52 points in 67 games
Hall: 65 in 82

Steen all day everyday.

[Passe La Puck]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Of the LW's in the league right now who are better than Hall? Ovechkin, Benn, and probably Gaudreau, and you could make an argument for Pacioretty. That's it.

So he's not Top 3 is what you're saying...

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

There's just no way you could objectively justify the last three (Marchand is the closest, but he's still a full tier below - also I'm not certain I'd take him over Pacioretty). The only way you can do it is on the basis of your own intuition, eye test, suggesting that you see things that don't show up in actual on-ice results for the team, and so on. People get so married to bias against the other tribe here that they'll just put a 20% discount on a player's skill just because he's an Oiler.

I don't know if Hall's going to produce more, less or the same with the Devils - the Devils are a pretty bad team right now. But he instantly becomes the top LW in the division not named Ovechkin, and I suspect this "Oiler stink" bias will fade over time and people will figure out that he's actually an elite forward in this league.

Doesn't matter where Hall plays, he's still one of the dumbest players in the game today. He may score you 60-70 points, but he's going to be on the ice for 80-90 goals against. He may be a good scorer, but he simply just isn't a good hockey player.

On the trade itself, this appears to be a trade where both teams ultimately lose. Edmonton went big game hunting and came home with with small potatoes. Larsson is a 3-4 guy, not a top pair talent like they desperately need. New Jersey gets a guy that is a one way player who has been a distraction in small town Edmonton. I can't imagine him in the city that never sleeps. Could get ugly. Neither team got what they wanted, nor what they needed.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Of the LW's in the league right now who are better than Hall? Ovechkin, Benn, and probably Gaudreau, and you could make an argument for Pacioretty. That's it.

You think about numbers. Even your corsi arguments are about numbers. Numbers do not define everything man. There is more to a hockey players game than how many points he puts up.

[JiriHrdina]

Forsberg had 1 less point than Hall last season 7 more goals - why is it absurd to say he's better? Marchand had the same PPG and 11 more goals.

Given that Hall is primarily an offense player only - he should have superior numbers to comparables who offer more.

[AC]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Forsberg had 1 less point than Hall last season 7 more goals - why is it absurd to say he's better? Marchand had the same PPG and 11 more goals.

Given that Hall is primarily an offense player only - he should have superior numbers to comparables who offer more.

I think its definitely fair to consider Marchand and Forsberg, considering they are comparable offensively and much better defensively than HAll.

In fact, Marchand is better when it comes to goal scoring, shot generation, possession, and far better at shot suppression. Hall is a better playmaker.


Meanwhile, Forsberg is also better when it comes to goal scoring, shot generation, possession, and better at shot suppression. Hall is a better playmaker.

[Enoch Root]

Forsberg is a better all around player as well

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by robaur

Dead space? Being almost point per game is considered dead space?

Just my opinion but yeah. He's a black ace in a red hand.

He's not part of their core going forward and he's not what they need as a complimentary piece. He does have value though, more than anyone else they'd want to move, so the oilers were smart to turn him into a player that can fill a need.

Whether they got the right player back time will tell I guess.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

AC, why are you posting HERO charts for one season? They're supposed to take a representative sample - past 3 years, or less if the player hasn't been around that long. If you do it the way you just did, all you can say is, in the areas covered by HERO, "X was better than Y last year"; you're in no position to say "X is better than Y".

Originally Posted by dissentowner

You think about numbers. Even your corsi arguments are about numbers. Numbers do not define everything man. There is more to a hockey players game than how many points he puts up.

I'm well aware. But the goal is to outscore the other team. What Hall does on the ice promotes that end better than the guys mentioned, and the rationales given for alternatives are pure fantasy. Like, completely divorced from reality.

Steen, for example. I'm not saying Steen isn't a good winger, but he was one of the worst players on the Blues in terms of shot suppression for the last 3 years, and yet Flash just called the guy a defensive stalwart Selke candidate, apparently on the basis of one seven game playoff series. Meanwhile his scoring rate at evens is just behind Jussi Jokinen. Yeah, those are numbers. They reflect the results the guy managed to achieve when he was on the ice.

You can't just say things that have no connection to what actually happens on the ice and expect them to carry any weight. You're entitled to your opinion about who the better player is, but when it's based on nothing, it's worthless to anyone else. It's just making noises.

Anyway this isn't worth my energy to keep litigating.

[btimbit]

In my opinion

Clearly better than Hall

Benn
Ovechkin
Gaudreau
Marchand
Forsberg


Close/good argument can be made

Pacioretty
Landeskog
Steen
Panarin (I'd say clearly better if he has another year like last year)

[Enoch Root]

nm - not worth it

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by btimbit

In my opinion

Clearly better than Hall

Benn
Ovechkin
Gaudreau
Marchand
Forsberg


Close/good argument can be made

Pacioretty
Landeskog
Steen
Panarin (I'd say clearly better if he has another year like last year)

Surprised Ladd isn't on your list. His scoring consistency is right up there with the very best LW's in the last 4-5 seasons

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Yeah, that's all complete bull#### and is a complete distortion of what I actually posted. Good one bud. Carry on.