IMO, outside of Ramage, Granlund, Reinhart, Poirier and everyone else who has been very solid in this tournament, Ferland has been the common denominator in both games so far.
First, with the magic he created for Granlund to score those goals. Plus, grinding it out in the corners and keeping people honest after the whistle.
And second, with his fight that lifted the team out of their daze against the Canucks.
To say he's been good is an understatement.
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I was reminded of this in another thread, and I think people need to keep this at the forefront of their mind when judging Sven:
In the last year they competed in this tournament, neither Hall nor Eberle were even remotely impactful or overly impressive.
I think it's pretty clear by the interview, but these tournaments just don't MEAN anything to guys who have essentially "made it" to the show, and he has. It's not a question of "if" he's on the roster, he's on there. He played great at the end of the season after being called up and unless he's got major issues during the first couple months I think we'll see him play 60+ games. I just don't think there's a ton to prove for guys who have made it. It's more of a risk playing in this tournament when you know the season starts in a month. What would you rather? Be a little bit risky, go all out, and dominate a prospect tournament? Or play it safe, make a few plays, don't get involved too much so that you're ready to go for the main camp?
Guys like Granlund are going to get a long look at camp because of their performance here. Guys like Baertschi will get more than a look regardless of their performance here.
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Seriously? Some of you guys are a little ridiculous.
Take a few minutes to think about this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by New Era
...Ferland - I thought this kid was going to be a tough guy with limited ability...
Culkin - I was expecting a small soft QMJHL defenseman...
Ortio - A guy that I will admit I had written off. Even though he supposedly had a great season last year I didn't think that would translate to North America and the Flames...
...and then apply it to this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by New Era
...Monahan ...Needs to improve this or he won't live up to expectations...
Knight ...Fell for the hype and believed he had the skills to step right in, but he's no where near ready for the NHL...
Baertschi ...If he can't dominate a rookie tournament he won't survive in the NHL.
It's a little early to be drawing conclusions about ANY of these players. There are virtually dozens of mitigating factors that will affect why a player may perform well or poorly in a mini-tournament like this, and I wouldn't read much into it at this point. I CERTAINLY wouldn't be speaking in these sorts of absolutes.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
Players like Baertschi are trying to avoid injury. A guy like Ferland needs to make a positive impression to stick around the main camp a bit longer. This tourney means different things to different players. An injury can ruin Sven's season, a great performance really doesn't improve his chances of making the team.
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I believe Connor had his jaw broken with that shot, up until that point he was very feared at about 6'4 225lbs...after that knockout Ferland was the feared one.
Ferland is one of those rare individuals that never seems to get hurt in a fight, an extremely solid noggin, Iggy was like that.
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Players like Baertschi are trying to avoid injury. A guy like Ferland needs to make a positive impression to stick around the main camp a bit longer. This tourney means different things to different players. An injury can ruin Sven's season, a great performance really doesn't improve his chances of making the team.
This/
Baertschi will ramp it up during main camp when getting injured won't cost him 12k a game. People will say players "don't think like that" and as much as they try not too it's still in the back of their minds.
Seriously? Some of you guys are a little ridiculous.
Take a few minutes to think about this:
...and then apply it to this:
It's a little early to be drawing conclusions about ANY of these players. There are virtually dozens of mitigating factors that will affect why a player may perform well or poorly in a mini-tournament like this, and I wouldn't read much into it at this point. I CERTAINLY wouldn't be speaking in these sorts of absolutes.
No one is speaking in certainties, but I do find it interesting that what you are complaining about something teams do all the time. Look at Howse for example. I also fail to understand why certain prospects shouldn't be expected to perform to high levels, especially when they are supposed to be heads and tails better than others?
Baertschi has played 25 games in the NHL, and now he doesn't have anything to prove? Frankly, Baertschi has more to prove than anyone at this tournament. If he wants to carry the mantle of the club he needs to do it in all situations, not just the ones he choses. He was saying he wants to be a positive example for the young guys coming in, then prove it by playing hard every shift. what we're seeing so far has been a pretty poor example. If this is the attitude he has now how long until he decides he's saving it for the post-season and doesn't need to show up for the first month or two of the season?
What I can't believe, is people are complaining, and worrying, about Monahan's speed. He isn't fast, by any means, but he is definitely not as slow as some people are saying he is. Another thing, from what I have heard, is Monahan isn't known for his speed. He is known for his hockey smarts, faceoffs, defensive prowess, with good offensive upside. From what I have seen, he is living up to what he known for.
I am actually not too worried about Sven, mainly because I don't really care what happens in this camp. Wait until the regular season to start complaining about him.
Ortio was outstanding. Honestly, if we didn't have Ramo, Berra, and Macdonald he may be able to crack the NHL if he played like this in camp. Consistency is a whole different story however.
Hanowski looks much better. People who are saying he is slow need to actually watch the games. He is, in my opinion, one of the faster guys out there right now, he is consistently winning races to the puck. Call me crazy but thats what I am seeing.
Poirier seems like a raw talent to me. He needs a little refining in every area except for skating. It almost looks like he feels rushed when he has the puck, and he makes some poor decisions in these situation. He has looked pretty good tho, don't get me wrong.
I think Granlund could probably play for the flames this year. Guy was stellar earlier this year and he has been unreal in this tournament.
I like Keegan Kanzig, I think he was a good pick. I don't think he is slow, but his agility could use some work, and that makes sense to me. I saw a couple of times forwards in the corners would just stop and go the other direction and Kanzig would have problems keeping up with them
No one is speaking in certainties, but I do find it interesting that what you are complaining about something teams do all the time. Look at Howse for example. I also fail to understand why certain prospects shouldn't be expected to perform to high levels, especially when they are supposed to be heads and tails better than others?
Baertschi has played 25 games in the NHL, and now he doesn't have anything to prove? Frankly, Baertschi has more to prove than anyone at this tournament. If he wants to carry the mantle of the club he needs to do it in all situations, not just the ones he choses. He was saying he wants to be a positive example for the young guys coming in, then prove it by playing hard every shift. what we're seeing so far has been a pretty poor example. If this is the attitude he has now how long until he decides he's saving it for the post-season and doesn't need to show up for the first month or two of the season?
I understand critical, and as fan you are more than entitled to express your opinion about how well or poorly a player performs. But that is not what you are doing here. You quite frankly don't know anything about what Baertschi needs to or needn't do to be successful. You don't have the foggiest clue about if or why he is under performing in this tournament, and you cannot speak cogently about his or any other prospect's future from what you have seen in the course of two days in the first week of September.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
I understand critical, and as fan you are more than entitled to express your opinion about how well or poorly a player performs. But that is not what you are doing here. You quite frankly don't know anything about what Baertschi needs to or needn't do to be successful. You don't have the foggiest clue about if or why he is under performing in this tournament, and you cannot speak cogently about his or any other prospect's future from what you have seen in the course of two days in the first week of September.
THIS.
If we're being really honest here, and REALLY evaluating these prospects based on what has happened historically in this event, then chances are Baertschi goes on to be successful while Granlund barely cracks the NHL. Career AHL guys dominate this event every year. It's not because they're better than a Baertschi (or in terms of 2011, an RNH) but because they HAVE to dominate this tournament. People confuse this tournament for something much more serious than it actually is. For guys who have something to prove, yeah, 3 games means a lot. For a guy who has potted 13 points in 25 NHL games? This tournament is literally meaningless.
In 2011 Baertschi had 2 goals. He played a whopping 3 NHL games that year.
In 2011 Brodie had 0 points and was a -2. He's played in over 100 NHL games since.
Brodie was about the same age as Baertschi is now. But I guess by the logic of some Brodie CLEARLY showed he was incapable of performing in the NHL.
You know... except for the fact he played 54 NHL games that same season.
And 47 this past year while putting up modest point totals.
Just wanted to say really quickly that Ortio looked really REALLY good last night! I thought he was great, but had no idea he was THAT good! Very optimistic for him going forward.
THIS.
If we're being really honest here, and REALLY evaluating these prospects based on what has happened historically in this event, then chances are Baertschi goes on to be successful while Granlund barely cracks the NHL. Career AHL guys dominate this event every year. It's not because they're better than a Baertschi (or in terms of 2011, an RNH) but because they HAVE to dominate this tournament. People confuse this tournament for something much more serious than it actually is. For guys who have something to prove, yeah, 3 games means a lot. For a guy who has potted 13 points in 25 NHL games? This tournament is literally meaningless.
In 2011 Baertschi had 2 goals. He played a whopping 3 NHL games that year.
In 2011 Brodie had 0 points and was a -2. He's played in over 100 NHL games since.
Brodie was about the same age as Baertschi is now. But I guess by the logic of some Brodie CLEARLY showed he was incapable of performing in the NHL.
You know... except for the fact he played 54 NHL games that same season.
And 47 this past year while putting up modest point totals.
One thing people need toremember is that this group had one practice together before the back-to-back games. So inconsistent play while they feel eachother out and develop some chemistry should be expected.
I've been very impressed to see how quickly Monahan and Poirier clicked together. It's a shame Klimchuk was hurt, it'd be interesting to see all our first rounders on one line together.
I think Reinhart has stepped up in this tourney because he doesn't want to be overlooked. He got some time int he NHL, but there are no guarantees -- so he's making the most of it and looks ready.
I think Ramage and Wotherspoon are the favorites on D going into camp. I would say Ramage has an edge because we need a defenceman like him moreso than Wotherspoon. Ramage already plays an NHL game, IMO.
Not sure what to make of Knight, a lot of banking on him, will have to wait and see.
Ortio is a whole different goaltender this year. Has all the confidence he lacked last year. Very promising.
I think in this instance the people who are upset about negative comments are the ones overreacting. What I've read doesn't really merit the amount of eye-rolling I'm seeing in the responses.
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He may not see it this way but it's basically an opportunity for him to be a leader for the other guys coming in. That said, glad to hear he wasn't too upset about it, I think he needs to look at this as an opportunity and not just him being "added with the rookies".
I kind of see it as selling the rebuild to fans too, and Sven is part of that package.
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