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Old 12-17-2022, 08:12 PM   #521
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Well if it’s not drafting enough that is also their problem to fix since they keep trading draft picks away for marginal players. My point is good teams that win tend to win with homegrown talent. In the end that is satisfied by having players you draft in the league. I and many think the team has an issue giving opportunities to young talent. You’ve gone and said here they just don’t draft well. Bingo said in another thread they don’t draft enough because they lack picks. All of these could be sources of the problem which is not enough players in the big league club. I think they should work on likely fixing all of those. I would hope any big sports team is always looking to improve their pipeline and that is rarely a single point of failure.

How about they stop trading draft picks for filler players, work on better scouting to identify nhl calibre players, work on improving development to enable the players to succeed and enable some sort of system that gives young players a chance to make the big league team instead of being told like Zary that on merit they deserved to be there but were sent down because of contract reasons. (Aka signing too many marginal crap players)
So you think what most people say here rings hollow and aren’t as important as “the experts” but you think the Flames should just go about attempting to fix problems a few different people on CP listed as a potential problem?

There’s little evidence they need to scout junior better considering the players taken around Pelletier and Zary haven’t exactly lit the world on fire and players like Gaudreau, Andersson, Kylington, Mangiapane, and Fox were all good-to-incredible hits for the organization. So we can throw that out.

Development doesn’t appear to be an issue unless you can provide some evidence that the Flames have graduated less players than the average team, including some of the homegrown players that have recently departed.

I think you were probably closest with the assumption that every team is looking to improve the pipeline, and you’re probably missing the fact that it includes the Flames. There’s not much evidence that points to your conclusions, so lumping them in with better ones and saying “fix everything!” isn’t any better. Unless you can show they an issue giving opportunities to young talent (you can’t) then it doesn’t make much sense as thing to keep repeating. It’s not getting any more true through repetition.
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Old 12-17-2022, 09:09 PM   #522
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No I don’t care that much about Phillips. I’m somewhat fine with Lannys argument since I don’t honestly think Phillips is going to have an NHL career. I have more of an issue that they’ve not promoted anyone they’ve drafted since 2018. That’s some fundamental problem regardless of which problem it is. Point for me is they’re not going to be a good NHL team if they can’t draft and promote good players. Clearly there is an issue right now with the team in that regard.
I think both of your points are not exclusive.

Flames over the last few years haven't played many from the farm. Even short game stints to assist with their development by experiencing the big team.

We're now at a point with needing to bring players up, but due to not giving them games previous years they're bigger unknowns.
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Old 12-17-2022, 09:35 PM   #523
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I think both of your points are not exclusive.

Flames over the last few years haven't played many from the farm. Even short game stints to assist with their development by experiencing the big team.

We're now at a point with needing to bring players up, but due to not giving them games previous years they're bigger unknowns.
Ruzicka and Mackey both got games last season and the season before.

You could count Valimaki as a player having being given games last season, too.

Last season was also the first full season for Kylington after being given games previous seasons.

Seems to happen every year.
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Old 12-17-2022, 10:19 PM   #524
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Ruzicka and Mackey both got games last season and the season before.

You could count Valimaki as a player having being given games last season, too.

Last season was also the first full season for Kylington after being given games previous seasons.

Seems to happen every year.
Fair points. Ruzicka stayed mostly up, same with Kylington the year before. The new wavier change (it is new yeah?) helps with recalling players too, as well as now having wranglers in Calgary and no pandemic.

I'm more talking about Zary or Pelletier at the end of the season when players need rest before finals and we already have our spot. We have 2 (3 with Coronato) who's development might be helped with a couple of blocks of nothing games
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Old 12-18-2022, 09:00 AM   #525
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Yeah and plenty of flames writers like Kent Wilson and Mike Gould and others have stated things that hold a bit more weight to me. I find the excuses given on these forums to be a bit hollow. Like I said up thread regardless of the reason (lack of picks, bad drafts, bad development, bad promotion strategies) at the end of the day the Flames are seeing very little from their recent drafts. If the Flames want to be better they need their young players especially their first and second rounders to have an impact at the NHL level.
So you're looking for writers that confirm your confirmation bias then?
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Old 12-18-2022, 09:02 AM   #526
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Well if it’s a quality issue that is still a Flames issue. Saying we don’t have a problem promoting but have a problem drafting is not a very convincing argument. Trev at the end of the day is responsible for that. Maybe don’t trade away a bunch of picks for crap players like Pittlick, Lazar and Hamonic. So this means players like Zary and Pelletier aren’t quality?
How many times do we have to go through this.

Lack of high picks.
Lack of picking high

Both equal less quality in the system.

If you draft poorly it's even worse, but when the picks aren't available it's hard to find the quality at the top of the draft.

You guys still haven't listed that treasure trove of players that have been blocked by the Flames but went on to have successful NHL careers.

I assume the list is a WIP and you'll have it soon?
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Old 12-18-2022, 09:04 AM   #527
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Fair points. Ruzicka stayed mostly up, same with Kylington the year before. The new wavier change (it is new yeah?) helps with recalling players too, as well as now having wranglers in Calgary and no pandemic.

I'm more talking about Zary or Pelletier at the end of the season when players need rest before finals and we already have our spot. We have 2 (3 with Coronato) who's development might be helped with a couple of blocks of nothing games
I think Pelletier is next up.

Zary missed a bunch of last season, and neither guy have had the most normal run since being drafted with Covid.

I would guess the organization is happy with both of their progressions and have them on the big club roster as early as next season.
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