[News] With the 2016 6th OA pick Flames select LW Matthew Tkachuk

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

I wouldn't say so. His ELC slides a year if he's sent down and he was a rookie last year in the OHL, playing with two of the best players in the league. He has a lot to prove in the OHL next year, while the Flames a) don't have anything to lose sending him down and b) see what they have with their players on the brink of busting, like Poirer, Hamilton, Pollock, and Klimchuck

I say Tkachuck is way at a disadvantage. Even if he plays better than all these guys, fitness levels and conditioning is different due to the schedule. It's a hard life for a 17/18 year old too

A top 6 forward?

If Tkachuk is good enough to make the team, he's going to make the team. It's as simple as that.

Treliving has mentioned as much.

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Flames need size on the wing in the top 6. I don't see smaller players or lesser players like Pollack beating him out. Tkachuk is not a lock but a favourite to make the team out of camp

Brouwer, Monahan, Bennett, Backs, Frolik, all have some size or truculence. Tkachuck is the exact same size as Poirer and Poirer also showed a lot of feistiness at the junior level. Both of whom are 1 inch taller than Klimchuck. It's not Tkachuck is this towering beast. Only Mangiapane and maybe Shinkaruk are at a size disadvantage

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

A top 6 forward?

If Tkachuk is good enough to make the team, he's going to make the team. It's as simple as that.

Treliving has mentioned as much.

Of course Treliving mentioned as much. They always say that, lol. What else is he going to say? Seriously, what's his alternatives that's acceptable by fan?

He might be a top 6 forward during the first week, but it's an 82 game schedule and these guys burn out.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Brouwer, Monahan, Bennett, Backs, Frolik, all have some size or truculence. Tkachuck is the exact same size as Poirer and Poirer also showed a lot of feistiness at the junior level. Both of whom are 1 inch taller than Klimchuck. It's not Tkachuck is this towering beast. Only Mangiapane and maybe Shinkaruk are at a size disadvantage

Backlund and Frolik have truculence? I didn't know Porier was 205lbs thought he was around 185. I agree Porier might be able to beat him out of camp but wouldn't bet on it

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Of course Treliving mentioned as much. They always say that, lol. What else is he going to say? Seriously, what's his alternatives that's acceptable by fan?

He might be a top 6 forward during the first week, but it's an 82 game schedule and these guys burn out.

This always earned thing has really been taken so literal by fans around here that the team almost can't win. I'm not going to pretend I have any idea what's going to be best for Tkachuk's development, but that's always a balance a team has to weigh with a young player.

Even if said player is actually good enough to play in your top 12, what exposure and experience makes them the better player long term? Despite popular belief, I don't think that's always taking whatever minutes you can at the NHL level for every player. Compound that with us fans desire and excitement on a rebuilding team to watch the highly touted prospects and we get all sorts of bent out of shape if we precieve some "vet" we don't care about is getting a pass the young player isn't.

I think the Flames have done a pretty good job with identifying their young talents development requirements the past few years. Whether that's sending players down despite strong showings, or sheltering minutes and slowly increasing responsibility as the season wares on. I think Tkachuk with be an interesting case. Fitness level aside, he doesn't strike me as a player that had to play on the top 2 lines to develop his skill set, he could start slugging his way through a checking line and work his way up maybe. Will be really interesting to see how he does.

[CliffFletcher]

Remember when we used to laugh at the Oilers for rushing all their prospects into the NHL at 18?

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Of course Treliving mentioned as much. They always say that, lol. What else is he going to say? Seriously, what's his alternatives that's acceptable by fan?

He might be a top 6 forward during the first week, but it's an 82 game schedule and these guys burn out.

"We don't want to rush him"

"Only been in Junior for 1 year"

"Lot's of competition in camp, unlikely Tkachuk will outplay everyone he needs to".

Instead he said "We're not going to put any restrictions on him".

Nobody was expecting Monahan to make the team right out of camp, but he forced their hand. Tkachuk sounds determined to do the same.

BTW it would be terrible asset management to send Tkachuk back to Junior if he's ready for the NHL. That's a slowed year of development for our top prospect and means more than sliding ELC's.

[djsFlames]

Poirier is nearing his 'best before' date to prove that he has NHL upside. This is a huge camp for him and I hope he recognizes that.

I think Tkachuk will have more hunger than the more qualified guys and that alone may buy him the extra look.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Remember when we used to laugh at the Oilers for rushing all their prospects into the NHL at 18?

Because they did.

Tkachuk will have to earn it. And if he does, there's nothing wrong with that

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Remember when we used to laugh at the Oilers for rushing all their prospects into the NHL at 18?

I think there's a difference between a player making the NHL as an 18-year old and playing on the 3rd line and saying Leon Draisaitl is expected to be the 2nd line centre two minutes after you draft him.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

I think he'll have some competition. He's got to beat out Shinkaruk, Poirer, Klimchuck and Pollock, all of whom have more experience than Tkachuk. Even Mangiapane has more experience and arguably and an equal comparison of skill level (ie, high end talent)

He should handily beat out every player you mention in camp. None are of the same caliber. Tkachuk is a top prospect.

[djsFlames]

Also should Puljujarvi even be playing in the NHL this season? Yet Oil fans have him penciled it. I'm pretty certain scouts said in June that JP was the one guy in the top 3 that would benefit from another year of seasoning.

You just know he's going to be skating on the 3̶r̶d̶ 2nd line right wing opening night though, no matter what.

[stemit14]

You just know that Tkachuk is going to be a thorn in the Canucks' side for years to come. I bet he'll have his best games against them.


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[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

"We don't want to rush him"

"Only been in Junior for 1 year"

"Lot's of competition in camp, unlikely Tkachuk will outplay everyone he needs to".

1) So Tkachuk is suppose to accept that? Tkachuk needs to believe if he's the best person for the job, he will get it.

2) Again, saying stuff like that is not how you develop the minds of players who you want in your organization long term

3) Once more, is he trying to make Tkachuk feel bad?

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

1) So Tkachuk is suppose to accept that? Tkachuk needs to believe if he's the best person for the job, he will get it.

2) Again, saying stuff like that is not how you develop the minds of players who you want in your organization long term

3) Once more, is he trying to make Tkachuk feel bad?

Thankfully it seems Tkachuk is made of sterner stuff then you.

Bennett seemed pissed the eff off when he was sent back, I doubt Treliving was his best friend at the moment, but oh well.

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

He should handily beat out every player you mention in camp. None are of the same caliber. Tkachuk is a top prospect.

Poirer put up 43 goals in 63 games his draft year, all while not playing on the same line as Marner and Dvorak, who were OHLs top 5 scorers two years straight. Tkachuck puts up (not surprisingly, since who he played with) a whopping 77 assists, but only 30 goals. So who's more of a passenger and who's more a driver? Poirer was in a deep 2013 draft class and still went #22 OA. He then has a great rookie AHL season, but had a off-year last season. Poirer is no slouch.

Likewise with Poirer, Shinkaruk went high in a deep class (was projected to go higher) and also put up more goals and didn't have the same level of line-mates. Also, Shinker had some solid AHL seasons and some good NHL showings.

If you believe that hockey prospects are closer to the NHL as a result of age, pro experience, and longer development, Poirer and Shinkaruk are closer to the NHL. both are very good prospects.

I would say it's Shinker, then Poirer, and then Tkachuk as my favorites to make the team

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Because they did.

Tkachuk will have to earn it. And if he does, there's nothing wrong with that

Just because a prospect outplays the competition in training camp doesn't mean the best thing for his development is to play in the NHL. Hall, RNH, etc. outplayed the competition to make the Oilers. It was still bad management to keep them up.

I'm confident Treliving will do what's best for Tkachuk's development. The rebuild is still ongoing. No need to Oiler the kid.

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Thankfully it seems Tkachuk is made of sterner stuff then you.

Bennett seemed pissed the eff off when he was sent back, I doubt Treliving was his best friend at the moment, but oh well.

It's not about stern stuff. You're not just asking Tkachuck to go down to Juniors and play hockey, you're asking him to eat right, switch his habits, maybe try a new side, buy into a defensive role, spend more time in the gym, take less money (when that time comes), sign long term, etc.

Keeping a working and productive relationship is not done by insulting them or taking all hope away. You've obviously never managed workers

[sun]

I think he'll get his nine games.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

Poirer put up 43 goals in 63 games his draft year,

38 in 75 actually.

Tkachuck puts up only 30 goals.

55 in 79 actually.