[Signing] Flames sign Deryk Engelland (3yrs, $2.9M AAV)

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by 19Yzerman19

Also evaluating the usefulness of a stat by saying "HA it doesn't put Crosby first" is pretty baffling. Crosby is good at a lot of things in addition to having good puck possession numbers.

What is equally baffling is using an incident that gives up puck possession (a shot at the goal) as a measure of 'possession'.

It's a useful stat. Valuable. it's just not the be all and end all.

[19Yzerman19]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

What is equally baffling is using an incident that gives up puck possession (a shot at the goal) as a measure of 'possession'.

It's a useful stat. Valuable. it's just not the be all and end all.

I agree with your second statement totally. However, the first one isn't correct based on lots of work done by analytics people. If you were to take a stopwatch and time the portion of the game that a particular NHL team holds onto the puck compared to the other team, it would line up very closely with Corsi (and even more closely with Fenwick). This has been tested.

[bubbsy]

this thread is definitely getting epic. I was vocally not a fan of the signing, but at the end of the day, it's a minor issue for the club and doesn't really equate to Wins/Losses for this team.

in the new cap era, i often have wondered if players would ever have a "max" value after which they wouldn't negotiate higher? This player hasn't played 10s with a flames jersey, and he's already pinned as the team's goat and whipping boy, simply because of the contract $'s he signed for.

How many players take up way to much salary and then suffer the media/fan scrutiny when they just can't live up to the dollars they sign for. I'm guessing this never happens, but always curious.

[Read Only]

Originally Posted by 868904

I can guarantee that Kassian won't be doing any of that next year. He can run from McGrattan as he's out of his weight class, but he'll have to answer to Engelland and Bollig.

No he won't if he doesn't want to.

[Matt Reeeeead]

He's obviously horrible. Treliving knows what he is doing. He's ensuring that all of the young pups coming up are well protected. There are a few guys on the roster now that can fill that void. We aren't contending next few years (especially in this tough conference), so what difference does it make if he sucks, or sucks really bad? Keep the kids healthy and we can upgrade in 3 years.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

this thread is definitely getting epic. I was vocally not a fan of the signing, but at the end of the day, it's a minor issue for the club and doesn't really equate to Wins/Losses for this team.

in the new cap era, i often have wondered if players would ever have a "max" value after which they wouldn't negotiate higher? This player hasn't played 10s with a flames jersey, and he's already pinned as the team's goat and whipping boy, simply because of the contract $'s he signed for.

How many players take up way to much salary and then suffer the media/fan scrutiny when they just can't live up to the dollars they sign for. I'm guessing this never happens, but always curious.

outside of a few short pages of Ashawx almost losing his sight due to anger, I think most posts here are pretty reasonable

[Fire]

I am already bored with the Engelland contract discussion, it's been done to death. Hopefully the prospect camp is enough of a distraction.

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Fire

I am already bored with the Engelland contract discussion, it's been done to death. Hopefully the prospect camp is enough of a distraction.

wait till he's a minus in a game this season

other more pressing issue: Our roster is getting filled up by too many easy spelling mistake players (monohan, guadreau, bartchi, van braba... bryce)

[formulate]

Off topic(ish), but wondering if an 'advanced stats' thread would be useful. Some posters here have a pretty firm grasp, but I'm sure they're still confusing or ignored by many.

For me, possession should be looked at (in context, of course) just like the other components that make up a good team. Special teams, goaltending, etc. All are factors in creating a good team, but none give you the full story.

[Racki]

We currently sit dead last in the entire NHL in payroll. I don't expect this to change a lot in the next couple years but I've been fine with the term since day 1.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by iggysback05

We currently sit dead last in the entire NHL in payroll. I don't expect this to change a lot in the next couple years but I've been fine with the term since day 1.

Agreed.

What people really should be complaining about is season ticket prices going up while we're sitting dead last in the entire NHL in payroll.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by cral12

Justify the Engelland signing all you want, this is not a good signing other than the fact that we will be in an excellent draft slot in 2015 and I'm all for that. I hope that is what this is and when we are truly contenders Flames brass don't make a signing like this.

Just so no one gets their hopes up on Engelland, he is what he is - depth guy, tough, good teammate...

From my colleague and from someone who knows the Pens better than pretty much anyone outside the organization (and some within), @MikeColligan:
"...insane money for a 3rd pairing defenseman with minimal upside..."

Then your colleague has no clue why Englelland was signed...the money is entirely irrelevant.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by formulate

Off topic(ish), but wondering if an 'advanced stats' thread would be useful. Some posters here have a pretty firm grasp, but I'm sure they're still confusing or ignored by many.

For me, possession should be looked at (in context, of course) just like the other components that make up a good team. Special teams, goaltending, etc. All are factors in creating a good team, but none give you the full story.

I would also enjoy that so I don't have to see advanced stats discussion in every thread.
Find the whole discussion pretty annoying and detrimental to the topics being discussed.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by heep223

Agreed.

What people really should be complaining about is season ticket prices going up while we're sitting dead last in the entire NHL in payroll.

Going up doesnt bug me as much as the flames seemingly not really trying to win. Tanking bugs the crap out of me.

Maybe burke and treliving still intend to try and improve the team over the rest of the summer, so we'll see, but trying to make the floor with a tough guy isn't a good sign. If they team is just trying to lose Engelland could make $10m a year for all i care.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by flameswin

SebC doesn't like so I like it.

Actually, what I don't like is invalid arguments. I haven't posted an overall opinion on the signing.

I'm very deliberate in what I say, so please don't misrepresent me.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by SebC

Actually, what I don't like is invalid arguments. I haven't posted an overall opinion on the signing.

I'm very deliberate in what I say, so please don't misrepresent me.

Sorry, this is vague. Do you want to be misrepresented, or no?

[Heavy Jack]

If you told me before free agency that we would be picking up a guy who is regarded as one of the toughest fighters in the league, well liked in the dressing room, was approached by several other teams and we over-payed by about 1.2 - 1.4 mill, I wouldn't be upset at all. This guy fills a more passionate pair of shoes than Butler did for us as much as I respect Butler's final year for us as being his best year. Engelland fills a number of needs IMO and for a modest over-payment at the end of the day. We have to realize that players who got paid 1 million the year before are going to get 2 million the next with the cap rising as it is, I have no problems with this signing at all.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by formulate

Off topic(ish), but wondering if an 'advanced stats' thread would be useful. Some posters here have a pretty firm grasp, but I'm sure they're still confusing or ignored by many.

For me, possession should be looked at (in context, of course) just like the other components that make up a good team. Special teams, goaltending, etc. All are factors in creating a good team, but none give you the full story.

I know I'd enjoy a thread like that a lot. Advanced stats are something I'm just starting to try to wrap my head around, so I'm sure I could get a lot of good information out of a thread like that.

Of course after the first few posts the usual guys would turn it into another unreadable thread by repeatedly letting you know advanced stats are completely useless.

[cowtown75]

I like this signing. Spent a good hour today watching some of his fights/hits. Man this guy can fight ! I'm glad we got somone on D that can other than a foward. Balances out the toughness. Listen, I know it was a bit of an overpayment as July1st usually is, but I think this was a very smart pick up for many reasons- general toughness to watch the pups and your fellow teammates, toughness on the D, a good character in the dressing room and experience. Sometimes, those intagables are worth paying the extra bucks. He was very sought after and there must be a reason for it.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Kanzig and Smith are going to really love getting tips from McGrattan, Bollig and Engelland. I know McGrattan was teaching Kanzig the finer points last year.