2018/2019 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

There's some hyperbole right there. Your anti-Brodie stance seems a little off the deep end.

I totally believe that. I don't get how some fans can watch this guy literally lose us games with his poor play in his own end and defend him. Last year he looked worse than any Flames D man I can remember minus Bubba. You are not going far when one of your top four guys gets owned in every single way defensively while having extremely poor decision making skills.

[TheScorpion]

I can name so many worse defensemen for this team than Brodie, oh my.

Grossmann, Jokipakka, Kronwall, Wideman, Butler, Staios, Mikkelson, Johnson, Pardy, Ian ####ing White... Brodie is fine. He's regressed, but he's still fine.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I can name so many worse defensemen for this team than Brodie, oh my.

Grossmann, Jokipakka, Kronwall, Wideman, Butler, Staios, Mikkelson, Johnson, Pardy, Ian ####ing White... Brodie is fine. He's regressed, but he's still fine.

Yup, - 32 in his last two seasons while giving away goals, he is a real gem.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I can name so many worse defensemen for this team than Brodie, oh my.

Grossmann, Jokipakka, Kronwall, Wideman, Butler, Staios, Mikkelson, Johnson, Pardy, Ian ####ing White... Brodie is fine. He's regressed, but he's still fine.

Ugh that list is seriously depressing

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Yup, - 32 in his last two seasons while giving away goals, he is a real gem.

And while playing in an atrocious system with one of the worst coaches in hockey. He still has plenty of value and potential to rebound.

[FlamesNation23]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I can name so many worse defensemen for this team than Brodie, oh my.

Grossmann, Jokipakka, Kronwall, Wideman, Butler, Staios, Mikkelson, Johnson, Pardy, Ian ****ing White... Brodie is fine. He's regressed, but he's still fine.

Im pretty sure he was talking about last year on the flames. Also, you know things are not good when you are using the likes of grossman to make a point. Brodie is an okay defenseman and has cost us a decent amount of games over the last few years. I think people forget the game threads this year and how much complaining there was over Brodie. If we can get something of value for him, I think we have to do it. Andersson or Vallimaki can fill his spot nicely imo

[bluejays]

The NHL rarely has any large deals anymore but what if the deal turned out to be:
Hanifin, Lindholm and Skinner
for
Hamilton, Bennett, 2nd rounder


It would be a quick way to retool and have another year at developing players. I'd be in favor, but I'm not sure if it would be ideal for Carolina.

[TheScorpion]

FN23: He compared Brodie to Anders Eriksson, whose lumbering idiocy has not graced the Saddledome ice since the infancy of Reebok Edge.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by fleury

The NHL rarely has any large deals anymore but what if the deal turned out to be:
Hanifin, Lindholm and Skinner
for
Hamilton, Bennett, 2nd rounder


It would be a quick way to retool and have another year at developing players. I'd be in favor, but I'm not sure if it would be ideal for Carolina.

This is a decent trade proposal for both teams.

The Canes get the best player and save money.

The Flames get the 3 next best players and retool their team.

I have the feeling though that the Flames would include a decent prospect instead of the 2nd round pick.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by FlamesNation23

. I think people forget the game threads this year and how much complaining there was over Brodie.

I don't think anyone could forget the hyperbole. Brodie had an inconsistent season, but let's not pretend he never won us any games as our flat out best player. Good players lose their confidence all the time - it's a bad reason to trade them. Oilers fans used to scapegoat Justin Schultz the same way, and lo and behold they were still a tire fire last year and Justin Schultz spent his third straight year as a key piece on a cup contender (in fact, last year it was Kris Letang who took all the "Schultz"isms from his fanbase). And Brodie is a better defensive player than Schultz has ever been.

Brodie doesn't work as Hamonic's partner. Both guys are weak generating offense from the points out of the cycle, particularily if Brodie is on the left as even last year many of his assists came on the right.

Brodie's breakout pass is sometimes telegraphed on the left.

Brodie wasn't nearly as mentally sharp last year as we needed him to be and it did cost us goals against at times.

All true.

Also true:

Brodie would need to simply be on the ice for a TEAM breakdown or a puck simply hitting a rut on the ice and certain vocal people would be up in arms about how terrible he is.

Brodie has some of the worst on-ice shooting and save percentage of his entire career - both factors goaltenders and forwards strongly influence, along with a partner shooting brutal individually. The struggles of guys like Hathaway, Frolik, Bennett, Backlund, Jankowski, Lazar etc do trickle on up considering four of those guys had pretty bad seasons and the fifth guy, Hathaway, was a part time NHLer playing top 9 minutes.

There were games Brodie was our most dominant player. The road trip to Pittsburgh came to mind as the "real" Brodie, along with an actually pretty hot start to his season (i.e. WPG) especially on the power play. In fact our PP did NOT improve overall by moving him to the second unit when it hypothetically should have. Brodie+4Forwards was our best PP unit last year and had us rolling. Regardless of how you feel about the drop back pass or Brodie's refusal to shoot.

Brodie was virtually flawless as a penalty killer last year. I don't think we even got scored on when Gio took a penalty last year, but don't quote me on that as it is anecdotal.

While Brodie isn't the most physical, it also means he rarely takes penalties. Goaltenders should be able to make saves 5v5 even when their skaters screw up. Our goalies - including Smith - can all have better seasons. Heck Smith was barely replacement level at home last year.

Gulutzan's system favoured short passes and point shots. Brodie's skillset favours puck rushing, stretch passes, and creativity. The two were inherently at odds.

Brodie's elite backhand was completely unutilized on the left.

Hamonic shouldn't be absolved of his part in the pair's struggles. For much of the season his gap control was an absolute mess and he had some brutal giveaways of his own. He was also an offensive black hole which DOES matter as you have to score 4 on 5 with him on the ice. He did play better in the last couple months - but so did Brodie before he got injured. The end of the season struggles had very little to do with this D pair.

And finally, Brodie has been our most dominant Dman both times we've made the playoffs and is capable of effortlessly logging 30+ minute games. He's a player you win with. Fixating on some pizzas on a struggling TEAM is the worst way to evaluate a player.

This last one is just my opinion, but Smith's propensity to play the puck into the corners often put Brodie in tough positions. While I do prefer puck moving goaltenders, there was just a disconnect here that resulted in our defensemen having to make flatfooted decisions in vulnerable positions. I think our systems could be better adjusted so that Smith is more in sync with everyone.

[spuzzum]

Originally Posted by fleury

The NHL rarely has any large deals anymore but what if the deal turned out to be:

Hanifin, Lindholm and Skinner
for Hamilton, Bennett, 2nd rounder

It would be a quick way to retool and have another year at developing players. I'd be in favor, but I'm not sure if it would be ideal for Carolina.

If that offer was ever available, you take it to the bank and close the account. The only way it would be remotely close is if Bennett developed into the player he was projected to be. That would instantly solve the majority of the holes in the Flames line-up.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by FlamesNation23

Im pretty sure he was talking about last year on the flames.

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Last year he looked worse than any Flames D man I can remember minus Bubba.

No he wasn't. Brodie had an off year but if anyone honestly believes Brett Kulak or Michael Stone would have fared any better playing in Brodie's role I seriously question your ability to asses hockey players.

[SanFranFlamesFan]

The Flyers are considering trading Wayne Simmonds. Can you imagine a more perfect fit than the Flames? In desperate need of a top line RW and a jump start on the PP. I'm salivating. Meshes well with playmaker types like Giroux (Gaudreau).

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...ayne-simmonds/

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I totally believe that. I don't get how some fans can watch this guy literally lose us games with his poor play in his own end and defend him. Last year he looked worse than any Flames D man I can remember minus Bubba. You are not going far when one of your top four guys gets owned in every single way defensively while having extremely poor decision making skills.

Why don't you just put this in your sig so you can spare everyone derailing threads with your foaming at the mouth disdain for the guy every time he's mentioned.

This (post) is more hyperbole. We've been through this. You make grossly exaggerated hyperbolic claims about how terrible Brodie is - claiming he costs us a goal every game, that he's a net negative - and you've conceded that you're sensationalizing when we break it down objectively.

Brodie has had two bad seasons in a row for how good he was prior to that. That doesn't make him a 7th defenseman.

It's outright awful hearing you speak with a rabid tone thinking you're speaking factually every time the guy is brought up like you're educating blind masses.

[GoJetsGo]

Originally Posted by SanFranFlamesFan

The Flyers are considering trading Wayne Simmonds. Can you imagine a more perfect fit than the Flames? In desperate need of a top line RW and a jump start on the PP. I'm salivating. Meshes well with playmaker types like Giroux (Gaudreau).

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...ayne-simmonds/

But the problem is his contract is just about up, and he's likely going to command a long term and high cap hit that will take him through what could be sharply declining years. Having him a couple years ago would have been a perfect fit.

But now paying a price for him only to have to give him bank and term through his 30s is a scary proposition.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I am not even that big of a Hamilton fan, but this trade is 'meh' to me. It gives the Flames more depth.


Hey, if this was 3 seasons ago, I would have jumped at it. Lindholm was a "can't miss" all-star in the making center, with Peter Forsberg as his comparison. Hannifin was a franchise defencemen in the making.


Neither player lived up to their billing. Hannifin hasn't been spectacular at all offensively, and has been weak defensively, and is pretty low on the depth chart at the moment in Carolina (though that is a good group there).



So, they both have potential, right? Yep, absolutely.


However, it isn't like Hamilton is over the hill either. He still has MORE potential than what we have seen thus far. I don't like his consistency in terms of compete, and I think his defensive acumen needs a lot of attention, but there is no denying his value to the team right now, and undeniably he is getting better.


As for Brodie - call me crazy, but I have seen Brodie win more games for the Flames than Hamilton. Yep, he has been underwhelming now for the last two seasons, but I feel a new regime with a new system might just bring back the old Brodie. Out of Brodie and Hamilton, I think Brodie has had a lot more games where he has been dominant and a huge factor. It just hasn't happened all that much lately, and again, I would hope that the regime change fixes that. At any rate, he has proven how damn good he can be.


Hamilton is a completely different type in my eyes, but he is also very valuable. This rumored trade isn't horrible by any stretch - maybe both Carolina players could use a change of scenery (though going to the same coach..). I just think if someone wants to argue that Lindholm and Hannifin have all this room to grow, you have to argue the same about Hamilton.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

Why don't you just put this in your sig so you can spare everyone derailing threads with your foaming at the mouth disdain for the guy every time he's mentioned.

This (post) is more hyperbole. We've been through this. You make grossly exaggerated hyperbolic claims about how terrible Brodie is - claiming he costs us a goal every game, that he's a net negative - and you've conceded that you're sensationalizing when we break it down objectively.

Brodie has had two bad seasons in a row for how good he was prior to that. That doesn't make him a 7th defenseman.

It's outright awful hearing you speak with a rabid tone thinking you're speaking factually every time the guy is brought up like you're educating blind masses.

Can you ever respond to anything without turning it into insulting the poster? How in the hell are you even still here?

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by GoJetsGo

Why don't you just put this in your sig so you can spare everyone derailing threads with your foaming at the mouth disdain for the guy every time he's mentioned.

This (post) is more hyperbole. We've been through this. You make grossly exaggerated hyperbolic claims about how terrible Brodie is - claiming he costs us a goal every game, that he's a net negative - and you've conceded that you're sensationalizing when we break it down objectively.

Brodie has had two bad seasons in a row for how good he was prior to that. That doesn't make him a 7th defenseman.

It's outright awful hearing you speak with a rabid tone thinking you're speaking factually every time the guy is brought up like you're educating blind masses.

I think dissentowner is like a lot of us listening to trade proposals with the name Hamilton attached and other people sticking up for Brodie. Brodie has been terrible the last 2 years, gaff after gaff and really bad timing giveaways cost this team important points.

Maybe he can rebound with a new coach but personally I would rather take far less in a trade for Brodie than to trade Hamilton just before his prime.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by PugnaciousIntern

I don't like trading with bad teams as a general rule. I understand that good players exist on bad teams, but over the years the Flames seem to love trading with teams like Arizona. Florida, Ottawa, NYI, and now possibly Carolina.



Perhaps it's irrational, but if Carolina had been successful for the last few years, these same players with the exact same stats would be much more appealing to me. Likely also wouldn't be available! But still more appealing. I guess that I use team success as a pseudo-marker of the 'intangibles' that we always talk about.

Love to nick their coaches and management too. Maybe we shouldn’t be too surprised that this franchise is relentless at delivering mediocre results.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I can name so many worse defensemen for this team than Brodie, oh my.

Grossmann, Jokipakka, Kronwall, Wideman, Butler, Staios, Mikkelson, Johnson, Pardy, Ian ####ing White... Brodie is fine. He's regressed, but he's still fine.

Since none of these d-man are currently on the Flames, does that mean it is your belief that Brodie is the worse current d-man on the Flames?