Flames stars Sean Monahan and Johnny Gaudreau stick together

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Gaudreauvertime

Realistically, I don't see Monahan as being much more than a 60-70 point player, who should become better in the defensive end. Gaudreau could end up being a 90-100 point guy and I wouldn't be shocked in the least. That's the type of player we're talking about here, IMO.

Based on what evidence.

[the2bears]

Wow, homerrific on a Verve level.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Gaudreauvertime

Well considering he's a playmaker first, and Monahan is the primary beneficiary of that playmaking, it's pretty significant that Gaudreau scored more goals than him. Not to mention 15 more points, all in 2 less games.

There's that word again. It was three more goals. Hardly a massive difference. Beneficiary or not. We've seen Monahan score 20 goals with Glencross and Jones on his wing.

That's certainly a different level to me. Not sure how that's even debatable.

Offensively? Yeah but that's not what anyone was saying and it's not even what we were talking about, you're changing the argument. Moving forward I don't see Gaudreau being a "significantly more valuable" player than Monahan.

It's going to get real ugly for some around here when/if Gaudreau signs that big deal and fails to put up similar numbers to last season. Lord helps us if he plateaus

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Wildly Premature would be a great band name.

It's what my wife calls me as well.

[saillias]

Originally Posted by dammage79

@ Comixzone.

The Fonz laid it out nicely in the Gaudreau thread @ post #284. I agree with his slant and I agree with others that he hasn't earned a contract much more than Monahan is getting.

You and others will disagree and that's perfectly fine. From my POV though that's some serious overhype and will likely cause you to say ""Treliving is a Wizard" when the Gaudreau deal breaks. Where the few of us on the cheaper side of things may or may not see it as close to market value.

My reaction if it is over 7.5m AAV will be a slightly dissatisfied one. Monahan to me is more important to this team. We've had elite wingers before, what we havent had is a steady capable long term #1 C since Niewy. And we have that locked up for 7 years now.

I also think giving Gaudreau that much money on an 8 year deal really hurts in the chances of getting Sam Bennett and maybe one day Matthew Tkachuk locked up long term.

And I think this is why negotiations are taking so long. Maybe your thoughts are in line with the Gaudreau camp and mine are in line with the Flames camp.

We will see in the end, But I stand by me guess of just a shade under 7m per year over 6 years. It gives the team a little flexibility in re-signing other important players.

The post you are replying to addressed the salary cap argument. Even 8 mil is 10% of the cap. Johnny making that money won't kill you, it's the mediocre guys signed to 4 mil contracts who do

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Gaudreauvertime

Over the last two years, Monahan has certainly plateaued offensively. Also, not sure how the goaltending effected Monahan's Corsi numbers. . .

he plateaued in his 2nd and 3rd years in the NHL now? doesn't even make sense

Guy had 80 goals in his first 3 NHL seasons 21 years of age or younger

there are a handful of guys in the NHL right now who have matched or surpassed that...Crosby, Ovie, few others but not many

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

There's that word again. It was three more goals. Hardly a massive difference. Beneficiary or not. We've seen Monahan score 20 goals with Glencross and Jones on his wing.


Offensively? Yeah but that's not what anyone was saying and it's not even what we were talking about, you're changing the argument. Moving forward I don't see Gaudreau being a "significantly more valuable" player than Monahan.

It's going to get real ugly for some around here when/if Gaudreau signs that big deal and fails to put up similar numbers to last season. Lord helps us if he plateaus

The gap between Gaudreau and Monahan offensively makes him the more valuable player between the two, regardless of what position they play. Especially considering the fact that Monahan without Gaudreau is a less potent offensive player.

Even adjusting for zone starts, its clear that Monahan's offensive efffectiveness drops significantly without Gaudreau.

Since Johnny entered the league, only 2 left wingers have more points than him, and only 4 wingers total. Benn, Ovechkin, Kane, and Tarasenko. That's an extremely valuable player.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by dino7c

he plateaued in his 2nd and 3rd years in the NHL now? doesn't even make sense

Guy had 80 goals in his first 3 NHL seasons 21 years of age or younger

there are a handful of guys in the NHL right now who have matched or surpassed that...Crosby, Ovie, few others but not many

Here is what I said earlier, you must have missed it:

Originally Posted by Gaudreauvertime

It's not to say he can't improve, but his season totals year over year haven't improved like Johnny's have. Hence the word "plateaued" - to reach a state of little or no change after a time of activity or progress.

That doesn't fit Monahan's offensive production over the last 2 seasons?

[CroFlames]

Now I've heard it all. Johnny is an 8 million dollar player, Monahan has plateaued at 21.

Honestly Gaudreauvertime, we all love Johnny and what he brings as much as you. But your arguments are so Homer it's hard to take it seriously.

[Vinny01]

Seems like a poster here has been reading too much HF. It appears the new narrative over there is Monahan is a product of playing with Gaudreau. I read in one thread that Monahan has plateaued however the older Schiefele still has a ways to go. It is ridiculous to think a 21 year old who has had 2 seasons of over 60pts and has not once regressed year over year is done getting better.

I am pumped for Monahan next year. Listening to interviews with him this summer he and Gio are really pushing each other in training and Monahan has targeted his soles and explosiveness as areas he is dedicated to improving.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Now I've heard it all. Johnny is an 8 million dollar player, Monahan has plateaued at 21.

Honestly Gaudreauvertime, we all love Johnny and what he brings as much as you. But your arguments are so Homer it's hard to take it seriously.

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Seems like a poster here has been reading too much HF. It appears the new narrative over there is Monahan is a product of playing with Gaudreau. I read in one thread that Monahan has plateaued however the older Schiefele still has a ways to go. It is ridiculous to think a 21 year old who has had 2 seasons of over 60pts and has not once regressed year over year is done getting better.

I am pumped for Monahan next year. Listening to interviews with him this summer he and Gio are really pushing each other in training and Monahan has targeted his soles and explosiveness as areas he is dedicated to improving.

Man, where do you guys come up with these strawmen? Please, please read my comments. Where did I say Monahan is "done getting better"?

You guys are showing an astounding lack of reading comprehension.

[DynastyEra]

Anything under 7.5 over 7-8 years is a good deal for both sides. Remember guys, we will have both Johnny and Sean locked up long term. We all know their value, but the real value is keeping those two together.

It may seem like Johnny carries that line, but that is what makes him so special. Sean's hockey IQ is through the roof, its one thing to anticipate a sneaky Gaudreau pass, but its another to bury it with precision. Sean is a great finisher, something we haven't seen here in a long time at C.

Give him a year or two and he may elevate that line to a level Gaudreau isn't capable of doing alone.
Hell, give them a real bonafide, homegrown winger and see where that takes them.

[PsYcNeT]

As someone who spends time on both boards, I'm like 90% sure Gaudreauvertime is WhiskeyYourTheDevils.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

As someone who spends time on both boards, I'm like 90% sure Gaudreauvertime is WhiskeyYourTheDevils.

Ha! You beat me to it. That guy toots Gaudreau's horn all over HF and smuggly makes it known he was ''right all along'' about Gaudreau's success. Yet he craps all over Monahan every chance he gets. One of the weirdest and most annoying posters on that site when it comes to Gaudreau.

Thankfully we don't have Gestapo mods who will delete posts calling him out.

[united]

Sorry to interrupt

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/nichol...-top-nhl-rfas/
Fresh off his Olympic work assignment, Sportsnet NHL Insider Elliotte Friedman dove back into the hockey scene on Monday evening with an appearance on NHL Network that covered the status of some of the top restricted free agents.

Sean Monahan’s name was recently removed from that list, with the Flames having signed him to a seven-year, $44.625 million contract.

“I think it’s what Calgary wanted,” said Friedman. “Again, Monahan does very well too. Both sides make out really well in terms of this. I think we’ve seen the market get set. Nathan MacKinnon signed for 6.3. Barkov was in the high 5s. Mark Scheifele – who signed for eight years, not seven – was in the low 6s.

“So I think if you look at Monahan, he was the last guy to sign. He signs for a bit more than some of his peers did. So it’s a victory for him in terms of that, but it’s a victory for the Flames. They get the certainty. They get the number done. And I’m sure Calgary is going to look at it and say, ‘In a few years, if we have Monahan done for that number, we’re going to be pretty happy.’ It’s another contract they don’t have to battle over for a long time. Win-win.”

The Flames still need to get Johnny Gaudreau’s name on a contract though.

“I’m sure that Calgary would like to get Gaudreau in in that area too, but I think Gaudreau is asking higher.” noted Friedman. “I do think we’re looking at a situation where if you take a look at Gaudreau and what he’s done in the first couple of years in the league, there aren’t a lot of comparables for it. And that’s kind of what we’re looking at here. We’ve got a situation where his offensive numbers – you really struggle to find somebody who would come in at his level of experience and do what he’s done in the first couple of years.

“So I think he’s looking higher. I think he’s looking for term. I think the team is looking for term. I think what Gaudreau is probably saying is, ‘Well, if you want to do term, it’s got to be a pretty big number.’ I think they’ve talked a little bit in the last couple of days since Monahan was signed. Nobody is really discussing it, but I’ve got no information that anything is really close.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by united

Sorry to interrupt

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/nichol...-top-nhl-rfas/
Fresh off his Olympic work assignment, Sportsnet NHL Insider Elliotte Friedman dove back into the hockey scene on Monday evening with an appearance on NHL Network that covered the status of some of the top restricted free agents.

Sean Monahan’s name was recently removed from that list, with the Flames having signed him to a seven-year, $44.625 million contract.

“I think it’s what Calgary wanted,” said Friedman. “Again, Monahan does very well too. Both sides make out really well in terms of this. I think we’ve seen the market get set. Nathan MacKinnon signed for 6.3. Barkov was in the high 5s. Mark Scheifele – who signed for eight years, not seven – was in the low 6s.

“So I think if you look at Monahan, he was the last guy to sign. He signs for a bit more than some of his peers did. So it’s a victory for him in terms of that, but it’s a victory for the Flames. They get the certainty. They get the number done. And I’m sure Calgary is going to look at it and say, ‘In a few years, if we have Monahan done for that number, we’re going to be pretty happy.’ It’s another contract they don’t have to battle over for a long time. Win-win.”

The Flames still need to get Johnny Gaudreau’s name on a contract though.

“I’m sure that Calgary would like to get Gaudreau in in that area too, but I think Gaudreau is asking higher.” noted Friedman. “I do think we’re looking at a situation where if you take a look at Gaudreau and what he’s done in the first couple of years in the league, there aren’t a lot of comparables for it. And that’s kind of what we’re looking at here. We’ve got a situation where his offensive numbers – you really struggle to find somebody who would come in at his level of experience and do what he’s done in the first couple of years.

“So I think he’s looking higher. I think he’s looking for term. I think the team is looking for term. I think what Gaudreau is probably saying is, ‘Well, if you want to do term, it’s got to be a pretty big number.’ I think they’ve talked a little bit in the last couple of days since Monahan was signed. Nobody is really discussing it, but I’ve got no information that anything is really close.

Hmm . . . Wouldn't shock they end up doing something like 4x7 just to get a deal done. The cap hit for going into UFA years might be too high for us and risk being able to sign guys like Bennett and Tkachuk.

[Vinny01]

The trick with Johnny is the term. If the Flames want to buy UFA years they can get a max of 3 but a 5 or 6 year deal gets them 0-1 year so why go with a huge number. Rather pay him a bigger number over 4 years so he remains RFA than get only one UFA year at 6 years. If Johnny wants the big cap hit then the option of 8 years is the way to go.

[SuperMatt18]

I don't see any chance there is a 4 year deal.

If anything I think there are two contract terms being offered by the Flames - 2 years and 8 years.

If you go 4 years then you run the risk of him just filing for arbitration and then becoming UFA at the end of that season with there being nothing you could do.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

The trick with Johnny is the term. If the Flames want to buy UFA years they can get a max of 3 but a 5 or 6 year deal gets them 0-1 year so why go with a huge number. Rather pay him a bigger number over 4 years so he remains RFA than get only one UFA year at 6 years. If Johnny wants the big cap hit then the option of 8 years is the way to go.

I don't know if we can afford the cap associated with that kind of term. If we sign him shorter term and leave a year of RFA we will have the opportunity to sign him to long term and keep him a career flame. It might be more expensive at the end of the day, but it helps us for the near future and is less risky.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by dino7c

he plateaued in his 2nd and 3rd years in the NHL now? doesn't even make sense

Guy had 80 goals in his first 3 NHL seasons 21 years of age or younger

there are a handful of guys in the NHL right now who have matched or surpassed that...Crosby, Ovie, few others but not many

Stamkos
Crosby
Ovechkin
Jagr
Nash
Tavares
Toews
Malkin
Monahan


Those are the 9 active players who meet your criteria. Pretty much a who's who of elite offensive players.