2016 NHL Draft

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

So that's Mikhail Sergachev and Jakub Chychrun? That would make the decently sized 5'10 guy Keller? Under those circumstances I wouldn't mind either Sergachev or Keller.

Sergachyev is pretty big actually at 6'2.5" / 220 (though probably 215 once he slims down to a lower body fat) and Chychrun is on the bigger side too at 6'2" / 200

As my sig shows, I prefer Sergachyev and Keller over other options. They have the highest ceilings in my eyes.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by New Era

You just supported his point. Future Considerations is not a scouting service.

Just like your other posts, this one is also no good.

[jayswin]

Its funny, as I'm reading I kind of make fun of the group think in these prospect threads, where prospects basically fall in and out of favor while not playing any games just based on the ebbs and flows of the discussion - aka everyone naturally gets excited by every high ranked prospect when they hear interviews and see videos.

But I find myself falling into that trap with Nylander at this point. I started off reading the whole "oh he's a Nylander, he'll be soft, he's smaller, etc. But lately I've been really warming up to the idea of him.

The combination of confirming that his size is actually a little bigger than I thought, that he's not butter soft, that he's testing really well at the combine, has elite skill potential and also selfishly as a fan finding out that he has that loophole where the Flames could bring him over to the AHL this season and call him up and down at will with no repercussions/risk, has me excited.

I know the last thing shouldn't be a factor for management in making the pick, but as a fan it if he does get picked it's a really nice bonus to know our guy has the potential to actually be a call up away this season if he starts tearing up the AHL. The usual rules kind of force teams to either decide the guy's good enough to be an NHL'er (not the norm) or send him to junior and then you kind of forget about him until the next season other than stat updates.

I know it's probably not rational and attributed to the same discussion/flavor of the week bias that I make fun of on here, but I'd be happy with Nylander, he's got great skill and a lot of other attributes seem to be strengthening in my previously uneducated opinion of him that I formed from randomly reading CP opinions.

[Erick Estrada]

This has to be the most hotly contested first pick the Flames have held in decades. Not a lot of agreement and I wouldn't be surprised if the team is pretty divided over the order of the four players they have on their radar at 6.

This is going to be a very important pick as there's some really talented players available at 6 and a good chance of being controversial as I can see a couple of very good players that will be taken after the Flames so they have to hope they don't get one of the disappointments as not all of these guys will go on to great careers.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

This has to be the most hotly contested first pick the Flames have held in decades. Not a lot of agreement and I wouldn't be surprised if the team is pretty divided over the order of the four players they have on their radar at 6.

This is going to be a very important pick as there's some really talented players available at 6 and a good chance of being controversial as I can see a couple of very good players that will be taken after the Flames so they have to hope they don't get one of the disappointments as not all of these guys will go on to great careers.

Yeah, it's funny because I could easily see Keller being the steal of the draft if he gets picked in the 8-15 range, and yet even as a fan I also can't bring myself to support going "off the board" (I know there's no board ) and using the 6th on him.

I can only imagine the mental toll on GM's going back and forth on guys right now. I don't envy them.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Under the assumption that 1-5 go 1-5, we are basically debating between a 5-10, a 5-11, a 6-0 winger. None of Nylander, Keller, or Jost are going to be imposing physically and are all going to be pushed around by defenders.

Unless the Flames decide to go with a D-man or Logan Brown, both of which do not make a ton of sense with what is in the organization, then it's up to a pick of which of the smallish wingers you like the best.

All three of them in terms of raw skill are pretty close. I think Keller has the highest overall skill level of the three, which is why I like him over the other two, but I would not be complaining one bit if they went with either of the other options.

If Logan Brown was more physical, he would be right up there as well, but he's about as domineering as Colborne.

It's a weird draft with so many players that are basically identical skill wise.

I don't think you can dismiss the idea of taking a potential top pairing d-man just because we're strong there. Defensemen is highly likely to BPA on the Flames list at #6 if Dubois/Tkachuk don't fall to us. Top pairing defensemen are worth a ton in value, higher than small skilled wingers.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I keep hearing this but it's total exaggeration to say this happened on a regular basis and besides the Jets are a massive team and how's that working for them? The Flames simply couldn't play defense and stop the puck as that kept them out of the playoffs not lack of size. This team could use a player or two with a mean streak but we are talking about the 6th overall pick here which is where you are supposed to pick the most talented players not enforcers or bruising wingers.

Did some people miss the season series against ANA and LA? They looked like men, we looked like boys. We're not big enough for our division yet.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

None of 5'10", 5'11", or 6'0.5" are tiny.

5'10 163 is tiny. Keller looked like a little kid out there at the U18s vs 17 year olds. No guarantee he fills out to be more than tiny.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

This has to be the most hotly contested first pick the Flames have held in decades. Not a lot of agreement and I wouldn't be surprised if the team is pretty divided over the order of the four players they have on their radar at 6.

This is going to be a very important pick as there's some really talented players available at 6 and a good chance of being controversial as I can see a couple of very good players that will be taken after the Flames so they have to hope they don't get one of the disappointments as not all of these guys will go on to great careers.

I think the Monahan draft year was equally hotly contested. You had Nurse, Lindholm, Nichushkin, Monahan, Horvat (thanks to a big radio push from Loubardious) and Ristolainen all being talked about really heavily.

And a truck load of talk just like this year about trading up into Barkov or Drouin.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Could the Flames do a deal with the Canadiens to swap out 6 for 9 (with the Habs picking Dubois) and picking up an additional asset?

Not necessarily endorsing this option, but the potential for Flames gain is there.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Could the Flames do a deal with the Canadiens to swap out 6 for 9 (with them picking Dubois) and picking up an additional asset?

Not necessarily endorsing this option, but the potential for Flames gain is there.

Why would Montreal do that for Dubois when the chances of him being available at 6 are so small? That would be like the Flames trading up to the 4th overall to pick Puljujärvi.

And if by some miracle he was still available at 6 then why in gods name would the Flames want to give that up just to get a guy 3 spots back and an additional asset?

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by indes

I'm not sure why people don't like Nylander for us. RH winger who's not small and has a high ceiling.

I like him as a prospect. I think he'd be a great pick in the 8-10 range.

My argument is thus:
1) Wing is the least important and least valuable position
2) We need power forward wingers more than skilled finesse wingers. We have skilled wingers with Gaudreau, Shinkaruk, Mangiapane. We have no top two line powerforwards unless Ferland develops into one

Therefore at #6 in a draft with a good top end we should be drafting the most valuable positions (big top two line centres, top 3 defensemen) or if we take a winger we should take the rarer commodity and the commodity we need more, which is the skilled power forward.

I think the Flames place a lot of value on potential top pairing defensemen, higher than some other teams. Wouldn't surprise me if Juolevi and Sergachev are ahead of Nylander for the Flames because of this. It's not because Nylander sucks or he's too soft or he's too weak. It's because you don't build around skilled wingers, you build around centres and defenders. Only wingers I think the Flames have really high are the skilled, big, powerforwards. Skilled powerforwards are a lot harder to find, sign or trade for than skilled finesse wingers.

Didn't Burke say at the season ticket holder event that Nylander and Brown weren't really in our range? I guess people think he's lying?

[Erratik]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Could the Flames do a deal with the Canadiens to swap out 6 for 9 (with the Habs picking Dubois) and picking up an additional asset?

Not necessarily endorsing this option, but the potential for Flames gain is there.

If Dubois falls to 6, we are taking him. I can't imagine why we would trade down in that scenario.

[jayswin]

Maybe it's all the years of picking late first round or not at all til the second, but I'm deadset against trading down unless you're acquiring something huge. If you're picking in the top 7/8 you really hang on to that unless something incredible comes along.

That's where you pick stars that fill holes that would otherwise have to filled by $5-6/5 year deals for free agents with less skill/more age.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Didn't Burke say at the season ticket holder event that Nylander and Brown weren't really in our range? I guess people think he's lying?

Well, to be fair, he has every reason to lie at this time of the year. There's usually three types of answers you get from management right before the draft - vague - no comment - lie. The organization knows full well (Ken King has stated before) that season ticket info might as well be public comment. King even directly mentioned Calgarypuck in years past as basically like having media there to report everything.

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I don't think you can dismiss the idea of taking a potential top pairing d-man just because we're strong there. Defensemen is highly likely to BPA on the Flames list at #6 if Dubois/Tkachuk don't fall to us. Top pairing defensemen are worth a ton in value, higher than small skilled wingers.

I agree with you in terms of value. A #1/2 D-man is more important than a top 6 winger.

There is not a ton of separation between any of the names we're talking about. I have never seen a group of 7 players from 6-12 being this indistinguishable from one another. It's like the Sams/Draisaitl from 2014, but with 7 guys instead of 3. It is shocking but the guy picked at 12 could just as easily become the best of that group.

Even the next two Bean and McAvoy are really good. McAvoy is a shorter version of Noah Hanifin from last year (6-0 vs 6-3).

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Well, to be fair, he has every reason to lie at this time of the year. There's usually three types of answers you get from management right before the draft - vague - no comment - lie.

I think they're more likely to be vague and lie on national broadcasts. I think they are comfortable being more candid to season ticket holders.

[jayswin]

I had edited my post with regards to the season ticket holder aspect, but I was too slow.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Even the next two Bean and McAvoy are really good. McAvoy is a shorter version of Noah Hanifin from last year (6-0 vs 6-3).

Fabbro and Rubtsov are right there too.

[RoughRiderRowdy]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

I agree with you in terms of value. A #1/2 D-man is more important than a top 6 winger.

There is not a ton of separation between any of the names we're talking about. I have never seen a group of 7 players from 6-12 being this indistinguishable from one another. It's like the Sams/Draisaitl from 2014, but with 7 guys instead of 3. It is shocking but the guy picked at 12 could just as easily become the best of that group.

Even the next two Bean and McAvoy are really good. McAvoy is a shorter version of Noah Hanifin from last year (6-0 vs 6-3).

I guess one thing i havent really thougj about is lets say we do draft a defenceman with the 6th pick. Theres nothing saying we cant trade one of hamilton or brodie if they project the 6th pick d man to be better or equal. And we all know what hamilton or brodie could fetch us