[GDT] Ongoing 2025 WJC Game Day Thread

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I'm actually not sure this is true...and even if it is then it doesn't explain leaving off Misa and Parekh who just proved they could win by winning the memorial cup.

Colorado won a cup without grinding very much at all, Tampa won back to back. You can't be soft but in the end skill can still win.

In the end my personal feeling on this is that coaches like these types of teams better because they feel like they have more control over a team that is more of a defensive grind it out team than a team that's more of a purely talented team made up of the best players. In the end it's what the coach wants to have control over.

But as a fan I don't want to see that TBH. In the end winning or losing is made up of a lot of different factors...roster, coaching, reffing, luck, other results, etc and this iteration of Canada might win, or the iteration of Canada with Sennecke, Misa, Yakemchuk, and Parekh might have won - both have a chance at success.

But as a fan in these major international tournaments I don't want to see Chris Kunitz playing with Crosby instead of Claude Giroux, or Kris Draper on a team instead of Sydney Crosby.

I want to see the best players playing together and Canada being entertaining. Canada winning the tournament by playing like they are some underdog team that needs to grind their way to victory is boring to me, even if they end up winning.

And there's the rub.

Coaches dont really care what you or I want. They only do their job for one reason.

To win.

And that's where the disconnect comes...how you or I think that should happen vs how he or she thinks that should happen.

And to be clear...Im not even disagreeing with your position but moreso understanding why its his/theirs. They have legitimate reasons.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Iginla was a 4th liner in 2010 but he was out there in overtime of the final. You need pure gamebreakers in certain situations in knockout tournaments.

Tuesday will be interesting because you expect Finland to be sitting on 8 points. So Canada and US will be for 1st or 3rd!

No he wasnt, he played on a line with Stall and Crosby most of the tournament...Second on the team in scoring

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by transplant99

And there's the rub.

Coaches dont really care what you or I want. They only do their job for one reason.

To win.

And that's where the disconnect comes...how you or I think that should happen vs how he or she thinks that should happen.

And to be clear...Im not even disagreeing with your position but moreso understanding why its his/theirs. They have legitimate reasons.

Oh I 100% get that...but I also think there are two types of coaches and I think both coaches can be successful but have different approaches.

I think there are some coaches that can take the talent in front of them or the best players available and have confidence that they can build that roster into a winner and get those guys to play a certain way if needed (I think Mike Babcock did that to an extent in 2010 and 2014)

And there are some coaches that build the roster to fit the image of what they want it to be and how they want it to play and I think that's what Dave Cameron did here.

He didn't want to have to try to get guys like Yakemchuk or Parekh to play within a structure, he just took the guys he knew played within that structure already.

I just personally think the approach where you take the most talented players (and size and defensive play is part of talent too, I'm not just saying take the most offensively skilled players) and building a team and strategy that fits those players Vs Building the team to fit your vision as the coach is more successful over the long term.

[dammage79]

No matter which way you slice it, leaving Micheal Misa off TC over ANYBODY else is the single dumbest thing they've done.

Could have set up a potential battle for 1st overall between Hagens and Misa (Which is what I think will happen and Misa goes 1st).

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Size and talent is what you need, not a bunch of big guys that are just big. (And being strong defensively is still a talent)

Size alone is useless. Tampa, Colorado, Vegas, and Florida are teams that were big and talented. They didn't have any size that was size for the sake of being big.

Guys like Sennecke, and Yakemchuk that were left off the team are actually the type of guys those NHL teams are looking for in terms of size and skill and why they were top 10 picks.

Honestly don't see any real reason those guys didn't get a real look at being on this team.

With Parekh I can kind of see it. He's not huge, he takes a lot of risks, but in terms of Parekh not being able to play a winning style...the kid just played 30 minutes a night, had 5 points and was +6 on the way to Saginaw winning the Memorial Cup...I have a feeling he's intelligent enough to play within the structure of a winning team for team Canada.

I agree that you can’t just put a team together of big tough guys and expect to win, and that’s why I qualified my post by saying speed and skill still rule.

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by dammage79

No matter which way you slice it, leaving Micheal Misa off TC over ANYBODY else is the single dumbest thing they've done.

Could have set up a potential battle for 1st overall between Hagens and Misa (Which is what I think will happen and Misa goes 1st).

I 100% take Misa over Hagens, and I would take Schaefer and Martone too.

[saillias]

I'm a little lost by the discussion because from what I see Team Canada opted for less skilled and smaller players. Yakemchuk Wood Greentree Sennecke Misa all left off the roster for guys who score less and are sub 6 feet.

What is the argument, they are more responsible and can grind better? Feels like they used the Seattle Kraken as a model for Team Canada for some reason

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

I am old enough to remember folks ripping on Brayden Point and the terrible job he did as captain of Team Canada. Fun times. Sometimes it is just fun to cheer on teenagers representing their country.

Originally Posted by Roughneck

Thank goodness we have the elders to pass on the oral histories of nine years ago, lest they be forgotten to the ages. .

This is so good. Thanks for that.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by saillias

I'm a little lost by the discussion because from what I see Team Canada opted for less skilled and smaller players. Yakemchuk Wood Greentree Sennecke Misa all left off the roster for guys who score less and are sub 6 feet.

What is the argument, they are more responsible and can grind better? Feels like they used the Seattle Kraken as a model for Team Canada for some reason

Yeah that's the other kicker here.

Akey is the same size as Parekh and smaller than Yakemchuk. Mynio is smaller than Yakemchuk but slightly bigger than Parekh.

Sennecke (6'3"), Wood (6'3"), and Misa (6'1") are actually bigger than Howe (5'11"), Cataford (5'11") and Pinelli (5'9")

So it wasn't size as the driving factor but more that they thought these guys were more defensively responsible and just better 200 ft guys I think...

Wood is real interesting because I can't remember the last time a guy made the team one year and then was left off in his next year of eligibility.

Originally Posted by dammage79

No matter which way you slice it, leaving Micheal Misa off TC over ANYBODY else is the single dumbest thing they've done.

Could have set up a potential battle for 1st overall between Hagens and Misa (Which is what I think will happen and Misa goes 1st).

My guess here is they weren't taking all of McKenna, Misa, and Martone as under 18 guys.

So they picked McKenna and Martone over Misa.

[Sandman]

I fully agree that Misa, Sennecke, Wood, Yakemchuk, and Greentree should be on the team. The smaller guys currently on the team have grit, speed, and scoring touch- but they are also excellent 200-ft players. Like everyone else, I have questions about how this team was constructed, I just agree with some of the players left off the roster.

There are a few players on D who could maybe be swapped out for Yak (namely Akey and Mynio), but Andrew Gibson 100% deserved to be picked. He's your shutdown guy, and has the size, physicality, and puck-movement you want in your D group. Don't judge him from his offensive numbers, the Greyhounds are one of the worst teams in the OHL this season- he's an excellent defenseman who should make a good pro.

[dino7c]

Cameron made biased picks based on past butthurt and will get what he deserves...sadly the fans and players will pay the price

[Rhett44]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Who else were they supposed to play?

I don't know what their game will translate too against the US or Sweden but right now, this team was clearly built as a 200' grind em down group and it has worked....that much is pretty hard to dispute when your starting G hasn't given up a goal in 2 games.

I would think that "fans" would want to see that continue because in order to win...it has to.

It reminds me a bit of the Olympic club that went to Sochi. Only scored 14 goals in 5 games (6 in one against Austria) barely beat Latvia, barely beat Norway and then won the semi 1-0 against the US.

Yet, that was one of the most stifling/dominantly defensive clubs ever assembled anywhere....never felt like they were in trouble because they only surrendered 3 goals against in those 5 games.

There are different ways to win. One just isn't as sexy as the others.

They were built horribly. They lost to freaking Latvia as a 7 goal favorite. Possibly the greatest upset ever.

No, they have sucked and this strategy has not worked.

[devo22]

even without factoring in guys like Parekh and Yakemchuk, having a guy like Bonk playing the PP QB in the first games when he never plays that in London is nuts ... and then you see his London teammate Dickinson on the roster and it just gets more insane.

if Dave Cameron had assembled the best players and had them play to their strengths, they'd waltz through this stage of the tournament. Now he has them grind down nations like Latvia and Germany ... I mean, if that's what you want to do, knock yourself out. But it should be different.

[PaperBagger'14]

Last night over Germany was also not some dominating defensive win. A 2-0 victory with an EN goal while still allowing 25 shots against is not great. Adding onto that, Germany had probably 4 good scoring chances throughout the game. Yes, Canada was a bit better offensively than that, but we shouldn’t be trying to eek out wins against bottom feeders, that’s a weak mentality for a heavy favourite to carry.

[Enoch Root]

I am definitely in the camp that you need size and physicality, and you need to be able to play a 200 ft game and to be able to grind it out at times.

However, I also agree that there is an aspect of it that is about the coaches - they want control, and they want players that they can coach and dictate playing style to. The moment it becomes more about the coach than the players, the coach has lost the plot.

I also believe that no matter how good your team is at grinding and playing defense, you need guys that can make plays and score, to be a champion. You have to be able to hold the line, but you also have to be able to strike. If you can't instill fear in the other team's defense, you're playing into their hands (and we saw that against Latvia and Germany - after 30 minutes, these teams realized they were holding up against Canada, and their confidence grew).

This team went too far on the 200ft game guys. They are also being over-coached into the 'stay high, get pucks on net' game (it's Sutter hockey), which has neutered whatever offensive talent they did have.

The other factor is that this tournament is entertainment. Bring the best players, don't try to be the smartest guy in the room.

[Nelson]

Subtract: Ethan Gauthier, Tanner Howe, Cole Beaudoin, Mathieu Cataford and Luca Pinelli

Add: Matthew Wood, Michael Misa, Beckett Sennecke, Liam Greentree and Andrew Cristall

Subtract: Beau Akey and Sawyer Mynio

Add: Carter Yakemchuk and Zayne Parekh

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Nelson

Subtract: Ethan Gauthier, Tanner Howe, Cole Beaudoin, Mathieu Cataford and Luca Pinelli

Add: Matthew Wood, Michael Misa, Beckett Sennecke, Liam Greentree and Andrew Cristall

Subtract: Beau Akey and Sawyer Mynio

Add: Carter Yakemchuk and Zayne Parekh

Yup, and then this team would have more talent than the Americans, and still be deeper and better defensively.

But we're going to have the best GAA, so there's that.

[Enoch Root]

They were talking last night about why this tournament is so great, and I agree with Bob Mackenzie who said it's the only best on best hockey that we get every year.

But then I also got thinking that it really isn't best on best, even though it's close. That, combined with these missing players got me thinking, what team could we build from the non-roster players? (including NHLers). And without putting much effort into it, this is what I came up with (Sandman could probably make multiple corrections):

Iginla - Celebrini - Bedard
Cristall - Benson - Senneke
Greentree - Misa - Wood
Barlow - Lindstrom - Parascak

Burns - Yakemchuk
Morin - Parekh
Bertucci - Danford

There is nothing they can do about injuries or guys being in the NHL, obviously, but it is pretty indisputable that this team is better than the current roster. It's crazy to think how good the team could be if they could in fact go with the best.

[Royle9]

Last year at the U18’s Canada dominated for the most part.
McKenna and Martone were human highlight reels playing on the same line.
The chemistry was undeniable, it was an absolute clinic.

7gp - 10g - 10a / 20p for McKenna
7gp - 5g - 12a / 17p for Martone

Roll into WJHC 2025 and you’d assume Cameron would look to piggy back off that success and at least try them together, since you know it’s worked every time previously.

Nope, big Dave has to downplay the importance of the WJ’s for Canada and then proceed to healthy scratch Martone maybe for the rest of the tournament. I hope we never see his face or footprint on this team ever again.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Iginla was a 4th liner in 2010 but he was out there in overtime of the final. You need pure gamebreakers in certain situations in knockout tournaments.

Tuesday will be interesting because you expect Finland to be sitting on 8 points. So Canada and US will be for 1st or 3rd!

This is incorrect as pointed out. But it also needs more attention because some of these stains on our country are the coaches with massive egos like Mike Babcock.

Ole Babcock was going to be the hero to bring gold back to Canada, his great system and winning ways going to teach these players. He had an agenda from day 1 to bury Iginla putting on the 4th line and turning him into a plugger.

His ego almost cost the team, but finally relenting and putting together Iginla-Crosby-Nash. And guess who wins it for us Crosby and Iginla in OT.

Babocock is trash and I am so glad he is out of the league. Some of these Canada coaches are too much.