[Signing] Flames Sign Devin Setoguchi to one year 750k deal.

[Dajazz]

Devin Setoguchi, 24 pages.

Oh right, off season...

[kehatch]

You need veterans on a developing team. They cultivate competition and prevent complacency. They provide examples for the younger players to follow. Most importantly they give the coaches options so they aren't forced to put the kids in situations they aren't ready for.

But I don't think Setoguchi was signed for those reasons. The Flames have plenty of veterans on the wing. They have plenty of NHL ready prospects ensuring that competition exists for spots. Also, Setoguchi is a lazy player who lacks any urgency in the defensive zone. He isn't the type of veteran you bring on to surround your kids with.

Setoguchi was brought on to address the lack of depth we have at RW. Both on the roster, but more importantly in the system. He is a bargain player that once had a lot of potential and who is still young enough to improve. He is a long shot to be anything more than an average one dimensional offensive player. But when Hayes didn't sign with us the Flames were in a position to take a risk on him on a 1-year contract.

I don't like the pick-up personally. Not because it prevents youth. But because I really don't like the player. I think he runs counter to the culture we are trying to build and I don't have any confidence he can be more than a 20-goal / 40-point one dimensional offensive player, and only when fed lots of PP time.

But the signing isn't worth the discomfort of knotted panties. Its a low risk (if unnecessary) pick-up.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

Horak is not in the NHL because the Oilers are stupid.

The guy hasn't been able to make two of the worst teams in the league........but lets keep pretending he just hasn't been given a fair shake.

[Point Blank]

Originally Posted by stemit14

I think there is still the likelihood of injuries during training camp as well as possible trades to pick up a defenseman. I'm hoping the flames aren't looking to move out any of the young players/prospects on the team for defensive help though.

I agree that the kids should all have to earn a spot but I think the concern is that management seems to have decide there will only be one spot available and all the kids are vying for that one spot rather than having two or more positions that can be filled by either a veteran or a rookie.

Here's a hypothetical... What if granlund, baertschi, and gaudreau are all +1.5 ppg in the preseason and they all look great at both ends of the rink. Let's also say guys like setoguchi or jones maybe go pointless and really struggle in the preseason. Does anyone think the flames will then put setoguchi and jones on waivers to make to make room to give the spots to the kids that seemingly have earned it with hard work in the offseason and a strong showing at camp? I would personally hope so cause that would actually show a true meritocracy. We hear that word every year all over the NHL but few teams actually follow up with it.

Don't get me wrong... It would be great if Setoguchi and jones both had great camps and so did the kids. I just hope everyone that has been told they can earn a spot are really given the chance.

The thing with hypotheticals is you can come up with just about any scenario. I could say hypothetically 3 forwards and 2 defenseman vets can get injured, which seems much more likely than your hypothetical

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

If you can bring a guy up too soon, isn't it possible to leave a guy in the minors for too long? Leland Irving comes to mind...

Irving's performance in the AHL is most of what kept him off of the Flames roster. In his best professional season in NA he posted a .913 SP, and then he split time between Abbotsford and Calgary the following year. His development looked on track in the 2011–12 season, and then his performance dropped considerably the following year. He never really showed consistent enough progression to force the Flames' hand—never dominated in the AHL, and never looked quite comfortable enough to stay in the NHL.

I don't think Irving is a good example of a player who suffered for spending too much time in the minors at all. What else were the Flames supposed to do with him?

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

I just don't see why a bottom feeder team like the Flames need to go into camp year after year with with 22+ one way deals. There should be at least 2 or 3 spots open with about 10 guys having a realistic chance of being able to compete for those spots.

There are plenty of realistic chances to be had for prospects and rookies to make this year's team, regardless of how many one way deals the Flames have already signed. Monahan forced his way onto the team last year. Brodie did it back in 2011. There will be many more players in the next three years who will follow suit.

I much prefer having a situation where prospects have to force the team's hand to claim a spot, rather than have openings that they will fill with the best of a lot who may not be ready to play yet at a high enough level.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

With/without Seto, the fate will be the same. I don't see him changing much. He will make a couple of guys work harder to earn their spots and should chip what will likely be a lot of goals for this team ~20.

Washed up or not, he is instantly one of the 2014 Flames best players lol.

So a guy who was the clearly at best the 7th or 8th best forward on the Jets ( a team that was 7 pts better than the worst Flames team in Flame History)

Ladd
Wheeler
Kane
Byfuglen
Jokinen
Frolik
Scheifele

and scoring 11 goals in a full season is going to be a top player on the Flames and somehow double his goal production

Will he be knocking Bouma down his spot on the third line to the 4th line?


I guess the signing bothers me in that Flames Management has clearly indicated how bad they think this team is. They are looking for NHL caliber fillers.

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I guess the signing bothers me in that Flames Management has clearly indicated how bad they think this team is. They are looking for NHL caliber fillers.

I'm pretty sure most people have indicated how bad they think this years Flames roster is. On paper they look terrible and like it or not, Setogucci looks better by comparison on this roster.

If you're expecting this team to be better than last year, you're probably in for a rough year.

[CsInMyBlood]

The problem I have with signing Setoguchi is as others have said one less spot to compete for. Regardless of what is said by management, Setoguchi will be given way more chances to succeed than one of our AHL players hoping to make that jump. Just easier to keep guys in the AHL.

Setoguchi is another "meh" player just like Stajan and Jones. Management kept talking about how it was important to keep a couple of spots open for the rookies to fight for. Then it seems like Treliving got bored and signed Setoguchi. What is the point? This is the time to see what we've got in our prospects as we aren't going to be competing for a playoff spot. We have so many guys that deserve their NHL shot.

I was happy that the Flames jettisoned a useless Galiardi to open a spot, don't like that they flled it with a useless Setoguchi.

[ah123]

Didn't see this posted here; a bit of a conspiracy theory, but it makes sense in a way

The other day I wrote about the 12 things that -- if they happen, would result in the Flames drafting Connor McDavid next June. The Setoguchi signing further supports my third point in that story and that was that all of Calgary's best prospects end up playing this season in the AHL (or OHL).

Although this will never be stated publicly, you can't help but wonder if the Setoguchi signing is part of a bigger, master plan to finish in the bottom two this year and have a shot at one of the two much-ballyhooed and potentially franchise-shaping generational players eligible for next year's draft in McDavid or American Jack Eichel.

Perhaps the Setoguchi signing -- a no-risk pick-up that has only upside and yada, yada, yada as stated publicly by the Flames, is also being viewed internally, behind closed doors, as more of a 'may work but we're fine if it does not' move than a 'win now' move. I won't characterize it as a 'lose now' move as that's not the culture being cultivated here but not-winning may ultimately be the end result, no matter how hard you're trying, if you end up icing a team that just doesn't have the talent.

http://flamesfrom80feet.blogspot.ca/...dwindling.html

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I'm pretty sure most people have indicated how bad they think this years Flames roster is. On paper they look terrible and like it or not, Setogucci looks better by comparison on this roster.

If you're expecting this team to be better than last year, you're probably in for a rough year.

There is realism that they were not quite a playoff team but having a combination of Gaudreau, Knight and Agostino or Granlund or Baertschi or Hankowski or Wolf or Van Brabant in the line up and them exceeding expectations was a far more hopeful situation than having an old line up of guys playing out the string.

The incredibly weak on paper line-up that the Flames put on the Ice after the trade deadline went 12-9

I guess that I have to be careful what I ask for...If somehow this line-up does better than last year's it would validate my Grit theory

I have been advocating that the Flames get down to the minimum 3-4 softer players.

With the 1 way NHL contracts there is Hudler and Raymond that are soft players. The next softest player is Monahan and at least he is big and strong and doesn't get pushed around.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

...I guess that I have to be careful what I ask for...If somehow this line-up does better than last year's it would validate my Grit theory.

No. It really won't. Not in any way.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by ah123

Didn't see this posted here; a bit of a conspiracy theory, but it makes sense in a way



http://flamesfrom80feet.blogspot.ca/...dwindling.html

Didn't read the article if the quoted section is the most valuable piece of information.

Does it discuss the Hiller signing? Leaving holes in goaltending is the best way to tank a season and we sure addressed that area, even if Hiller doesn't return to 100%.

The flames signed a proven player who may be a reclamation project but is still young enough to be part of the future IF it does work out. Hence the low risk, high reward.

Hartley would not risk his reputation in the NHL by spending the season tanking with a crap player on the team in place of a hungry prospect.

If Hartley gets fired and Dallas Eakins takes his job, we'll know the Flames are in tank mode.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

Didn't read the article if the quoted section is the most valuable piece of information.

Does it discuss the Hiller signing? Leaving holes in goaltending is the best way to tank a season and we sure addressed that area, even if Hiller doesn't return to 100%.

The flames signed a proven player who may be a reclamation project but is still young enough to be part of the future IF it does work out. Hence the low risk, high reward.

Hartley would not risk his reputation in the NHL by spending the season tanking with a crap player on the team in place of a hungry prospect.

If Hartley gets fired and Dallas Eakins takes his job, we'll know the Flames are in tank mode.

Hiller signing makes absolutely no sense for a tanking team.




Hartley had no reputation in the NHL.

He was totally willing to accept any position in the NHL as he was basically done as a NHL coach.

He was coaching a club team .... not the national team in Switzerland.

He was out of teh NHL for 5 years. The 5 years before that he got the Thrashers to the playoffs 1 out of 5 years and they lost their 4 playoff games.


If the Flames would have let him go after his disastrous first year with the Flames (coaching a team with Iginla, Bouwmeester, Kipper, Hudler, Tanguay, Glencross, Gio and Sarich to a 24th place finish), he would not be hired by any NHL team.


Hartley may be a good AHL coach as he did a great job with the Flames AHL roster last season.... but to imagine that he has a NHL reputation to consider is absurd.

Hartley was brought in to be the tanking coach. No coach with an NHL reputation to protect would have taken the job.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Hiller signing makes absolutely no sense for a tanking team.




Hartley had no reputation in the NHL.

He was totally willing to accept any position in the NHL as he was basically done as a NHL coach.

He was coaching a club team .... not the national team in Switzerland.

He was out of teh NHL for 5 years. The 5 years before that he got the Thrashers to the playoffs 1 out of 5 years and they lost their 4 playoff games.


If the Flames would have let him go after his disastrous first year with the Flames (coaching a team with Iginla, Bouwmeester, Kipper, Hudler, Tanguay, Glencross, Gio and Sarich to a 24th place finish), he would not be hired by any NHL team.


Hartley may be a good AHL coach as he did a great job with the Flames AHL roster last season.... but to imagine that he has a NHL reputation to consider is absurd.

Hartley was brought in to be the tanking coach. No coach with an NHL reputation to protect would have taken the job.

This entire post=drivel. Might be worse than your idiotic RGI fascination.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Hiller signing makes absolutely no sense for a tanking team.

No $hit. We're not tanking.

[Gaskal]

Someone activate the "This post is terrible" Bat signal!

[Caged Great]

Actually Hiller's signing does make some sense if you're going to tank. It's 4.5 million dollars closer to the floor for a goalie that's not as good as Ramo was last year. They both had a .911 sv%, while Hiller did post a better GAA at 2.48 vs Ramo's 2.65. Anaheim was one of the very best teams, while the Flames were not. Add in 3 million for Engelland and you have 7.5 million tied up in players that won't really contribute much to wins in the standings.

[Poe969]

and he's had health issues in the past.....Those two signings are a lot worse than this one if you wanna nit pick and they're not really that bad.

As for Setto, this isn't as bad as some are making it out to be. And stop referring to an "older player" people. He's 27!! I'm guessing more than half of us are older than that!

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I'm pretty sure most people have indicated how bad they think this years Flames roster is. On paper they look terrible and like it or not, Setogucci looks better by comparison on this roster.

If you're expecting this team to be better than last year, you're probably in for a rough year.

I think the Flames will have a tough time dipping below what will likley be shameless tanking. The only way the will finish bottom four will be if they just go full tank, and we know they won't do that.

Originally Posted by ricardodw

So a guy who was the clearly at best the 7th or 8th best forward on the Jets ( a team that was 7 pts better than the worst Flames team in Flame History)

Ladd
Wheeler
Kane
Byfuglen
Jokinen
Frolik
Scheifele

and scoring 11 goals in a full season is going to be a top player on the Flames and somehow double his goal production

Will he be knocking Bouma down his spot on the third line to the 4th line?

I guess the signing bothers me in that Flames Management has clearly indicated how bad they think this team is. They are looking for NHL caliber fillers.

If BT is right about his attitude I can see him playing top 6 and PP. He'll increase his production. I don't think they got him to be a plug, they are giving him a chance to fix his career - ala Mason Raymond last year with the Leafs.

If he out competes Bouma, yes he will bump him (and maybe others) down.

A true meritocracy should not be a cause for concern for anyone. Kids earn a spot or they don't. Just like last year.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Will he be knocking Bouma down his spot on the third line to the 4th line?

... his spot IS on the fourth line. He's not (and never was) a true third line forward for us. The only reason he played some extra minutes last year was because of injuries and because he has a spot on special-teams (PK). On a healthy team (even this one) he's a fourth line guy.