2018/2019 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Calgary_81]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

OK, time out, hold on. Let me get this straight.

Calgary receives Semyon Varlamov and a 2021 7th (???)

Colorado receives Sergei Bobrovsky, a 2019 5th, and a 2020 6th

Columbus receives... Mike Smith OR Curtis Lazar OR Michael Stone OR a conditional 2020 3rd (???)

Why on earth does Columbus do this??? Why does Colorado receive both the better picks and the better goalie than those that Calgary receives?

All I can say is... what the hell?

You know Brobvosky is rumored to have told the CBJ management he will be trying out Free Agency, and he has been sitting on the bench as per management orders?


And it wasn't OR Stone Or Lazer...it was AND Stone AND Lazer..

And let's see your mock up trade,Scorp!

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Calgary_81

Pretty big talk coming from you!

Idk what this is supposed to mean but ok.

I think it would take Jankowski and a 2nd to pry Bobrovsky from Columbus -- and that's at the very least. It's early in the season still and the dude still has huge value. Columbus sure as hell isn't trading him for a lesser UFA goalie in Varlamov.

(I don't necessarily think Varlamov is worse than Bob in a vacuum but he certainly has less value.)

I do agree with you that we should target Varlamov. He'd probably cost less, for sure. Probably still a 2nd, but not a guy like Jankowski. I think Varlamov could probably be had for a 2nd and a guy like Phillips.

[Calgary_81]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Idk what this is supposed to mean but ok.

I think it would take Jankowski and a 2nd to pry Bobrovsky from Columbus -- and that's at the very least. It's early in the season still and the dude still has huge value. Columbus sure as hell isn't trading him for a lesser UFA goalie in Varlamov.

(I don't necessarily think Varlamov is worse than Bob in a vacuum but he certainly has less value.)

I do agree with you that we should target Varlamov. He'd probably cost less, for sure. Probably still a 2nd, but not a guy like Jankowski. I think Varlamov could probably be had for a 2nd and a guy like Phillips.

KK sorry for the misunderstanding

-The trade you proposed makes sense (Philips + 2nd) and it would probably go thru, but I don't want those piecess to go. Tired of CGY not having a 2nd and we need Phillips in the system.

I hope GMBT can do a trade without giving up a 1st/2nd or 3rd, or any of our top 5 prospects....I know it's wishful thinking.

And yeah, I am short-changing Broboskty's value... Just hoping GMBT can take advantage of CBJs contact situation and COLs 2 No1 goalie situation.... Gotta act now! Smith letting in too many softies!

All these goalies are on expiring contracts, which is kinda rare

[Calgary_81]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Why on earth does Columbus do this??? Why does Colorado receive both the better picks and the better goalie than those that Calgary receives?

Because we made a trade with a Conference Rival without giving up a 1st/2nd/3rd. That was kinda the goal.

CBJ gets a Top 5-6 Dman on a nice contact, takes on Lazer as a reclamation project, a few picks. Not a bad haul for a guy they could lose for nothing.

[Resolute 14]

Stone is not on a nice contract if he's a 5-6. He is on a nice contract if he's a 3-4.

That being said, as a general rule: If all you're giving up is pieces you don't want anyway, it's a bad proposal. Teams are not going to give up players we need in exchange for left over junk.

[kehatch]

Why are we talking about teams trading their starting goalies at this point? Especially teams like Colorado and Columbus that are legitimately going after a playoff spot? Even a team like Detroit isn't trading their starter at this point unless its for a big return. You are waiting until the deadline before any of these guys possibly become available.

If we had Bobrovsky or Varlamov would we be looking to trade them just because they are pending UFAs? For assets like a second?

[iLoveLamp]

If all it takes to land Varlamov is Phillips and a 2nd, you do that in a heartbeat. We don't "need" Phillips. Odds are he'll never become a full time nhler

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Stone is not on a nice contract if he's a 5-6. He is on a nice contract if he's a 3-4.

That being said, as a general rule: If all you're giving up is pieces you don't want anyway, it's a bad proposal. Teams are not going to give up players we need in exchange for left over junk.

You'd think people would get that from the Hanifin/Lindholm deal.

Though maybe they're jaded from the Iginla and Reg deals.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Calgary_81

Would anyone be down to get Goalie Varmolov from COL?

He is on a 5-game losing streak. With COL giving up 2nd rounder for G Grauber... Maybe now GMBT can "rent" Varmolov this season, since his stock is low. Would COL even trade Varmolov to a Conference rival?

What would the trade even begin to look like ? Bring in a 3rd team in the mix?

Hmmm
-COL trades G Varmolov to CBJ for Brobvosky
-CBJ then flips Varmolov to the Flames for Smith/Lazer/Stone/4th Round could turn into a Conditional 3rd in 2020
-Flames send a 2019 5th rder and 2021 6th rder to COL?
- COL sends CGY a 2021 7th rder

Cmon GMBT - you overdue for a blockbuster goalie trade!

Varlamov probably ends his streak tomorrow, if he starts.

[H2SO4(aq)]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Not rocket science, but it does require a good deal more insight than we have to figure out whether changes will be made, and where they will occur. Maybe it's Sigalet; maybe it's not. But I refuse to surrender any ground on this notion that somehow the issue is obvious. It is not.


Because I don't believe that any of you actually see something meaningful enough to conclude that Sigalet is certainly part of the problem.

I am also really fascinated by this point: how much fans's feelings on a matter can drive what they see and what they think that they know. People are so frustrated by the Flames goaltending that they have absolutely convinced themselves the coach is not doing his job. In a near vacuum of information about his job performance a good number of intelligent posters have formed VERY strong opinions about Jordan Sigalet. Am I the only one who finds this really interesting?

Keep bolding certain words. It’s bad ass as hell.

Ps, just give up this dumb argument man. Sigalet may not be the only problem but evidence suggests he’s certainly part of the problem. You come across as super petty. You can lose an argument every now and then too, mate.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by H2SO4(aq)

Keep bolding certain words. It’s bad ass as hell.

Ps, just give up this dumb argument man. Sigalet may not be the only problem but evidence suggests he’s certainly part of the problem. You come across as super petty. You can lose an argument every now and then too, mate.

Correlation =/= causation.

I’d much rather see Textcritic keep up this argument. What’s dumb is making a conclusion, using “evidence” that may has an incredibly weak connection, and then going on tangents about how you don’t need actual evidence to form opinions. I mean, that’s absolutely true, but at that point the chances of your opinion being justifiable or just dumb are pretty even, so excuse some members of the crowd for not giving them the respect you think they deserve. Suggesting Sigalet is part of the problem because our old, unproven, or castoff goaltender rotation over the past 5 years hasn’t turned out a gem is a nice guess, but it’s just a symptom of people with out answers wanting them, and wanting to feel like they’re clever and figured something out. It’s faith based reasoning, which is fine, but it’s not going to lend you any credit.

People can have any opinion they want on anything, but opinions aren’t above scrutiny, and when they fail on having anything good to back them up, they’re just beliefs, and shouldn’t be stated as fact.

Either way, when you’re reached the point where you’re trying to mock a poster for bolding a couple of words, you’re not in a position to call people petty. Though, maybe text formatting really is like a prison tattoo and you’re being serious. What do I know.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Calgary_81

Would anyone be down to get Goalie Varmolov from COL?

He is on a 5-game losing streak. With COL giving up 2nd rounder for G Grauber... Maybe now GMBT can "rent" Varmolov this season, since his stock is low. Would COL even trade Varmolov to a Conference rival?

What would the trade even begin to look like ? Bring in a 3rd team in the mix?

Hmmm
-COL trades G Varmolov to CBJ for Brobvosky
-CBJ then flips Varmolov to the Flames for Smith/Lazer/Stone/4th Round could turn into a Conditional 3rd in 2020
-Flames send a 2019 5th rder and 2021 6th rder to COL?
- COL sends CGY a 2021 7th rder

Cmon GMBT - you overdue for a blockbuster goalie trade!

Scorp did a good job of breaking this down, but how do you come to the conclusion that Varlamov’s stock is low? GM’s are smart, they don’t value players on the previous 5 games sample.

The dude still has a .927 SP this year. If his stock is low than what is Smith’s?

[H2SO4(aq)]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Correlation =/= causation.

I’d much rather see Textcritic keep up this argument. What’s dumb is making a conclusion, using “evidence” that may has an incredibly weak connection, and then going on tangents about how you don’t need actual evidence to form opinions. I mean, that’s absolutely true, but at that point the chances of your opinion being justifiable or just dumb are pretty even, so excuse some members of the crowd for not giving them the respect you think they deserve. Suggesting Sigalet is part of the problem because our old, unproven, or castoff goaltender rotation over the past 5 years hasn’t turned out a gem is a nice guess, but it’s just a symptom of people with out answers wanting them, and wanting to feel like they’re clever and figured something out. It’s faith based reasoning, which is fine, but it’s not going to lend you any credit.

People can have any opinion they want on anything, but opinions aren’t above scrutiny, and when they fail on having anything good to back them up, they’re just beliefs, and shouldn’t be stated as fact.

Either way, when you’re reached the point where you’re trying to mock a poster for bolding a couple of words, you’re not in a position to call people petty. Though, maybe text formatting really is like a prison tattoo and you’re being serious. What do I know.

Please proofread your next post prior to hitting submit. This^ was unreadable.

[The Boy Wonder]

Here’s the jist of it:

If a team (any team) has an average goalie and an average goalie coach then the goalie coach has a certain chance of getting the goalie to play above average

If a team has an average goalie with an above average goalie coach, you could safely assume that the odds of getting above average play is higher than with an average coach.

I think that 5 seasons of coaching in the nhl gives you a statistically relevant sample size from which to judge sigalet. And his goalies have been average to below average for that entire time (don’t need to quote the numbers since they’ve been posted already but every goalies stats dropped from season before joining flames)

We don’t know how much correlation there is between his performance of goalies and sigalets coaching but any sane person can assume it is greater than zero %

So all that said, if there is no way to improve goaltending with getting better goalies then the choice should be finding another goalie coach.

The results could be the following

Goalie play improves, we can attribute it in some non zero amount to new coach
Goalie play stats the same, proving minimal correlation
Goalie play gets worse, opening a Pandora’s box of hot takes


I don’t know if sigalet is the problem but trying someone else is the only real option given the trade market for goalies currently

[H2SO4(aq)]

Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder

Here’s the jist of it:

If a team (any team) has an average goalie and an average goalie coach then the goalie coach has a certain chance of getting the goalie to play above average

If a team has an average goalie with an above average goalie coach, you could safely assume that the odds of getting above average play is higher than with an average coach.

I think that 5 seasons of coaching in the nhl gives you a statistically relevant sample size from which to judge sigalet. And his goalies have been average to below average for that entire time (don’t need to quote the numbers since they’ve been posted already but every goalies stats dropped from season before joining flames)

We don’t know how much correlation there is between his performance of goalies and sigalets coaching but any sane person can assume it is greater than zero %

So all that said, if there is no way to improve goaltending with getting better goalies then the choice should be finding another goalie coach.

The results could be the following

Goalie play improves, we can attribute it in some non zero amount to new coach
Goalie play stats the same, proving minimal correlation
Goalie play gets worse, opening a Pandora’s box of hot takes


I don’t know if sigalet is the problem but trying someone else is the only real option given the trade market for goalies currently

Yep. Nice try dude

Correlation=\=causation.

Take a lap.

[Resolute 14]

There's some irony in claiming that "opinions are not above scrutiny" when there are a number of people attempting to pass their opinions of Sigalet off as being above scrutiny. Not coincidentally, many of them offered the same opinions and the same attempts at delegitimizing criticism of Gulutzan at the time.

[Harry Lime]

All I'm getting from all of this is that in real life Sigalet is probably a hell of a nice guy, and it's going to suck when he loses his job, but he likely will.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by H2SO4(aq)

Please proofread your next post prior to hitting submit. This^ was unreadable.

Oh no, “have” turned into “has” and “you’ve” turned into “you’re.” Totally unreadable!

Maybe get hooked on phonics and get over it.

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

There's some irony in claiming that "opinions are not above scrutiny" when there are a number of people attempting to pass their opinions of Sigalet off as being above scrutiny. Not coincidentally, many of them offered the same opinions and the same attempts at delegitimizing criticism of Gulutzan at the time.

Please provide one instance of an opinion of Sigalet being above scrutiny.

[Knut]

[KootenayFlamesFan]

What happened to this thread?