Israel and Lebanon now fighting

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I'm surprised you didn't whip out the anti-Semetic brush to paint that post broadly. The post was against Israel... so the poster is anti-Semetic, right? They're a bigoted racist, no?

Maybe next time I will. Especially when people start saying Hezbollah ISN'T a terrorist organization, and that Israel is at fault for everything that has happened.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Regorium

This post sums up why YOU have no credibility. Every single post you're insulting people sympathezing with Lebanon as "sick, twisted people that hate the US/Israel".

Come back when you're not so anti-Lebanon.

No I don't insult people that support the citizens of Lebanon, I just find it sick that people will sympathize with a terrorist organization, and COMPLETELY blame Israel for everything that has happened, WITHOUT acknowledging that Hezbollah really started it all.

I believe that Israel will HELP Lebanon in the long run, as getting rid of Hezbollah IS a good thing.

[redforever]

The present situation is the result of "appeasement" which is never a short or long term solution to anything. If you keep on ignoring the situation, hoping it will go away, it wont, and eventually it becomes full blown as the situation is now. When you bury your head in the sand, it only says that you are refusing to actually see a situaion.

Israel has made major concessions in their search for peace. Part of what was once northern Israel was returned to Lebanon. What happened? The Hazbullah moved in there, only to be closer to bomb their intended target of Israel. And where did Hazbullah move in? Well they moved their rocket launchers, members of their terrorist organization into the homes of the civilians in Lebanon. Terrorists always do this, in the the hope that if violence does occur or escalate, then people in other parts of the world will be sickened by the fact that civilians are victims in the conflict. Israel has shown huge restraint for over 5 years but the kidnapping of their soldiers took the situation over the top. So why do you think civilians are now being killed in the conflict?

The Lebanese govt knows full well that the Hazbullah are a terrorist organization as does most of the democratized world. Lebanon has done nothing with them, and now they are so established in southern Lebanon that they have actually democratically elected Hazbullah members to their parliament. In other words, the terrorists now have become what some call "legitimized" through democratic electoral voting. Should Canada keep diplomatic relations with them, knowing full well they are a terrorist organization? Shall we try appeasement as the Liberals have done in the past, as the UN does, as Lebanon does?

On to the Gaza Strip. What has happened here? Well, Israel arranged for the relocation of its citizens out of that part of the country. Do you remember the circumstances of this relocation? Israel had to bring in their army, to move out their own citizens. Most of the Israeli people living there certainly did not go on their own volition. So, let's complete the scenario now.

Israel moved out of the Gaza strip, using military force against its own citizens, for what? their search for a peaceful state.

And what is the present scenario since that occurred? Well now some parts of Palestine have democratically elected the Hamas, another terrorist organization. And what has the balance of Palestine done? Absolutely nothing. And tell me, should Canada retain diplomatic relations with yet another known terrorist organization? Should Canada too try to appease this terrorist group?

So tell me, does appeasement work?

War of course is never a good answer to any situation or the best alternative, but if the only policy implemented is appeasement, then too often full blown war is the end result. One of the countries involved in the present conflict has bargained in pretty good faith over the last 4 or 5 years but guess what folks? You cant bargain with terrorists!!!

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by peter12

Lanny...

Don't you understand that the Holocaust is still at the basis of Israeli regional policy?

No, I'm sorry, I don't. Please explain it to me. I do not see how an event that took place in Germany has any bearing on their regional policy. Last time I checked, there weren't many Nazi's hiding out in the middle east. I think its time Israel got over the Holocaust. It was tragic, it was appaulling, it was barbaric, but it was also 60+ years ago and in another part of the world.

Don't you understand that the Holocaust is still at the basis of extreme Muslim states policy on Israel?

No, I'm sorry, I don't. Please explain it to me. I do not see things that way at all. I see the Arabs being upset becaise their homes were taken away from them. They have been displaced. Unless you have been displaced I don't think you'll ever understand the feeling of dispare. I sympathize with anyone who was forced out of their home and harbor ill will against those who forced them out. I think this ill will is what sets the policy, not the holocaust.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Why do you keep bringing up the holocost and Nazi Germany? What do they have to do with the subject at hand?

Now why would Arabs be ****ed and want to lashout at Israel around 1948? Couldn't be that the Arabs were klicked off their land to create a country that had never existed prior to that? The UN robbed Peter (well, Mohammed actualy) to payback Paul (well, really Saul). I don't knw why they would develop any hard feelings at all! I mean, you got kicked out of your home, and someone who had no claim to it was given your home, wouldn't you be a little ****ed?

I know I would. Still doesn't give me ANY right to lash out with repeated terrorist attacks, numerous times, against that country.

What has been done, is done, and nothing will change that.

[Azure]

First you call it a procedure to annhilate terrorists, now you call it a war. Make up your mind. If it's a war, then Hizbollah have every right to retaliate and capture Israeli soldiers trying to wreak havoc in Lebanese territory.

I called it procedure? Where?

And whats the difference between that and war?

Plus, I never said that Hezbollah didn't have the "right" to capture Israeli soldiers, but by doing so they most also pay the consequences of war.

Don't you find it a bit ironic that Hezbollah, a group started to free Lebanon from Israeli control, is now forcing Israeli to do the exact thing they were fighting for not to happen?

See, the sad thing is you wouldn't mind seeing a war where the people of the Middle East are destroyed. When you come from that form of thinking, then you my friend are a lost cause to humanity anywhere. Are you even Canadian?

You're the one who first mentioned war between the ME and the West, right?

If it comes to that, bring it on.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by spiteface

How about cowards that fly above with F16s and take out buses carrying aid to Lebanese ppl with white flags hanging from their doors? Yes believe you me, this is what is happening right now this second in Lebanon. People speak of Holocaust, well this is a well-covert version of it.

Way to turn the conversation around.

You think Israeli is "trying" to hit innocent Lebanon civilians? Or is that the information you're being fed by a media that doesn't know how to do its job properly?

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by peter12

I wouldn't mind a war in which the extremist Islamists are wiped from the face of the earth. And you know what, I'm pretty sure the people of the Middle East would be on side with that.

If this is war, then Israel is acting as a State, Hezbollah is acting as a terrorist group.

How about extremeist Jews too? Would that be fair? How about if all extremeists are wiped out? Do you think THAT is going to be the solution to repecting each other's differences?

[Azure]

No, I'm sorry, I don't. Please explain it to me. I do not see how an event that took place in Germany has any bearing on their regional policy. Last time I checked, there weren't many Nazi's hiding out in the middle east. I think its time Israel got over the Holocaust. It was tragic, it was appaulling, it was barbaric, but it was also 60+ years ago and in another part of the world.

Fair enough Lanny.

Then the Palenstinians should get over the land that was "stolen" from them too.

Don't you think?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

How about extremeist Jews too? Would that be fair? How about if all extremeists are wiped out? Do you think THAT is going to be the solution to repecting each other's differences?

Do the extremist Jews have the degree of political and social power that extremist Muslims? No, because Israel is a free democracy.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by peter12

Do the extremist Jews have the degree of political and social power that extremist Muslims? No, because Israel is a free democracy.

They have greater power! The have the ability to make wars happen for Christ sake!!! You don't think that guys with names like Abrams, Bernstein, Blakeman, Bolton, Brinker, Chertoff, Feith, Fleisher, Gottesman, Kurtzer, Lavin, Lefkowitz, Libby, Mehlman, Sembler, Silverstein, Sobel, Weinberg, Weiser, Wolfowitz, and Zakheim have any power? These are major players in the Bush Administration and consolodate his power. Add in guys like Perle, Luttwak, Kissinger, Adelman, Saltoff, Grossman, Haass, Zoellick, Schesinger, Cohen, Goldsmith, Gildenhorn, Gersten, Weinberger, etc. etc. etc., and you have more than any extremeist Islamist will ever have. When you have a direct pipeline to the guy who controls the worlds most powerful military, you have a great deal of power.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Azure

Fair enough Lanny.

Then the Palenstinians should get over the land that was "stolen" from them too.

Don't you think?

Yup, the minute reparations are metted. Once that is settled everyone should STFU for the rest of time!!!

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Oooooh, an internet tough guy! Trust me sister, I've stared down more intimidating people than you'll ever imagine. You're little threats do nothing but make me laugh.

You are 100% right, I think most people are full of ****. You say I have a problem because I think this way, but it was my belief that you were lying that made me do my own research and expose you for the fraud you are. I was told a long time ago to trust no one, and unless you have the same blood as me flowing through your veins I don't trust you as far as I can hit a golf ball.

Your the only one on this site calling me a fraud and a lier. I think you are one of those people that walk around with tin foil in your hat so the government can't beam signals into your head.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Yup, the minute reparations are metted. Once that is settled everyone should STFU for the rest of time!!!

You think that Israel should be paying reparations to Palestine?

Love it! Get attacked, beat your attacker, and then have to pay them afterwards? Sounds like a great way to guarantee attacks in the future... even when they lose they win!

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

Yup, the minute reparations are metted. Once that is settled everyone should STFU for the rest of time!!!

Right.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Lanny_MacDonald

They have greater power! The have the ability to make wars happen for Christ sake!!! You don't think that guys with names like Abrams, Bernstein, Blakeman, Bolton, Brinker, Chertoff, Feith, Fleisher, Gottesman, Kurtzer, Lavin, Lefkowitz, Libby, Mehlman, Sembler, Silverstein, Sobel, Weinberg, Weiser, Wolfowitz, and Zakheim have any power? These are major players in the Bush Administration and consolodate his power. Add in guys like Perle, Luttwak, Kissinger, Adelman, Saltoff, Grossman, Haass, Zoellick, Schesinger, Cohen, Goldsmith, Gildenhorn, Gersten, Weinberger, etc. etc. etc., and you have more than any extremeist Islamist will ever have. When you have a direct pipeline to the guy who controls the worlds most powerful military, you have a great deal of power.

]

Conpiracy theory!!!!

[Lucky boy]

Originally Posted by blankall

I don't see why Israel has any obligation to listen to the UN.
...
Unless the UN can demonstrate it is an effective and non-biased organization, I don't see why anyone should be bound to its decisions.

Originally Posted by Lucky boy

The UN approved the creation of Isreal in 1948. Isreal owes its existance to the UN.

Originally Posted by Azure

Then maybe the UN should do something about those countries/groups that want to get rid of Israel, don't you think?

Or right, I'm a tool so you won't respond to me.

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I'm surprised you didn't whip out the anti-Semetic brush to paint that post broadly. The post was against Israel... so the poster is anti-Semetic, right? They're a bigoted racist, no?

Originally Posted by Azure

Maybe next time I will. Especially when people start saying Hezbollah ISN'T a terrorist organization, and that Israel is at fault for everything that has happened.

Where did I say Hezbollah isn't a terrorist organization. This is like the 10th time you have accused someone of saying something they didn't say.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Lucky boy

Where did I say Hezbollah isn't a terrorist organization. This is like the 10th time you have accused someone of saying something they didn't say.

I never said you did, did I?

spiteface Hizbollah is a terrorist organization? And you're not another robot to the system eh... Label everything like you're used to hearing from the news don't ya. HIzbollah has freed Lebanon's south in 2000 and continues to battel for the Shebaa Farms.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by Azure

Conpiracy theory!!!!

Yup, that's your answer for everything you don't agree with. Too bad there is more than enough documented proof to prove just how influential these gentlemen have been in the Bush Administration and taking the country to war under false pretenses.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally Posted by calculoso

You think that Israel should be paying reparations to Palestine?

Love it! Get attacked, beat your attacker, and then have to pay them afterwards? Sounds like a great way to guarantee attacks in the future... even when they lose they win!

I think reparations work both ways. I think that the Palestinians deserve reparations for the loss of their homes. I think that those Israelis that suffered from a terrorist attack deserve reparations. Once it is all worked out, that's it, the whole thing should be considered done and everyone should move forward.