[Trade] Flames trade Mangiapane to Capitals for COL 2025 2nd

[Caged Great]

for all his faults towards the end, Treliving was the Calgary Flames 2nd best general manager behind only Fletcher.

He did mismanage contract situations towards the end, but he did manage to make the Flames an elite team for a while, which is something nobody since Fletcher had done. They couldn't get it done and two important free agents wanted to be in the states after Covid. He was short sighted at times to try and build the team to be as good as possible right away, but the Flames did get there a couple times.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

for all his faults towards the end, Treliving was the Calgary Flames 2nd best general manager behind only Fletcher.

He did mismanage contract situations towards the end, but he did manage to make the Flames an elite team for a while, which is something nobody since Fletcher had done. They couldn't get it done and two important free agents wanted to be in the states after Covid. He was short sighted at times to try and build the team to be as good as possible right away, but the Flames did get there a couple times.

Oh so I'm not on this island by myself?

[VilleN]

I think Tre was decent - however he made some pretty big mistakes. I think his worst move as GM was the Hamonic trade. I hated all of his moves to get temporary bottom pairing defensemen - I really liked his Hamilton trade, and the following trade for Lindholm/Hanifin was pretty good work IMO. He left this team in a pretty bad spot, but it's hard to say if he was at fault for losing Gaudreau for nothing, and not signing Tkachuk to a longer term deal... I don't know how much he can be blamed for that -just not enough info. Getting Weegar and Huberdeau for Tkachuk seemed like a solid return for a player that wanted out, and my guess is the mandate was to stay competitive rather than rebuild when the writing was on the wall. I think he's an average GM, he's not afraid of taking big swings but I think he struggles when adding complementary pieces.

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

for all his faults towards the end, Treliving was the Calgary Flames 2nd best general manager behind only Fletcher.

He did mismanage contract situations towards the end, but he did manage to make the Flames an elite team for a while, which is something nobody since Fletcher had done. They couldn't get it done and two important free agents wanted to be in the states after Covid. He was short sighted at times to try and build the team to be as good as possible right away, but the Flames did get there a couple times.

No no no. Treliving was not 2nd. Sutter was better by every metric except drafting, which he improved into the system Feaster and Tre inherited. Treliving lost our only two superstars for very little. Sutter traded a top young D for almost nothing. Sutter took the team from 7 straight seasons of no playoffs to 8 consecutive playoff appearances. There is no way Brad is number 2 other than by being poo. Thx.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

No no no. Treliving was not 2nd. Sutter was better by every metric except drafting, which he improved into the system Feaster and Tre inherited. Treliving lost our only two superstars for very little. Sutter traded a top young D for almost nothing. Sutter took the team from 7 straight seasons of no playoffs to 8 consecutive playoff appearances. There is no way Brad is number 2 other than by being poo. Thx.

The Flames made the playoffs for 5 years under Sutter not 8.

He was just as bad as Brad with draft picks burning a hole in his pocket, poor drafting, and a terrible track record of coaches.

Treliving also had 5 playoff appearances and 2 of the best Flames teams of all time.

Sutter also was stubborn and misread the league and made us older and slower coming out of the lockout. What everyone raved about form our 04 team, the speed we played was all gone for some reason, so he could do what Brad did as well overvalue vets.

[Erick Estrada]

This conversation in a nutshell kind of illustrates why the Flames have been one of the worst NHL organizations since Fletcher left because after him the GM's have been middling to poor. Sutter and Treliving are close as they both came on strong in the early parts of their tenures with some astute trades and their work started deteriorating the longer their tenures went and both left the organization in bad states where the team needed to be rebuilt. I may give Treliving the edge only because it's hard to ignore just how bad Sutter's drafts were. Had he even just been average at drafting, the Flames may have been in a much better place when he exited. I'm not sure either of them are even average GM's. Coates doesn't get discussed much but he probably made the most impactful move of any Flames GM since Fletcher with the Iginla trade and he probably worked under the worst circumstances of any Flames GM having to build a team at a time where the team couldn't afford to attract any talent via free agency and couldn't even retain mid level players like Gagner and Cassels.

[Ped]

Tre had good trades and bad. I think he was below the line when evaluating, but he also gets way too much flack for the Huberdeau trade, when it was widely celebrated by pretty much everyone as a nifty piece of business once Gaudreau and Tkachuk spurned the Flames, as I've said before.


No one predicted Huberdeau with a league-record drop-off in points. And for those wondering why he signed him so quickly, how could he not, rather than risk being in the same situation a year later?

[FanSince'01]

I would agree that Treliving would be our second best GM of all time over Sutter. Both had their issues (and as others have pointed out, they were often fairly similar issues) but the two things that put Brad over Sutter are the two seasons we were actually an elite team, which the Flames under Sutter never really achieved, and his draft record, which is far superior to Sutter's, even with limited picks some years.

[Bingo]

CP Ranking From 2020 ...

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...eneral+manager

Probably time to redo that this summer, maybe after the draft.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Bingo

CP Ranking From 2020 ...

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...eneral+manager

Probably time to redo that this summer, maybe after the draft.

At that time I remember saying that the difference between Sutter and Treliving was that we knew Sutter's end fate. Treliving's would be decided in the next couple of years.

If you run the poll in April of 2022....people are over the moon with Treliving. Today...well it's not as rosy. He did some good things, but at the end of the day, the results are kind of mediocre.

But the data seems to suggest that the Flames are the second worst franchise in the NHL to work for behind only Vancouver. So in those conditions...tough for anyone to do a good job. Today people are quite happy with Conroy. 5 years from today...I don't think he'll be seen as Craig Button bad...but it's likely even the shine wears off him and he might be more Al Coates type of thing where it's years after he's out that some of his moves yield anything. This is a tough job in a tough market, and honestly...it's not getting easier for anyone, save a trillionaire buying the team and being 100% hands off.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

At that time I remember saying that the difference between Sutter and Treliving was that we knew Sutter's end fate. Treliving's would be decided in the next couple of years.

If you run the poll in April of 2022....people are over the moon with Treliving. Today...well it's not as rosy. He did some good things, but at the end of the day, the results are kind of mediocre.

But the data seems to suggest that the Flames are the second worst franchise in the NHL to work for behind only Vancouver. So in those conditions...tough for anyone to do a good job. Today people are quite happy with Conroy. 5 years from today...I don't think he'll be seen as Craig Button bad...but it's likely even the shine wears off him and he might be more Al Coates type of thing where it's years after he's out that some of his moves yield anything. This is a tough job in a tough market, and honestly...it's not getting easier for anyone, save a trillionaire buying the team and being 100% hands off.

Agreed.

And I'm not, nor have I ever, suggested Treliving was a savant. He made lots of mistakes; most GMs do.

But the hyperbole that kicked this off (worst all time with Risebrough and Button) isn't hard to quell.

[Johnny Makarov]

Don't forget Jay Feaster! What a slap in the face hiring him after Tampa stole the Cup from us.

Also he destroyed the Iginla and Bouwmeester trades. I hate him.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Don't forget Jay Feaster! What a slap in the face hiring him after Tampa stole the Cup from us.

Also he destroyed the Iginla and Bouwmeester trades. I hate him.

Wasn't the rumor that part of why he was hired was because he told Murray he could get Richards to come here?

[CroFlames]

So far so good for Conny, he'd rank high on the all-time list.

But who knows what he does next? Trade multiple firsts for aging veterans to try and chase 8th? He'd quickly fall down the list.

Tre did a lot of good things - mostly RFAs IMO. Lots of bad things too - Huberdeau deal, trading picks for plug defensemen.

[Paulie Walnuts]

I get a lot of the stuff but the Huberdeau contract was not an issue. This was a player flirting with 100 points and hit 115 points the year before and set a record for assists for a LW. We knew at the time we would be paying for what he did in Florida. No one predicted the drop off like we have seen.

Everyone was on pins and needles when we got 2 pending UFA's and repeating what just happened. You also got a superstar player blindsided by a trade who could have easily said let me see how the season goes, but he got him to commit to the team.

[ResAlien]

The Monahan trade debacle, losing Johnny for nothing, being unable to retain Tkachuk, and signing Huberdeau to that mega contract without one second of ice time are giant non negotiables. Any good he did prior to that was wiped out by the hopefully unintentional salting of the earth he performed on his way out the door. If he's our 2nd best GM ever we've had a historic run of GMs that suck ass

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

The Monahan trade debacle, losing Johnny for nothing, being unable to retain Tkachuk, and signing Huberdeau to that mega contract without one second of ice time are giant non negotiables. Any good he did prior to that was wiped out by the hopefully unintentional salting of the earth he performed on his way out the door. If he's our 2nd best GM ever we've had a historic run of GMs that suck ass

We have no question about it. But it is also a difficult gig with one of the worst owners in the NHL.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

The Monahan trade debacle, losing Johnny for nothing, being unable to retain Tkachuk, and signing Huberdeau to that mega contract without one second of ice time are giant non negotiables. Any good he did prior to that was wiped out by the hopefully unintentional salting of the earth he performed on his way out the door. If he's our 2nd best GM ever we've had a historic run of GMs that suck ass

I still don't understand the view that the Monahan trade is a debacle.
At that time he had negative value. The Flames basically traded a 1st for the guy who has been their best forward the last 2 seasons.
Why is it a debacle?

[1991 Canadian]

Back to Mangiapane... I can't be the only one who had the thought process of "the Capitals are having a really good season, Mangiapane must be tearing it up" ... only to see him having a below average year. A 28 point season with the lowest points/60 and shots/60 of his career.

I like Mangiapane but the Flames got great asset value in this trade. Not terrible for the Caps either as you rarely find quality UFAs that will sign for just 1 year.

Will be curious to see where he ends up in free agency.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by 1991 Canadian

Back to Mangiapane... I can't be the only one who had the thought process of "the Capitals are having a really good season, Mangiapane must be tearing it up" ... only to see him having a below average year. A 28 point season with the lowest points/60 and shots/60 of his career.

I like Mangiapane but the Flames got great asset value in this trade. Not terrible for the Caps either as you rarely find quality UFAs that will sign for just 1 year.

Will be curious to see where he ends up in free agency.

Flames dodged a huge bullet not going long term with Mangiapane after his 35 goal year. I assume the Flames would have gladly done this same cap hit on a 5-6 year term but the agent fumbled here and the 35 goal year was a one off and not a sign of things to come.