[PGT] Losers gonna lose!!

[Strange Brew]

The title of the thread is embarrassing.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Give Huberdeau the C. Give an A to Kadri. Put it on those guys next year. Tell them it's "your" team. Make them accountable. Who knows? Maybe that's what a guy like Kadri needs. Hand him the reins and see if he takes the job.

Backlund is a team best +20
Kadri is a team worst -18

Can’t reward that

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Locke

Its too late anyways.

Markstrom and Kadri sank this entire season.

And people complain about Sutter and Lucic.

Yeah, too late now. Hopefully they give Vladar more rope next season. Markstrom shouldn't have started like 17 of the last 18 or whatever it was.

[HighLifeMan]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

There's a huge difference between Vladar winning some games as a spot starter, versus getting the job done playing 2-3 times a week as 'the guy'. We already saw how that went when it was tried, and he has been for the most part, horrific since that time.

When did we see that?

[madmike]

To me Kadri has been a bigger disappointment than Huberdeau. He’s way too reckless with the puck and doesn’t use his line mates at all. I don’t care how many points he has - the guy is a dumpster fire in the top 6.

[Young Guns]

After last nights loss, todays felt like I've come from a funeral.

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Unless the W’s are all donuts it makes little sense to post W/L records when determining how goaltenders are playing.

Vladar has not been good. Neither has Markstrom. I don’t know why people are continuously arguing about which of the two goalies that have played poorly should get more chances to play poorly. It does not matter.

You can't completely ignore the fact that Vladar wins more. A goalie can be "good enough" to win without posting a shutout. You also can't discount that the team may have more confidence in front of Vladar and thus play better for him. Vladar has definitely not been given the soft starts.

I think Vladar has squeaked into "good enough" territory more than Markstrom. I also think Markstrom has been in "absolutley terrible" territory more often than Vladar.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

You can't completely ignore the fact that Vladar wins more. A goalie can be "good enough" to win without posting a shutout. You also can't discount that the team may have more confidence in front of Vladar and thus play better for him. Vladar has definitely not been given the soft starts.

I think Vladar has squeaked into "good enough" territory more than Markstrom. I also think Markstrom has been in "absolutley terrible" territory more often than Vladar.

Just ran the xGA vs GA stats in bands.

Markstrom has been either even or better than expected goals in 60% of his games, Vladar 52%

Giving up two or more than they should have ...

Markstrom 17%
Vladar 24%

Hockeyreference quality start index

Markstrom 45.5%
Vladar 43.5%

Both pretty bad, Markstrom slightly better.

[Lanny_McDonald]

That was a pretty abysmal display by a team that should have been desperate for a convincing win against poor competition. Many of the same problems that plagued the team all year were front and center this game. Same poor goaltending, same lack of a game plan, same bad lineup decisions, same poor line combinations, same perimeter play, same overplaying of the same guys, same lack of adjustment to the flow of the game. I wish we could all say this was not a predictable outcome, but this is the Sutter coached Calgary Flames after all. I was hoping we would see a couple of results like the Jets posted when they hit a couple of must win games as things tightened up (6-2 vs Detroit and 6-1 vs Jersey). The continual close games against bottom feeders is not what you should expect from a team with hopes of making the playoffs and making any noise. Such a waste of a year for the entire organization.

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Just ran the xGA vs GA stats in bands.

Markstrom has been either even or better than expected goals in 60% of his games, Vladar 52%

Giving up two or more than they should have ...

Markstrom 17%
Vladar 24%

Hockeyreference quality start index

Markstrom 45.5%
Vladar 43.5%

Both pretty bad, Markstrom slightly better.

Per 60 Vladar is -0.32 GSAA and Markstrom is -0.42. GSAA. Both terrible but Markstrom is worse.

But again, while those stats are important to understand the individual contribution of the goalies, Vladar has a way better record in front of the exact same team.

At the very least the analytics would say play them 50/50, but the results give an edge to Vladar.

So why the heck did Markstrom start all but 1 game in March? He only won 7 of them, so it's not like he was in a heater.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Yeah, too late now. Hopefully they give Vladar more rope next season. Markstrom shouldn't have started like 17 of the last 18 or whatever it was.

Ultimate Flames move would be to leave Wolf in the minors and go with these two again. Wolf should have had an opportunity in February for Christ sake.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Yeah, too late now. Hopefully they give Vladar more rope next season. Markstrom shouldn't have started like 17 of the last 18 or whatever it was.

IMO Vladar shouldn't be back next year when the Flames have a guy like Wolf who is one of the top prospects in the world at his position on a cheap contract and has given every indication that he has nothing left to learn in the AHL.

If Vladar was showing progress that would be one thing, but I would say he has regressed since signing his contract (which still puzzles me in terms of timing). At least by pairing Wolf with Markstrom, you can hope this season was a major outlier for the veteran, and he is much closer to his career averages. A half decent starter like that can insulate Wolf while he adjusts to the NHL for a season.

[I_H8_Crawford]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Ultimate Flames move would be to leave Wolf in the minors and go with these two again. Wolf should have had an opportunity in February for Christ sake.

If Sutter is back, this is EXACTLY what will happen

[Jason14h]

Does Vladar find a job next year in the NHL considering his age and salary

Seems to be a 3rd goalie type guy that gets a chance when injuries occur

No idea why we decide to resign him early when we all know Sutter starts his #1 almost every game .

[redmile04]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

The title of the thread is embarrassing.

why? its correct

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Does Vladar find a job next year in the NHL considering his age and salary

Seems to be a 3rd goalie type guy that gets a chance when injuries occur

No idea why we decide to resign him early when we all know Sutter starts his #1 almost every game .

I don't see why there wouldn't be teams who would interested in him. Maybe not a win now team who needs someone proven but a team who is in no rush and can afford to see what they have for two years.

Regardless of how Sutter plays his goalies they still need two. Vladar had a pretty good year last year and as much you would like to think Wolf would be able to take over the backup role after this season there was no guarantee he would have a strong season. Signing Vladar when they did gets him at the rate they thought was reasonable for two years of security(contract-wise) for him. The longer you wait the more you risk having to pay.

So either Wolf is ready and they can trade him or Wolf isn't and they have someone to take over his spot until he is. Having him signed can also add value for the team interested in acquiring him.

[Mr.Coffee]

If Wolf isn’t on this team come after next training camp, and his play hasn’t dipped, he should demand a trade for the sake of his career. Millions of dollars at stake.

[Tsawwassen]

Postgame links
https://stats.cbc.ca/hockey/nhl/recap/146973
https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/games/2466877
https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/_/gameId/401459818
https://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl...il-4-1.6801065