[PGT] Best team ever 3 Flames 1

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I can also give you a list of players the Flames should have drafted...can do the same with every other team in the NHL

the hindsight game

Again, no. We're not talking about hindsight, we're talking about foresight. Gio's age, combined with the decline of the team since the all star break, combined with the quick first round exit, would have pointed to Gio's best days being behind him. The trigger should have been pulled then. The Flames could have got some assets AND unloaded his contract. Instead, no assets, no playoff run, and stuck with an albatross for this year and next.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Burning Beard

So why haven't Johnny and Monahan been able to produce anything off the rush since after the ALL star break in the first year of Bill Peters? I don't think they are being told "don't rush". I bet they are being told "stop the stupid turnovers at the blue line" because thats all they have done for almost two seasons now.

The complex answer is a bit convoluted and I've already answered in a different thread.

Simple answer is Sean Monahan. If the puck always funnels to your winger, then your line becomes predictable and easy to defend. If Monahan did a better job of exiting the defensive zone with the puck up the middle of the ice, determining the pace of play, maneuvering around the opposition forecheck/backcheck and distributing to both wingers equally, then this line would be be able to score more off the rush.

If the puck always goes to Gaudreau or say Lindholm, then you end up cutting the ice in half and defenses just have to shift to one side of the ice and contain. That's why having a legitimate #1 center is absolutely vital to winning championships.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Again, no. We're not talking about hindsight, we're talking about foresight. Gio's age, combined with the decline of the team since the all star break, combined with the quick first round exit, would have pointed to Gio's best days being behind him. The trigger should have been pulled then. The Flames could have got some assets AND unloaded his contract. Instead, no assets, no playoff run, and stuck with an albatross for this year and next.

I will give it to you if you have a post saying the same thing from that summer

sure seems like hindsight...also, other GMs also knew his age and contract...what are you really getting?

[genetic_phreek]

It's funny, one good regular season out of the last what, 10 seasons and all of a sudden we're contenders and shouldn't make any moves? I said it before and I'll say it again, when we got killed by the Avs in the fashion that we did, that should have raised some red flags about where we are at. Instead this organization looks at the one successful regular season where multiple players have their career years like it's a norm and sustainable.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Sell high is such an over-used argument by fans. It's easy to say after a player declines, but the idea is to build good teams with good players, not 'sell high' every time a player excels.

I guess New England should have 'sold high' on Brodie 14 times?

No. But good sports franchises are ruthless with asset management. Doug Armstrong is one of the top execs in the NHL. Since he took over as Blues GM in 2010, he has traded away or let walk in free agency a host of prime age players, including:

Eric Brewer (31)
Erik Johnson (21)
Brad Boyes (29)
Roman Polak (28)
Ian Cole (26)
TJ Oshie (29)
Brian Elliot (31)
David Backes (31)
Kevin Shattenkirk (28)
Ryan Reaves (30)
Paul Stastny (32)
Alex Pietrangelo (30)
Robby Fabbri (23)
Jake Allen (30)

Many of these were core players and leaders on the team. Didn’t matter. Out with the old, in with the new.

The Blues 2015-16 team finished with the 3rd best record in the NHL and made it to the conference finals. Five years later, the only holdovers from that roster are Tarasenko, Schwartz, and Parayko.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I will give it to you if you have a post saying the same thing from that summer

I was ready for some big moves then https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...59#post7092759

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

No. But good sports franchises are ruthless with asset management. Doug Armstrong is one of the top execs in the NHL. Since he took over as Blues GM in 2010, he has traded for picks/prospects or let walk in free agency a host of front-line, prime age players, including:

Eric Brewer (31)
Brad Boyes (29)
Roman Polak (23)
Ian Cole (26)

All major award winners...oh wait

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I will give it to you if you have a post saying the same thing from that summer

sure seems like hindsight...also, other GMs also knew his age and contract...what are you really getting?

If you could search history beyond the last 100 posts I'm sure I could find you one.

The point isn't to hammer home on Giordano, he is what he is at this point, it isn't a huge earth shattering prediction to know this was going to happen to a guy in his mid to late 30s. The point is again, managements inability to honestly assess the team in front of them, where they are in the process of building a contender and foreshadowing a players play/ceiling. Again thats not to say they need to be perfect on every guy, but BT has pretty much dug his own grave because he's been terrible at this part of building a team. Which is why we are where we are.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by genetic_phreek

It's funny, one good regular season out of the last what, 10 seasons and all of a sudden we're contenders and shouldn't make any moves? I said it before and I'll say it again, when we got killed by the Avs in the fashion that we did, that should have raised some red flags about where we are at. Instead this organization looks at the one successful regular season where multiple players have their career years like it's a norm and sustainable.

This is the problem I have with this discussion: we know for a fact that management was not content to come back with the same team the next season.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

I was ready for some big moves then https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...59#post7092759

lol you complained about them losing=should have traded Gio

come on man

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CGY12

If you could search history beyond the last 100 posts I'm sure I could find you one.

The point isn't to hammer home on Giordano, he is what he is at this point, it isn't a huge earth shattering prediction to know this was going to happen to a guy in his mid to late 30s. The point is again, managements inability to honestly assess the team in front of them, where they are in the process of building a contender and foreshadowing a players play/ceiling. Again thats not to say they need to be perfect on every guy, but BT has pretty much dug his own grave because he's been terrible at this part of building a team. Which is why we are where we are.

Not trading Giordano after his Norris is not the Brad mistake hill to die on


To be fair though you have likely suggested trading every player every year so you probably could find that post that says that

[genetic_phreek]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

This is the problem I have with this discussion: we know for a fact that management was not content to come back with the same team the next season.

Yeah they didn't re-sign Gustafson and Forbort? Signed Rieder and Rinaldo?

Core looked the same to me.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by CGY12

If you could search history beyond the last 100 posts I'm sure I could find you one.

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...53#post7093853

[Roof-Daddy]

I was dreading this season given the schedule being completely against Canadian rival teams. It's been even more embarrassing than I could have imagined.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

lol you complained about them losing=should have traded Gio

come on man

Here you go Dino.

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...174146&page=11

Post 220. Post Avalanche series. 2 years later saying the exact same thing.

May be unpopular but I look at trading BOTH Brodie and Giordano. A team might just be willing to over pay to acquire the Norris trophy winner (i think) and we can address the forward issue (top 6 speed and 1 shot scoring ability). I can appreciate all he's done for the franchise but the organization needs to start prioritizing winning the cup above anything else. Part of doing that is moving on from players and capitalizing on their value when its high. The franchise always seems to hold on till the bitter end, only to try when they have no choice and are worth peanuts (Phanuef, Iginla, Bouwmeester, Regehr, etc.).

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CGY12

Here you go Dino.

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...174146&page=11

Post 220. Post Avalanche series. 2 years later saying the exact same thing.

You quoted me asking someone else but okay...so that's one of you

congrats you called it

[genetic_phreek]

Originally Posted by CGY12

Here you go Dino.

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showth...174146&page=11

Post 220. Post Avalanche series. 2 years later saying the exact same thing.

My same thoughts exactly.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Not trading Giordano after his Norris is not the Brad mistake hill to die on


To be fair though you have likely suggested trading every player every year so you probably could find that post that says that

Lol classic Dino. Find me a post from that summer. Ok you found one but you probably say that about every player. Ridiculous.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

You quoted me asking someone else but okay...so that's one of you

congrats you called it

I can find you a post about Monahan needing to go if you'd like too lol.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by genetic_phreek

My same thoughts exactly.

Well aren’t you guys awesome. There are additional steps in reality. Such as for whom should they have been traded, whether that team was actually willing to trade them, and how they worked out