Who do you WANT to be the Flames Starting Goalie Next Season [*NEW POLL 12·05·17]

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

11th is nothing special.

It's not elite, but it clearly well above average

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I just want a goalie who is less streaky. Too many highs and lows with Elliott. Teams need stability in goal. Even if the goalie is only going to give you a .915 Sv%, if it's that level of goaltending every night you can work with it and build a good record. Unpredictable goaltending makes it difficult to stick with systems play and build confidence. Sure, it can give you a boost when you're not playing well in front of the goalie, but those highs are short lived and consistency is a much better option than a goalie who will give you a .975 Sv% for 10 games in a row, but then give you a sub.900 Sv% the rest of the year.

The biggest thing for me is not a goalie who's gonna give us a .930 every night for a month, but a goalie who can have a terrible night, reset, and bounce back the next game. With Elliott and Johnson, the biggest issue was an inability to bounce back from rough outings.

I don't entirely blame the goalies though. My gut tells me this is a Sigalet thing, as all our goalies in the sigalet era have had this problem including Hiller during his .918 season, Ramo, Johnson, etc. When it's good, it's good, but when it's bad, it's hopeless.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I love how people have the narrative that he was only good in 2 months and completely ignore that his "good months" were the majority of his season. Elliott was ranked 11th in in Quality Start % among goalies that started 30 or more games.

You're conveniently ignoring WHY he played the majority of his games in the latter half of the season. Because he sucked the first half.

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

He was poor for the first 4-6 weeks of the year

It's about 7 weeks from 12th of October to 28th of November.

3 games in January

He only played 6 games in January.

and 2 in the playoffs.

Or to put it another way, he had 1 good start out of 4.

He was good in December

He didn't play half of December, and the other half he put up mediocre numbers. That's a really low bar for "good".

great in February

5 times below .900 in first 7 games of February, followed by the first 3 games of his hot streak.

Pretty low bar for "great.

and March

Yeah, he was great in March.

and good in April until the playoffs

Oh? He lost all 3 regular season games in April with a total SV% of .871.

In total his April numbers were 1 win in 7 games, SV% of .876 and a GAA of 3.00.

His GAA and SV% were average.

31st out of 41 is in SV% (goalies with 30 gp, your pick of a cutoff point) is a pretty low bar for "average"

But sure, his GAA was pretty close to average. Big whoop.

I would split his season like this:
- 7 bad weeks from the start of the season to late October.
- 15 below average to okay weeks from late October to late February
- 6 excellent weeks from late February to March
- 2 bad weeks in April

So in total, 9 bad weeks (including playing his worst in the most important games of the season), 6 excellent weeks, 15 weeks that can at best be called okay.

This is what I mean when I say that Calgary fans have really low standards for goaltending.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by dino7c

bring back the same team, get the same result

No. Bring back the same team and they will likely do much better in October and November 2017 than they did in October and November 2016. Bring the same team back, and we are likely to see improvements from key players like Gaudreau, Monahan, Bennett, Brodie and Elliott, which should more than compensate for likely steps back for Backlund and Tkachuk.

Bring the same team back, and they are almost certainly back in the playoffs, and likely challenging for the division.

[theslymonkey]

Originally Posted by Itse

This is what I mean when I say that Calgary fans have really low standards for goaltending.

So, out of all of that ^^^ And according to those standards, how many goalies are available that are better than Elliott?

[theslymonkey]

Dividing up the season based on weeks/months doesn't make a whole lot of sense given the team had a new coach, system, and two new goalies. The only logical way to look at the season is a collection of SV%, GAA, QS% and RBS.

The team in general was all over the map. That's why you have to include QS% and RBS because that helps exclude the level of play of the team in front of the goalie.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Not how I remember it. Elliott was constantly being given starts to play through his struggles. Johnson not so much. That's how I remember it.

Your memory is flawed.

Once Johnson started to win games in November, he was given a string of 15 starts in a month. After two poor showings on 14 and 16 Dec, Johnson surrendered the net to Elliott who on 19 Dec started the next game and won. Johnson was given another opportunity on 20 Dec, and once again had a poor showing. Elliott and Johnson alternated starts and wins and losses for the next between 23 Dec and 26 Jan, but then with a couple of good games in a row, Elliott started to string more games together. Johnson got a big win in Pittsburgh just before the bye week on 7 Feb, and was given the first game back on 13 Feb, which turned out to be an embarrassing loss to the Coyotes. Elliott went on to win nine of his next ten, and while Johnson had a good showing during this streak on 24 Feb in Florida, he was not good in his last two regular season starts.

Johnson had a great run in November and December, and was provided ample opportunities to play in January, but never performed to the same level. Elliott was better down the stretch.

[Roof-Daddy]

I've said it a few times now, but in my mind Elliott had completely erased his first few weeks of the season with his play after that, and I was fully on board with bringing him back.

He completely lost my confidence with that debacle in the playoffs though.

Our young team needed him to be steady back there while they battled with being newbies in the playoffs against a team that has had our number for years now, and instead of being a rock for them he completely let them down with one of the worst playoff performances I can remember seeing.

Unfortunately though, it looks like he may be the best option out of what there is left to pick from and if he ends up coming back I hope he hasn't lost the confidence of the players like he has with a lot of the fans, because when a team has no trust in the goalie it can lead to overall poor play and system break downs.

[bigrangy]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I've said it a few times now, but in my mind Elliott had completely erased his first few weeks of the season with his play after that, and I was fully on board with bringing him back.

He completely lost my confidence with that debacle in the playoffs though.

Our young team needed him to be steady back there while they battled with being newbies in the playoffs against a team that has had our number for years now, and instead of being a rock for them he completely let them down with one of the worst playoff performances I can remember seeing.

Unfortunately though, it looks like he may be the best option out of what there is left to pick from and if he ends up coming back I hope he hasn't lost the confidence of the players like he has with a lot of the fans, because when a team has no trust in the goalie it can lead to overall poor play and system break downs.

Exactly this. If the players still trust Elliott then he should be back. He's a better goaltender than anyone else available. If they don't well then it's time to find someone else.

[Hockeyboy2]

I want Mikka Kiprusoff to be the flames goalie in 2017......what there is no option for this? Cruddy times.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I'm so sick of this clueless narrative that he was only good for 2 months. He was poor for the first 4-6 weeks of the year, 3 games in January and 2 in the playoffs. He was good in December, great in February and March and good in April until the playoffs. He was 11th best in quality start % for goalies that started at least 30 games. His GAA and SV% were average.



This unrelenting need to blame only Elliott from so many fans is just so stupid.

His GAA and S% were average?

Of goalies that played 30+ games, he was tied for 28th in S%. That's out of 41 goalies. That's not good, or "average".

GAA? He was tied for 21st (out of 41, again). That's about smack dab in the middle.

Elliott was not a good goalie. He was average at best, and guess what? He was horrific in the playoffs.


Again though, who cares about playing the blame game. His performance? It's worth moving on from. There's no reason to bring Elliott back. No need to pile on, no need to defend, just move on.

[1_Flames_Fan]

Fleury just got cheaper

[iamca]

I voted Grubauer in both of the poll"s, but Raanta would also be a good choice.

I like Grubauer for his athleticism, age, and trajectory. I also think the cap hits would be so much better for either Grubauer or Raanta.

I think the door should be closed on Elliott for his lack of consistency and his performance (and huge deflation that it was) in the series against the Ducks.

Sigalet needs to be sent packing as there are better choices as well as the horrible track record under his coaching. You can throw every statistic you want, but the ones that count to me is how this team has looked after a soft goal...it seems like watching Groundhog Day.

[1_Flames_Fan]

Originally Posted by iamca

I voted Grubauer in both of the poll"s, but Raanta would also be a good choice.

I like Grubauer for his athleticism, age, and trajectory. I also think the cap hits would be so much better for either Grubauer or Raanta.

I think the door should be closed on Elliott for his lack of consistency and his performance (and huge deflation that it was) in the series against the Ducks.

Sigalet needs to be sent packing as there are better choices as well as the horrible track record under his coaching. You can throw every statistic you want, but the ones that count to me is how this team has looked after a soft goal...it seems like watching Groundhog Day.

I agree, at this point in my opinion Elliott is a non-starter (see what I did there ) also I like Grubauer or Raanta and try literally anyone else for a goalie coach besides Singalet.

[dammage79]

Who I want: Jonas Korpisalo
Who I think will be the Flames guy:
1of Mike Smith, Jaro Halak or MAF. Out of the "junk pile" goalies that will be available I wouldn't mind Lehtonen despite Dallas's terrible season.


If you look at Smiths body of work on that terrible team,he still posted better numbers with more starts than any of the other guys including Elliott except in the wins and losses department. On a flames team primed to push I feel he would be closer to that vezina calibre guy that back stopped the yotes to the playoffs.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

No. Bring back the same team and they will likely do much better in October and November 2017 than they did in October and November 2016. Bring the same team back, and we are likely to see improvements from key players like Gaudreau, Monahan, Bennett, Brodie and Elliott, which should more than compensate for likely steps back for Backlund and Tkachuk.

Bring the same team back, and they are almost certainly back in the playoffs, and likely challenging for the division.

Respectfully disagree. Last year's team was incredibly healthy and made into the playoffs as a bottom seed. You bring back the same team and I'd be very worried about injuries, inconsistent goaltending and that bottom pairing on defense getting exposed. Giordano, Versteeg, Frolik, Stajan, Engelland are all guys who could take a step back in addition to those you mentioned.

Hockey is like any business IMO. If you're standing still, you're getting passed. No need to start over but I don't see this team as a contender with last year's lineup.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

Dividing up the season based on weeks/months doesn't make a whole lot of sense given the team had a new coach, system, and two new goalies. The only logical way to look at the season is a collection of SV%, GAA, QS% and RBS.

I generally agree. For one thing, that kind of season splitting is prone to being pretty arbitrary. I did it more to counter an argument than to to make a case.

(That said, QS% is not a very good stat. It's yet another supposedly-fancy stat that actually has less predicting power than the basic stats behind it (in this case SV%). RBS also seems very arbitrary to me. GSAA I'm willing to give a chance to, although it seems prone to wild swings.)

As I've said, I wouldn't mind giving Elliott another shot if there wasn't playoffs expected at the end of the season. He might bounce back as a regular season goalie. I just have absolutely zero faith in his ability to keep it together through an extended playoff run.

If there is one thing that I do think kind of should matter, it's that Elliott got half of his seasons wins in that 6 week run, during which the team was also playing at it's very best. Elliott did help us win games during that stretch, but to me Johnson seriously carrying the team while they were playing bad in the first half carries was ultimately more impressive.

Considering when they played the most, Elliott and Johnson having virtually identical stats suggests to me that Johnson was actually better.

[C_of_Red28]

Can we bring back Kipper?

[Love]

Originally Posted by C_of_Red28

Can we bring back Kipper?

As Raanta's future goalie coach? Sure.

[DJones]

Grubauer really impressed me at the Worlds.