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Old 11-12-2020, 10:51 PM   #4321
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We don't actually need to trade anyone. If lindholm plays centre Bennett doesn't. It's pretty simple.

Personally I would prefer to keep lindy on the wing, where he has played great.

Tkachuk-Bennett-Lindholm
Gaudreau-monahan-leivo
Mangiapane-backlund-dube
Lucic-ryan-simon/nordstrom

I have wanted that top line to be tried for so long.
Interesting deployment. That top line would have a mixture of speed and jam, and would likely free up the second line for less stringent matches which could enable them to focus primarily on offense. Lines three and four would be the kind of lines you'd find on a cup contender. At a minimum I think those lines would produce some interesting hockey.

This is just a hunch, but it appears that Tkachuk is very comfortable playing on Backlund's wing, and that may have impacted the assignments over the past couple of years. Backlund is a responsible player and it would be understandable that a player would want to draw in with that type of center, but at this point it is probably best to find a younger player to center Tkachuk as he is likely to be a big part of the core of this team moving forward (hopefully). His one drawback is his average skating ability, and Bennett and Lindholm would be able to cover this limitation, so I believe that combination could work. Either way with all the talk of trading pieces, this is an idea that could change the look and impact of the team without having to retool, rebuild or fortify. Obviously we will see what happens, but Ward didn't seem the type who was afraid to explore new options or step on toes, and maybe we will get a look at something like this when hockey returns.
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Old 11-13-2020, 07:26 AM   #4322
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Johnny+Hanifin for Marchand+Carlo ?
Marchand will be 33 in May. Are you sure you want to do this?
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Old 11-13-2020, 07:32 AM   #4323
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I saw a Bennett + Hanifin for Carlo and Debrusk rumor and I liked it.

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Old 11-13-2020, 08:05 AM   #4324
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I saw a Bennett + Hanifin for Carlo and Debrusk rumor and I liked it.

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Lateral move at best.
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Old 11-13-2020, 08:15 AM   #4325
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Marchand will be 33 in May. Are you sure you want to do this?
It depends how much you believe that Johnny will not resign here. We trade 2 years of team control for an all-world LW for 3 years of potentially the top LW in the league, who may decline. I believe Marchand still has two years of peak performance, and Johnny won't resign in Calgary, so the risk is minimal to us. The upside is large as Marchand is a known playoff beast.

Boston has a much more legit chance of resigning johnny ad infinitum, but loses the better player today.
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Old 11-13-2020, 11:38 AM   #4326
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Lateral move at best.
Carlo and Hanifin are pretty similar.

DeBrusk had more goals (19) and assists (16) last year than Bennett had points (12). This is the case even if you normalized the games Bennett played.

Not sure about Boston's cap and player needs, but if your looking at strictly player vs player comparisons, Boston doesn't do this.
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Old 11-13-2020, 12:41 PM   #4327
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It depends how much you believe that Johnny will not resign here. We trade 2 years of team control for an all-world LW for 3 years of potentially the top LW in the league, who may decline. I believe Marchand still has two years of peak performance, and Johnny won't resign in Calgary, so the risk is minimal to us. The upside is large as Marchand is a known playoff beast.

Boston has a much more legit chance of resigning johnny ad infinitum, but loses the better player today.

Marchand is not waiving to come to Calgary, and if Boston is all in, they aren’t trading him.

If Boston decides to rebuild, they would want premium futures.

Trade makes no sense.


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Old 11-13-2020, 12:49 PM   #4328
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Marchand is not waiving to come to Calgary, and if Boston is all in, they aren’t trading him.

If Boston decides to rebuild, they would want premium futures.

Trade makes no sense.

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Yeah, I have said multiple times that the motivation for Boston is suspect. I was just trying to put together a gaudreau inclus package (after speculation in this thread) that didn't make me want to vomit.

I could see Boston going for this though. As I said, the resigning chance for Johnny in Boston is almost 100% IMO- it's very close to his family, he played college hockey there, and it's got the allure of an O6 franchise. Johnny still has multiple prime level years remaining, and he fits their "rebuild" window group better than more fresh prospects. McAvoy and Pasta are closer in age to Johnny than they would be to 18-19 year olds. Finally, a pasta-johnny connection has success written all over it.

Re: Marchand waiving, that is a definite problem to the trade. But who knows- maybe there are pictures of Marchand in St. Johns flames pjs or something lol. There could also be some allure to playing out the career in Canada. I'm definitely reaching here though.
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Old 11-13-2020, 12:52 PM   #4329
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19th, Mangiapane, Kylington for Stamkos, who says no?

Number 1 centre Flames have been desperate for since Nieuwendyk.

30 years old, 4 more seasons at $8.5 million per.

Gaudreau-Stamkos-Tkachuk
Dube-Monahan-Lindholm
Lucic-Backlund-Bennett
Much as Stamkos would be great how does that money work exactly? You're sending out 3.5 and taking back 8.5.
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Old 11-13-2020, 02:38 PM   #4330
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Much as Stamkos would be great how does that money work exactly? You're sending out 3.5 and taking back 8.5.
Not only that but the guy is broken. No thanks.
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Old 11-13-2020, 02:52 PM   #4331
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Yeah, I have said multiple times that the motivation for Boston is suspect. I was just trying to put together a gaudreau inclus package (after speculation in this thread) that didn't make me want to vomit.

I could see Boston going for this though. As I said, the resigning chance for Johnny in Boston is almost 100% IMO- it's very close to his family, he played college hockey there, and it's got the allure of an O6 franchise. Johnny still has multiple prime level years remaining, and he fits their "rebuild" window group better than more fresh prospects. McAvoy and Pasta are closer in age to Johnny than they would be to 18-19 year olds. Finally, a pasta-johnny connection has success written all over it.

Re: Marchand waiving, that is a definite problem to the trade. But who knows- maybe there are pictures of Marchand in St. Johns flames pjs or something lol. There could also be some allure to playing out the career in Canada. I'm definitely reaching here though.
You are assuming that Boston covets Johnny and would want to sign him long term. After watching Johnny last year, that may or may not be true.

The Marchaud/Bergeron/Pasta is likely the best two way line in hockey. Johnny would certainly make it weaker defensively. I doubt he improves it offensively simply because it is already exceptional.

Boston could simply wait until Johnny is a UFA, and trade Marchaud for futures if they wanted to in two years. That would be better asset management. There simply is no motivation for them to do this trade today.

If they wanted to move Marchaud today, there would be lots of suitors offering quite a bit more I would imagine,.
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Old 11-13-2020, 03:09 PM   #4332
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I saw a Bennett + Hanifin for Carlo and Debrusk rumor and I liked it.

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I like that move a lot too. Carlo is a slight downgrade on Hanifin, but Carlo plays the right side. Plus, DeBrusk is a significant upgrade on Bennett. Plus, the Flames add $4.6M in cap space and end up with $5.6M, which means they could pursue another good player in FA on a short term deal because of the year (Hoffman or Granlund).

In my opinion, that deal is never gonna happen. That's too good a deal for the Flames.
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Old 11-13-2020, 05:17 PM   #4333
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Debrusk is a decent second line winger, but those types of players are so easy to find and acquire.
You could easily sign similar (albeit older) players on the market right now for pennies on the dollar.

For that reason, I don't think trading for him makes much sense.
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Old 11-13-2020, 09:17 PM   #4334
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If the Flames make a trade with the Bruins I'm hoping it's Backlund that moves. I think the Bruins probably aren't on his no trade list and the Bruins could add him and probably care less about his age than the Flames do.

Debrusk coming back would make sense to me. Not sure if the Bruins would do it straight up but I bet we could sign him for a fair amount less than Backlund makes.

This move also allows the Flames to keep Bennett and Monahan and move Lindholm to center.

Tkachuk - Lindholm - Mangipane
Gaudreau - Monahan - Debrusk
Dube - Bennett - Leivo
Lucic - Ryan - Simon

Because Lindholm should be able to take on Backlund's role as our shut down center I don't see this move hurting the Flames next season but is very good long term. I also think Lindholm gives the Flames hope that they could be a very good team up the middle.

I love Backlund but he is 32 so if the opportunity presents itself I think we should move him. A veteran Bruins team looking for one last run may be interested.
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Old 11-13-2020, 09:23 PM   #4335
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If the Flames want to make a decent change to their forward group, I think they could do a lot worse than adding Anthony Duclair for free.

Strict PP usage, obviously.
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Old 11-13-2020, 10:20 PM   #4336
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If the Flames want to make a decent change to their forward group, I think they could do a lot worse than adding Anthony Duclair for free.

Strict PP usage, obviously.
It’s not for free right now.

But I know what you mean I was thinking the same with Hoffman and selling a top line RW spot.
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Old 11-13-2020, 10:31 PM   #4337
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If we're trading Hanifin to Boston, I would hope to get Johnny Beecher back in the pkg. He's big, fast,physical, and athletic-kind of in the Coyle/Kreider mold. His coaches at Michigan love him.
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Old 11-14-2020, 09:45 AM   #4338
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Those singing the praises of Jake Debrusk, I think there's a buyer beware tag on that guy.

70% offensive zone starts. 7 of his 19 goals on the PP. 35 hits. 16:03 of ice-time, 2:34 of that on the PP. He did not produce when he wasn't playing with Krejci or Krejci + Pasta.

I don't like that Carlo/Debrusk trade, because Hanifin is the best player in the deal and I don't think Debrusk is a player who is a step ahead of Bennett - he's just playing in better circumstances, and he also doesn't bring a physical edge - which is something this team needs. If these are the types of deals on the table, you're better off to just stand pat and continue to grow Bennett and Hanifin's roles.

This team just sank money into a #1 goalie who is 30 years old, and a 30 year old veteran defenceman. Trades for the future are off the table and it's all about improving today - and that Boston deal doesn't do that. I don't see Debrusk bumping Gaudreau, Lindholm, Mangiapane or Tkachuk down to the 3rd line, and I don't think Debrusk provides much in the way of production playing from the 3rd line.

So even while Debrusk has produced at a decent clip higher than Bennett lately, I don't like the fit - and especially not at the cost of Hanifin.

Quote:
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If the Flames want to make a decent change to their forward group, I think they could do a lot worse than adding Anthony Duclair for free.

Strict PP usage, obviously.
I would much sooner see this happen. His speed is something we could use.

Duclair/Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Lucic/Duclair - Ryan - Simon/Nordstrom

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Old 11-14-2020, 03:25 PM   #4339
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The Athletic has an anonymous poll of 21 agents. Each agent was asked to name a high profile player that will be moved during the next year. Not one agent named a Calgary Flame. None. One agent said Calgary should stand pat now that they have the star goalie they've been looking for. Another said trading a star will backfire on them now.

By the way, Laine, Eichel and Marner were the top 3.
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Old 11-14-2020, 06:35 PM   #4340
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So Gaudreau is staying. Monahan... future still uncertain.
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