The Legend of Sam Bennett

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

There were a lot of mistakes made during the rebuild. Bennet not working out here I think was simply a symptom of prioritizing win-now over rebuild and development ahead of schedule. In an ideal world, Hartley would have been kept for one more year simply because he was better at development than the next 3 coaches, or they would have simply hired better coaches after axing Hartley.



I am glad that Conroy is leading the team now, because he saw first hand the moves made and how they ended up working out. Hopefully the biggest lessons learned by him is "Hire decent coaches" and "Don't start trading picks to try and win now right away the second the organization shows it isn't terrible." He saw the good and the bad in every decision made, so hopefully he can make more good ones and less poor ones.

Conroy himself said that Bennett should have been used more and given more opportunity.

[Rhett44]

It is just part of being a Flames fan.

Bennett is terrible for us, joins the Panthers and suddenly is an amazing playoff player.

Tkachuk had the image of "can't be effective in the playoffs". Goes to the Panthers and he is suddenly one of the top playoff players in the league.

Zadorov plays decent for us. Trade him and he's the second coming of Bobby Orr for the Canucks.

Lindholm never really did much in playoffs. Trade him and he becomes a playoff beast as well this year.

That's just part of being a Flames fan. It is unreal lol.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

This is the best post ever. The Flames clearly missed the boat. There's a reason why Bennett wasn't playing very well here and didn't seem to want to play here for long stretches. And even when he brought it in the playoffs they promised him they would make him a top line Center and then moved right back down again when the next season started. At what point do we admit that maybe the Flames management got it wrong. If the Flames management had got it right we probably wouldn't be in a retool right now, and a lot of these guys would have stayed together.

Bennett had his chances. He would play well for a bit and disappear and not use his linemates and take dumb penalties.

Both the player and coaches are to blame. The biggest blunder was Glen and Geoff Ward.

Geoff asking him after the bubble what position he wanted to play, and immediately changing plans probably was the end of his time here.

The Tkachuk stuff is weird. By the time he broke out we also had Lindholm breaking out, so not sure how you move him up the lineup and he got top pp time as well.

Crappy timeline for us because that’s when all the shutdown and half seasons happened which wasted 2 years of his contract.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Rhett44

It is just part of being a Flames fan.

Bennett is terrible for us, joins the Panthers and suddenly is an amazing playoff player.

Tkachuk had the image of "can't be effective in the playoffs". Goes to the Panthers and he is suddenly one of the top playoff players in the league.

Zadorov plays decent for us. Trade him and he's the second coming of Bobby Orr for the Canucks.

Lindholm never really did much in playoffs. Trade him and he becomes a playoff beast as well this year.

That's just part of being a Flames fan. It is unreal lol.

You just have to look at Florida, and the Canucks and see how they value and treat those players compared to the Flames. I think it's a Flames management issue and hopefully Conroy can change the approach.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Bennett had his chances. He would play well for a bit and disappear and not use his linemates and take dumb penalties.

Both the player and coaches are to blame. The biggest blunder was Glen and Geoff Ward.

Geoff asking him after the bubble what position he wanted to play, and immediately changing plans probably was the end of his time here.

The Tkachuk stuff is weird. By the time he broke out we also had Lindholm breaking out, so not sure how you move him up the lineup and he got top pp time as well.

Crappy timeline for us because that’s when all the shutdown and half seasons happened which wasted 2 years of his contract.

I think it's deeper than that, I think the Flames just didn't use them properly or make him feel valued and appreciated. When Matt got to Florida the first thing they did was call him a franchise player. When Bennett got to Florida the first thing to coach said was that they hit a home run. They knew how to make those players feel like they were part of the team and part of the organization. And what did those players do in return, they became
Mainstays and leaders. They became the players that the Flames hoped they would be. At some point we've got to look at the organization and say maybe they didn't know how to develop the players properly or manage them. We are willing to admit they hired crappy coaches, but I think the underlying problem was bigger than that.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

You just have to look at Florida, and the Canucks and see how they value and treat those players compared to the Flames. I think it's a Flames management issue and hopefully Conroy can change the approach.

Tkachuk was offered 80 million to stay. He left.

Lindholm was offered what 70 million? He sulked and tried to extort the team into a 80 million deal.

Zadorov wanted to be signed right away while the team sorted things out with Hanifin and Lindholm and when he didn’t get his way his agent sent out tweets demanding a trade.

I don’t see how any of those players got mistreated.

What’s different about how Florida and Vancouver treats their players?

Not long ago people went to Florida to play out their final years. They built a winning team that’s attracting players now.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Tkachuk was offered 80 million to stay. He left.

Lindholm was offered what 70 million? He sulked and tried to extort the team into a 80 million deal.

Zadorov wanted to be signed right away while the team sorted things out with Hanifin and Lindholm and when he didn’t get his way his agent sent out tweets demanding a trade.

I don’t see how any of those players got mistreated.

What’s different about how Florida and Vancouver treats their players?

Not long ago people went to Florida to play out their final years. They built a winning team that’s attracting players now.

Go back and read some of the comments from Matt and Bennett when they got to Florida. Bennett said something along the lines that he was having the best time of his life. Matt said that theres was the best coach he'd ever had. You just have to listen to what the player said after they left Calgary.

[ComixZone]

…why are you even bothering to defend it at this point Paulie?

The Flames management team mishandled the head coaching position, Sam Bennett, and Matthew Tkachuk. It is what it is, and hopefully they’ve learned from it.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

I think it's deeper than that, I think the Flames just didn't use them properly or make him feel valued and appreciated. When Matt got to Florida the first thing they did was call him a franchise player. When Bennett got to Florida the first thing to coach said was that they hit a home run. They knew how to make those players feel like they were part of the team and part of the organization. And what did those players do in return, they became
Mainstays and leaders. They became the players that the Flames hoped they would be. At some point we've got to look at the organization and say maybe they didn't know how to develop the players properly or manage them. We are willing to admit they hired crappy coaches, but I think the underlying problem was bigger than that.

The Flames had a deal at the 2016 draft to trade up and take Tkachuk. I’m not sure how much more wanted he needed to feel.

I think offering someone 11 million a year to play hockey should make them feel valued? Or did we have to do something different? We developed him just fine that’s why he’s hit it off in Florida right away.

The Bennett thing he went from bargin bin coaches like Glenn and Ward to one of the best ever in coach Q. He also looked better under Sutter but it was too late.

Coaching has been a huge issue with this team. Sutter nuking the team on his way out doesn’t help, he was a top coach and came here.

I think Conroy is changing things. Huska was misplaying Sharangovich and got a talking to by Conroy to get him up the lineup.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Tkachuk was offered 80 million to stay. He left.

Lindholm was offered what 70 million? He sulked and tried to extort the team into a 80 million deal.

Zadorov wanted to be signed right away while the team sorted things out with Hanifin and Lindholm and when he didn’t get his way his agent sent out tweets demanding a trade.

I don’t see how any of those players got mistreated.

What’s different about how Florida and Vancouver treats their players?

Not long ago people went to Florida to play out their final years. They built a winning team that’s attracting players now.

Go back and read some of the comments from Matt and Bennett when they got to Florida. Bennett said something along the lines that he was having the best time of his life. That said that their coach was the best coach he'd ever had. You just have to listen to what the player said after they left Calgary.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

Go back and read some of the comments from Matt and Bennett when they got to Florida. Bennett said something along the lines that he was having the best time of his life. Matt said that theres was the best coach he'd ever had. You just have to listen to what the player said after they left Calgary.

I listened to what Tkachuk said. You don’t actually think he thought Maurice was the best coach ever?

Sutter and Tkachuk threw shots at each other without naming any names. Remember when Sutter said Toffoli shows up in the playoffs when comparing him to Tkachuk.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

The Flames had a deal at the 2016 draft to trade up and take Tkachuk. I’m not sure how much more wanted he needed to feel.

I think offering someone 11 million a year to play hockey should make them feel valued? Or did we have to do something different? We developed him just fine that’s why he’s hit it off in Florida right away.

The Bennett thing he went from bargin bin coaches like Glenn and Ward to one of the best ever in coach Q. He also looked better under Sutter but it was too late.

Coaching has been a huge issue with this team. Sutter nuking the team on his way out doesn’t help, he was a top coach and came here.

I think Conroy is changing things. Huska was misplaying Sharangovich and got a talking to by Conroy to get him up the lineup.

I agree with you about the coaching being a big issue. Especially concerning development of higher .drafted players. I think you can see several players recently didn't want to sign high priced contracts with Calgary, so it's not the money that makes them feel better. I think it's another issue then made those players want to leave. You know what if Matt saw the way they treated Sam Bennett and said I don't want to be here... Think about that these guys are friends now they're playing together. And they're having the time of their lives. What if Johnny wasn't happy with the way he was being treated here and he went and signed for less somewhere else. Look at Lindholm, even he didn't want to sign here for more money and he was willing to risk losing money to leave Calgary.
I think it's an issue at the management level. Even
Hanifin didn't want to stay for the money.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

…why are you even bothering to defend it at this point Paulie?

The Flames management team mishandled the head coaching position, Sam Bennett, and Matthew Tkachuk. It is what it is, and hopefully they’ve learned from it.

Brad Treliving needed be more hands on the coaching instead of picking a crappy candidate and firing them a few years later. Instead he picked his battle with Darryl Sutter lol.

I think Conroy will fix this and has already started. That doesn’t mean being in the coaches room, but you need to do what he did Sharangovich. We didn’t trade for this player to be our 4th line centre.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

I agree with you about the coaching being a big issue. Especially concerning development of higher .drafted players. I think you can see several players recently didn't want to sign high priced contracts with Calgary, so it's not the money that makes them feel better. I think it's another issue then made those players want to leave. You know what if Matt saw the way they treated Sam Bennett and said I don't want to be here... Think about that these guys are friends now they're playing together. And they're having the time of their lives. What if Johnny wasn't happy with the way he was being treated here and he went and signed for less somewhere else. Look at Lindholm, even he didn't want to sign here for more money and he was willing to risk losing money to leave Calgary.
I think it's an issue at the management level. Even
Hanifin didn't want to stay for the money.

Sam wasn’t a 4th line plugger, that’s on Treliving. He needed a heavier hand with the coaches.

I don’t think any of that rubbed off on Tkachuk. He was developed just fine. Someone said we played him as a checker. He played on the Backlund line for 3 years and was used on the top pp unit. Peter’s recognized in his 2nd season that he needed better depth and switched it up. That’s when Covid started. 1 year was wasted on some dumb bubble for 56 games playing the same team over and over again. We got his career year after but he wanted out. Don’t think it would work with him and Darryl.

I don’t think he was misused or treated.

[DeluxeMoustache]

There are lots of things.

Bennett’s utilization has been beaten to death. Bottom 6 W here, 2C on a top 5 team in Florida

When Tkachuk was young Burke said he viewed him as a future captain. With the C vacated, Sutter comes in and goes a year with no captain

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

There are lots of things.

Bennett’s utilization has been beaten to death. Bottom 6 W here, 2C on a top 5 team in Florida

When Tkachuk was young Burke said he viewed him as a future captain. With the C vacated, Sutter comes in and goes a year with no captain

We had no captain for 2 years.

Sutter was the captain. That wasn’t ever going to work with Tkachuk.

Someone here said that Tkachuk asked Treliving if Sutter was going to be fired he said no and that played a part in him leaving. He’s never said a good thing about Darryl that I can find.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

This thread gets bumped about as often as Bennett is a difference maker. So what, 4-5 times per season? Sounds about right.

Such bull****, haha.

[monkeyman]

Originally Posted by traptor

What ifs are obviously a fools errand, but I do feel like we had the players to be a consistent contender for a long if the "band" stayed together.

Some form of:

Jg(29) - lindholm(28) - monahan(27)
Zary - bennett(24) - chucky(24)
Mang - backs - coleman

Hanifin(26) - rasmus
Kylington - tanev
Zadorov(28)

Marky
Vladar

Could be a contender. Really unfortunate how badly it was managed.

Especially when you consider the ages of those key players were when we lost them.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

There are lots of things.



Bennett’s utilization has been beaten to death. Bottom 6 W here, 2C on a top 5 team in Florida



When Tkachuk was young Burke said he viewed him as a future captain. With the C vacated, Sutter comes in and goes a year with no captain

Your expectations that the Flames play an inferior player at 2c are not founded in reality.

There is no way he deserved to be the 2C in Calgary when he was traded. None. Zero.

Maybe you can tell me last week's winning lottery numbers?

Sam needed a change of scenery. It happens. Be happy for Sam, but stop beating on the Flames because he was awful during his time here.

SMH.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

Your expectations that the Flames play an inferior player at 2c are not founded in reality.

There is no way he deserved to be the 2C in Calgary when he was traded. None. Zero.

Maybe you can tell me last week's winning lottery numbers?

Sam needed a change of scenery. It happens. Be happy for Sam, but stop beating on the Flames because he was awful during his time here.

SMH.

I just made a statement of fact, guy. He was a bottom 6 W here, he is a 2C there. The rest of that nonsense is you