[Rumour] NHL and Seattle talking about expansion fees (~$225M)

[Finger Cookin]

An update from TheScore on one of the proposed Seattle arenas:

Seattle arena gets environmental clearance, Hansen 'completely open' to NHL preceding NBA
http://www.thescore.com/nba/news/760322

[Josh]

This can't happen soon enough for me! My brother now lives up in Seattle and I'd be up there for every flames game!

[Yappin Tappin]

I've been wondering this for a while now and thought I'd ask.

If both Seattle and Vegas do end up being the two expansion teams for the NHL, how would they re-align the two western divisions?

Seeing how both cities are in the pacific time zone, you would think they would have to be in the pacific division. Same as the three California teams and Vancouver. So that leaves Calgary, Edmonton, and Arizona.

I take it that would mean Arizona gets moved to the central? Is that fair logistically for them?

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Yappin Tappin

I've been wondering this for a while now and thought I'd ask.

If both Seattle and Vegas do end up being the two expansion teams for the NHL, how would they re-align the two western divisions?

Seeing how both cities are in the pacific time zone, you would think they would have to be in the pacific division. Same as the three California teams and Vancouver. So that leaves Calgary, Edmonton, and Arizona.

I take it that would mean Arizona gets moved to the central? Is that fair logistically for them?

Pacific
Anaheim
Calgary
Edmonton
Las Vegas
Los Angeles
San Jose
Seattle
Vancouver

Central
Arizona
Chicago
Colorado
Dallas
Minnesota
Nashville
St. Louis
Winnipeg

I think this is the best way. Calgary to the Central might make a little more sense geographically, but they can't have them in a different division than Edmonton or Vancouver, can they?

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Yappin Tappin

I take it that would mean Arizona gets moved to the central? Is that fair logistically for them?

Logically that makes sense... although I imagine the Central division teams would not take kindly to the remaining Pacific teams having two expansion teams to beat up on... makes it harder for them to grab a wildcard spot.

[Moneyhands23]

Oh please please happen. I'd be so much happier taking the boat to Seattle over vancouver to watch games! 🍻

[Meers]

In light of the Canadian-US exchange rate, price of oil, recent provincial election result and the fact that both Katz and Edwards have met with the proposed Vegas and Seattle ownership groups, I wouldn't assume that expansion is the only option for the running dog capitalists of the NHL any more.

Is relocation preferable to the new Politburo of the Alberta Oblast boldly nationalising the two NHL franchises and moving them to the KHL?

Time will tell, Comrades.

[hwy19man]

Originally Posted by Josh

This can't happen soon enough for me! My brother now lives up in Seattle and I'd be up there for every flames game!

Would you not want a team closer to you, say Portland, Oregon?

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Yappin Tappin

I take it that would mean Arizona gets moved to the central? Is that fair logistically for them?

Not really. Phoenix to Las Vegas is comparable to the flight time between Calgary to Edmonton. Phoenix to Los Angeles takes slightly less time than Calgary to Vancouver. Putting them in a division with Winnipeg, Minnesota and Chicago doesn't make much sense for them, especially with their timezone (MST) that puts them 2 hour difference between most of the teams in that division for a good chunk of the year.

More importantly, Calgary and Vancouver - and I expect Edmonton when they start to rekindle some competition - are a relatively huge draw for them. Lots of snowbirds and people travelling from up north to watch those games. No sense at all to separate them from their closest geographical rivals and some of their most well attended games.

I would say Arizona is relocated/folds before they would get removed from this type of a division.

[sureLoss]

Seattle city council announces it is going pull out all public money of the proposed arena deal if it is only for a NHL team with no NBA team.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-...article_bottom

“This deal’s just not doable, at least as it’s constructed today,” says Tim Burgess, the president of the Seattle City Council. “I wouldn’t say it’s dead. But we are not going to go ahead with this arena without substantial changes. And there are no plans right now for those.”

Basically, the Sodo arena is dead. Unless someone revives it with bucketloads of fresh money.

The city now wants all or most of the $125 million in bonds it pledged for an arena to be replaced by private financing. For all practical purposes, the city wants out.

But the NBA has said it’s probably not coming anytime soon. So the focus has shifted to building a hockey arena first.

Burgess said that idea is dead on arrival at the City Council, absent a big private investment.

“We specifically wrote the idea of a hockey-only or hockey-first arena out of the agreement three years ago,” Burgess said. “We did that because it’s very weak financially. It’s just too risky for the city.”

The reason is that a typical pro hockey team generates about a third less revenue than an NBA team. So city analysts concluded a hockey arena might not be able to cover the city’s bond payments.

“If we’re going to do hockey, there would have to be a substantial lowering, if not elimination, of the public investment,” Burgess said.

[The Original FFIV]

I don't get why renovating Key Arena is off the table. It's right downtown, does not require a land purchase or zoning permits. Just an extensive renovation. How many times has msg been renovated? City would have incentive to do this as well as any new building would be competition for key and may result in it becoming a white elephant.

[Zach]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

I don't get why renovating Key Arena is off the table. It's right downtown, does not require a land purchase or zoning permits. Just an extensive renovation. How many times has msg been renovated? City would have incentive to do this as well as any new building would be competition for key and may result in it becoming a white elephant.

It's a dump. Probably better off building a new arena plus I believe the new arena is in a better area anyways. Plenty of bars nearby and right by Safeco and Clink field.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

I don't get why renovating Key Arena is off the table. It's right downtown, does not require a land purchase or zoning permits. Just an extensive renovation. How many times has msg been renovated? City would have incentive to do this as well as any new building would be competition for key and may result in it becoming a white elephant.

Renovations estimated to cost $220M in 2004 (~$275M today) were proposed but never gained traction. It seems like reluctance may have been due to substantial public investment in both the baseball and football stadiums that replaced the Kingdome. It looks like those projects add up to about $650M of public money over a five year period from 1997-2002, and will continue to be paid for into the 2020s.

Any propsed arena construction or renovations probably boil down to funding stand-offs.