Irving, Pelech, Negrin, Chucko

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

and yet, who is the last top 6 forward drafted by Calgary?

Of course teams have a litany of failed picks; that's part and parcel of the draft. But to rationalize Calgary's poor drafting as a result of where they pick is not supported by the facts.

Oh really? Please show us those facts then because I'm pretty sure you haven't done the research required to say that.

Who is the last top 6 forward drafted by Calgary? Mikael Backlund it looks like. What is your point?

[oldschoolcalgary]

...yeah and prior to that, it was a vast wasteland of misses...

what's your point?

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

What I've argued against in the past is that expecting to get an elite player in the late 1st, or 2nd is probably an unrealistic expectation. Sure we'd love to get an elite player outside the top 15 and it does happen every once in a while. But if you are expecting that then your expectations are unrealistic because history shows that its a very rare thing.

joe Nieuwendyk
al MacInnes
gary suter
theo fleury
brett hull
robyn regher
miika kiprusoff
marc savard
doug gilmor
mike vernon

say hi...jarome and gary roberts just wave...

[thymebalm]

Mikael Backlund, and let's not forget Dion Phaneuf, just because he's not a defender doesn't mean he is a not a good draft pick.

Mitch Wahl will be. Moss has played top 6. Boyd did as well. Lombardi was a Flames draft pick he's playing top line minutes.

They happen. We just fail to give the Flames credit for anything. Since 2002:

Lombardi
Nystrom
McElhinney
Van der Gulik
Phaneuf (top 2)
Prust
Boyd
Pardy
Sutter
Backlund

all Flames draft picks playing on NHL teams. Some people just refuse to believe the system is working... it is, though.

[thymebalm]

Nemisz, Wahl, Bouma, and Howse all have top-6 potential written on them as well.

[oldschoolcalgary]

howse i can agree with....all the others? We'll agree to disagree with what constitutes a top 6 player.

[Superfraggle]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

I think when a team puts a player on waivers and he clears them, that says a lot about what the team and what other GMs think.

It says the team and other GMs think they're not ready. YET. Any team claiming them would have to stick them on their NHL roster or try to waive them again later. It's not worth claiming them unless they are ready to take a regular spot. Players can have lots of potential upside still and not be worth claiming at this particular moment in time. The waiver placements in question happened at a time when teams are all trying to shrink their team down to a 23 man roster. No decent GM would throw one of those roster spots away to claim someone who isn't ready. YET.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

joe Nieuwendyk
al MacInnes
gary suter
theo fleury
brett hull
robyn regher
miika kiprusoff
marc savard
doug gilmor
mike vernon

say hi...jarome and gary roberts just wave...

Math says hi. Now add up all the years, and all the draft picks. Divide by the number of elite players. And guess what the conclusion is?

It's pretty rare to get them outside the top 10-15 picks. It's just a fact man.

Go search through the draft records of every team and it'll just confirm it for you. I personally have looked through years and years of draft records over the years and have followed many draft classes since I started watching the NHL and the draft. You think those exceptions hurt my case? They help prove it.

Iginla was taken 11th overall BTW.

[oldschoolcalgary]

yet those picks are from one organization.

when pro-rated against all draft picks that actually make it into the nhl made by calgary, its not the rarity some people make it to be.

subtracting the recent flames Reggie, Iggy and Kipper, all drafted by other teams, there is a hole in the drafting that isn't filled until Backstrom - Phanuef was a top ten pick and therefore "can't miss".

The justification by those defending Calgary's drafting has been based on selection number.

The reality is, elite players are available after the lottery, after the top ten, after the top 15.

Calgary just hasn't picked any. That's scouting.

[Torture]

Originally Posted by thymebalm

Nemisz, Wahl, Bouma, and Howse all have top-6 potential written on them as well.

I agree with you but I'd probably take Bouma off the list of surefire top 6ers. Looks like a good pick I don't know that he's talented enough for a top 6 role....probably a strong third liner though.