Welcome Back Khadr

[puckluck]

Hopefully he ends up getting taken advantage of in jail.

[mikey_the_redneck]

I have not been paying attention to this story at all......

So what is the problem here?

So let me get this straight....this Khadr guy was a 15 year old child soldier in Afghanistan who killed a few of the foreign invaders (both Canadian and American), was captured and then immigrated to Canada after the fact??

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck

I have not been paying attention to this story at all......

So what is the problem here?

So let me get this straight....this Khadr guy was a 15 year old child soldier in Afghanistan who killed a few of the foreign invaders (both Canadian and American), was captured and then immigrated to Canada after the fact??

His family immigrated to Canada before the fact. He was born and raised in Canada.

His dad who was a key figure in Osama Bin Laden's group and acted like a financier, you know the guy that was responsible for 9/11.

He fed his sons to the grinder one son came back crippled and his family while still denouncing Canada and supporting the idea of suicide bombers took advantage of the free health care in this country and the welfare system

Meanwhile Omar built bombs in Afghanistan got shot up by American troops and killed a medic


He was born in Canada.

I don't agree with the designation of him as a Child Soldier, and I don't even believe in designating him a soldier.

But the fact that he was a Canadian fighting in against troops in Afghanistan including Canadians makes him a traitor to me.

I don't think we should ever accept him back into Canada and our softer jails and justice system. He and his family hate the very country that provides medical treatment for his family for free, sends them a nice check each months and presents them with the freedom to expose their hatred.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

It seems tempting but I am not sold on the idea.

I guess my thought is that there shouldnt be two types of Canadian citizens. Being equal should stand for every Canadian.

I would need more info if I was to change my mind on this.

It is draconian in the extreme and something I would not likely be in favor of. BUT....for the Kadr family.....I could look the other way. Just look at Captain's round up for my reasons.

[billybob123]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

... and killed a medic

This is the most irritating fallacy of the Khadr case. Christopher Speer (the guy he allegedly killed, which, by the way, is up for debate - no witnesses) was NOT a medic. He was a special forces operative who was trained in combat medicine. The media constantly implies that Speer was an innocent medic - he wasn't. He was as much a combattant as everyone says Khadr was.

That being said, there's no way Khadr gets a fair trial, so I suppose I see why he's going to plead guilty.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by billybob123

This is the most irritating fallacy of the Khadr case. Christopher Speer (the guy he allegedly killed, which, by the way, is up for debate - no witnesses) was NOT a medic. He was a special forces operative who was trained in combat medicine. The media constantly implies that Speer was an innocent medic - he wasn't. He was as much a combattant as everyone says Khadr was.

That being said, there's no way Khadr gets a fair trial, so I suppose I see why he's going to plead guilty.

This is a "like duh" moment....

All medics are given combat training. All of them. There isn't enough medical students and nurses signing up for the military so they also give some volunteers paramedical training.

Now let take this a step further. Special Ops/ forces. To get into that you need to be able to pass the training. Special forces need medics too. Hence if no one with medical training get through the course then someone needs to be given medical training...as in becoming a MEDIC.

Speer was a medic. Period. Though I suspect that all Special forces receive medical training there would be people that would have more. Medics are combatants. Omar should be held up against a wall and shot.

[billybob123]

Originally Posted by HOZ

Speer was a medic. Period. Though I suspect that all Special forces receive medical training there would be people that would have more. Medics are combatants.

Are medics armed? Are they actively involved in combat?

Saying he's a medic is about as true as saying Khadr was a kid - they were both involved in a firefight and both were armed. Getting killed is a risk of a firefight. "Medic" or "kid" or not.

[kirant]

The 3rd Geneva Convention, which IIRC was the one which banned firing upon medical personnel, extends more to military doctors who stay off the battlefield, not in-battlefield medics. Also, these personnel can be armed and are allowed to engage in combat should their patients come under fire by enemy forces (but are then allowed to be shot at), but are not allowed to provoke combat (if they do, they are considered an active participant of combat and can be shot without it being considered a war crime). They must also help patients, regardless of force, to their fullest ability.

I don't think special forces can be considered medical personnel that are illegal to fire upon with the definition that I remember.

[TylerSVT]

He pleaded guilty for throwing a hand grenade at Canadian troops. I say they hang him.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by TylerSVT

He pleaded guilty for throwing a hand grenade at Canadian troops. I say they hang him.

I haven't seen this can you provide a link?

Because if true, we should bring him back, charge him with treason and throw him in the same block as Russell Williams. Forever.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by billybob123

This is the most irritating fallacy of the Khadr case. Christopher Speer (the guy he allegedly killed, which, by the way, is up for debate - no witnesses) was NOT a medic. He was a special forces operative who was trained in combat medicine. The media constantly implies that Speer was an innocent medic - he wasn't. He was as much a combattant as everyone says Khadr was.
That being said, there's no way Khadr gets a fair trial, so I suppose I see why he's going to plead guilty.

Up for debate? He says he is guilty. Is this the same kind of debate the truthers participate in? You are irritated because they call someone a medic? The guy died working as a medic in the military, to save lives. Maybe you should be irritated by that.

You sympathize with the Khadrs? What is your take? I think that since he is guilty, the Americans can keep him. Unfortunately, we are going to have to foot the bill for him, as we already do for his family.

[CaptainCrunch]

The minute that he plead guilty to knowingly targeting civilian targets the Canadian Government should have said to hell with any deal and walked away from the table.

I also think that the government should revoke the welfare payments to the Khadr family revoke their free health care and send them packing.

That little family of psycho not only would like to see us dead, but they're laughing at us.

there's no room in my Canada for any of them.

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by billybob123

Are medics armed? Are they actively involved in combat?

Saying he's a medic is about as true as saying Khadr was a kid - they were both involved in a firefight and both were armed. Getting killed is a risk of a firefight. "Medic" or "kid" or not.

We are not disagreeing with each other. Yes medics are active combatants. Yes Omar was armed are ready for a fight. Getting killed is part of the risk.

No disagreement.

Where there is controversy in this sad story is.....
We have politicians, lawyers and judges, and left-leaning media painting Omar has a child not knowing what he was doing and being kidnapped and tortured by big MEANY AMERICANS.

That is where the big deal is.

[flylock shox]

I would say that a kid who has the background described in the article and various posts above should perhaps be given a little more leniency than being hung or stood up against a wall and shot.

He was a teenager, fifteen if I'm not mistaken, at the time of the incident, and it seems people are in general agreement that he had been subjected to hateful indoctrination on the part of his parents and others for, it would appear, his entire childhood.

What chance, I wonder, did this kid ever have to become something other than what he now is?

[Hack&Lube]

Did nobody read the article? Canada doesn't have to take him back if they don't want to. This is simply a deal made by the U.S. State Department with Khadr but Canada can refuse to accept him if he is deemed a threat. The Harper government has long been hostile to Khadr returning to Canada.

[Shin Pad]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

I would say that a kid who has the background described in the article and various posts above should perhaps be given a little more leniency than being hung or stood up against a wall and shot.

He was a teenager, fifteen if I'm not mistaken, at the time of the incident, and it seems people are in general agreement that he had been subjected to hateful indoctrination on the part of his parents and others for, it would appear, his entire childhood.

What chance, I wonder, did this kid ever have to become something other than what he now is?

My question is - what kind of a threat is he going to pose when he is let out of prison? If he has been engrained with this hateful indoctrination all of his life, can he change? That's the part that worries me.

[billybob123]

Originally Posted by Nage Waza

Up for debate? He says he is guilty. Is this the same kind of debate the truthers participate in? You are irritated because they call someone a medic? The guy died working as a medic in the military, to save lives. Maybe you should be irritated by that.

You sympathize with the Khadrs? What is your take? I think that since he is guilty, the Americans can keep him. Unfortunately, we are going to have to foot the bill for him, as we already do for his family.

Thanks for putting words in my mouth. Did I ever say I "sympathize" with anyone?

Sgt Speer died in a combat operation where he was involved in combat. People die in combat. Khadr was the only one of the enemy who survived. He's probably lucky he's not dead. Speer was as much a medic in this firefight as Khadr was a kid - irrelevant on both sides. They're shooting at each other. People die in those situations.

The 'up for debate' part, if you had read the link I provided, which you probably didn't, is that there was an operative there that night who casts doubt on whether Khadr was the one who threw the grenade. None of us were there, none of us know what happened that night - but this operative did.

All I care about is that the guy gets a fair trial - and there was no way he was getting one. He's a Canadian citizen, no matter what everyone here thinks. Canadians deserve fair trials - why should Khadr be any different than scumbags like Williams or Bernardo, or that lowlife who shot the guy in the eyes last year?

Of course he was going to be imprisoned. You survive a firefight on the losing side, you're probably not going to like what happens. Lesson learned for him - at least we hope. He's getting out of prison in errr 8 years, so we had better hope he doesn't come out worse.

Listen, the guy deserved to be punished for what he did. Charge him with being enemy combattant, charge him with material support of the enemy. But if he didn't kill this guy, he didn't kill this guy.

But again, thanks for reading my mind - you seem to know something about me that even I didn't know.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by billybob123

Are medics armed? Are they actively involved in combat?

Saying he's a medic is about as true as saying Khadr was a kid - they were both involved in a firefight and both were armed. Getting killed is a risk of a firefight. "Medic" or "kid" or not.

You're a soldier first, then a Medic.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

I would say that a kid who has the background described in the article and various posts above should perhaps be given a little more leniency than being hung or stood up against a wall and shot.

He was a teenager, fifteen if I'm not mistaken, at the time of the incident, and it seems people are in general agreement that he had been subjected to hateful indoctrination on the part of his parents and others for, it would appear, his entire childhood.

What chance, I wonder, did this kid ever have to become something other than what he now is?

This I agree with.

He was 15 at the time he got caught and probably much younger at the time he was "enlisted" and went into "service".

I think he should still be punished but he's already spent the last 8 years in prison.

My question is why are the adults around him allowed to run free. The whole extended family has ties to various terrorist organizations. I would be very surprised to learn that a single one of them is clean.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by Shin Pad

My question is - what kind of a threat is he going to pose when he is let out of prison? If he has been engrained with this hateful indoctrination all of his life, can he change? That's the part that worries me.

This POS needs to wear a shirt every day or have a tattoo on his forehead stating that he was a traitor and he killed Canadian and American Soldiers.