Amazing China Polution pictures

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

Well.. in a way it does. Air pollution affects all of us, and it especially affects those who are adjacent to China, like Japan. They call it "landscaping", which basically means that something goes up in the air in one country, then floats over to the neighbors and plasters, or "landscapes", itself on to their territory. There was a big problem with this in Europe in the past few decades.. and now I can't see any of China's neighbors being happy about this either.

And the overall atmosphere is greatly affected by harmful pollutants. Pollution does not follow political boundaries like man made laws, it goes where it wants.. and it always affects more than just the creator. Think of it as second hand smoke, we as the world are all harming each other with our second hand pollution, some a lot more than others.

The world community has already cleared them of any CO2 obligations, why would i disagree with such an obvious non corrupt world body. I was speaking more of their polluted lakes etc.

[Vulcan]

Here's a great movie to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqxENMKaeCU

I think it only works in HD and it's better if you can watch on your tV.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

The only people who think of Canada as an environmental heaven are uninformed Canadians. Everyone else in the world knows that as "America Jr." we consume at a ridiculous rate.

Honestly in my dealings with international committees regarding environmental studies, many Europeans paint us the same color as Americans when it comes to consumption and pollution. We are, in short, scoffed at for our degradation of the planet.

Rather than being contrite with those Euro-weenies, do you tell them that they have the world's biggest economy? Do they think it runs on unicorn dust?

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Here's a great movie to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqxENMKaeCU

I think it only works in HD and it's better if you can watch on your tV.

This looks interesting, I'm definitely making time to watch it tonight. Thanks.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Here's a great movie to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqxENMKaeCU

I think it only works in HD and it's better if you can watch on your tV.

You can watch it on your computer, just click the HD button on youtube.

[GreenLantern]

Hrmm... instead of me trying to explain it, you should read the first few pages of this publication and let the pros do a better job:

http://www.ipcc-wg1.unibe.ch/publica...4-wg1-faqs.pdf

Then you will see that even poisoning their lakes has a negative impact on the rest of the world.

[The Yen Man]

It's easy to criticize China until you realize a lot of the stuff that is consumed by the Western world are dumped back into China. All those outdated cell phones, computers, and other electronics gets dumped somewhere. But as long is it's halfway across the world and not in our backyard, we turn a blind eye to it. And that's the sad reality of it. So who are the real polluters here? Looking at that CO2 emissons per capita chart, China's all the way down in #80 compared to Canada at #10. Just think how polluted Canada would be if we even had a 3rd of China's population.

[Five-hole]

Almost as depressing as those images are some of the "so what" sentiments in this thread.

[GreenLantern]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

It's easy to criticize China until you realize a lot of the stuff that is consumed by the Western world are dumped back into China. All those outdated cell phones, computers, and other electronics gets dumped somewhere. But as long is it's halfway across the world and not in our backyard, we turn a blind eye to it. And that's the sad reality of it. So who are the real polluters here? Looking at that CO2 emissons per capita chart, China's all the way down in #80 compared to Canada at #10. Just think how polluted Canada would be if we even had a 3rd of China's population.

Oh but we can, it is called the United States of America. Especially if you count all the American development in Canada as part of their ecological footprint.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

It's easy to criticize China until you realize a lot of the stuff that is consumed by the Western world are dumped back into China. All those outdated cell phones, computers, and other electronics gets dumped somewhere. But as long is it's halfway across the world and not in our backyard, we turn a blind eye to it. And that's the sad reality of it. So who are the real polluters here? Looking at that CO2 emissons per capita chart, China's all the way down in #80 compared to Canada at #10. Just think how polluted Canada would be if we even had a 3rd of China's population.

Oh, I didn't realize China was trying to keep their population in a rural agrarian society. Standard of living increases from division of labour requires cheap energy.

Christ, am I the only person here that took second year econ?

As for the "junk" mumbo jumbo, trade requires a buyer and a seller. It's not like somebody just went over there with a bag of obsolete phones and left them there for free.

[Calgaryborn]

Why do we have to bend the facts to make ourselves worse than we are? So what if we burn more energy per capital than China or some European country. Pollution generated shouldn't be divided by a country's population when determining the level of a country's guilt. Pollution generated should be divided by the land mass a country controls and that figure used to determine the level of responsibility. Canada is one of the cleanest countries in the world based on pollution levels per square mile. We share the land with thousands of other species; most of which enjoy stable population levels. We have more land reserved in provincial and federal parks than most countries have all together. We are a destination country for people who desire natural beauty and untouched wilderness.

So what if we used more water per capital than some distant country. We have more fresh water than any other country in the world. We let the surplus spill into the ocean because we can't begin to use it all. So what if we burn more carbon than say Italy. We have colder winters than they do and vastly greater distances to travel within our own country to get from one place to another. The carbon footprint we leave on our land mass is very small. We achieve this by a low birth rate and controlling immigration. We also have high pollution standards in Canada. This is why you don't see people riding to work with masks on in Canada. Can we do better? Sure we can. We are actually doing way better today at controlling pollution than say twenty years ago. Canada has raised the bar several times on emission standards from industry. I'm sure they will again when the technology is there to improve things.

Canadians do care deeply about their environment. However most of us are still close enough to the land to realize that manipulation of the environment is how every species lives and prospers. There has to be a balance. We need a fair assessment of Canada's role and responsibility for the land mass we govern. Basing it on population is unfair because population levels are as much a product of policy and planning as pollution standards for heavy industry. Also carbon usage will be higher in any country that have cold winters and a vast land mass occupied by a small population. Canada is doing a good job. China is rapidly destroying the health of their people and the environment in which they control. It's an insult to even compare the two in terms of governance.

[GreenLantern]

Ok so I read through your post a few times Calgryborn and I can't tell if it is a sarcastic bait.. or if you are serious.. I am going that you are serious and wish to change your mind.

So what if we used more water per capital than some distant country. We have more fresh water than any other country in the world

That is the exact opposite of what we are trying to teach Canadians. Where did you learn this? Is it a personal opinion or did someone actually tell you this? I want their email if possible.

We let the surplus spill into the ocean because we can't begin to use it all.

Here is a website that will help you better understand what we are talking about mainly when we mention "fresh water".

http://www.ec.gc.ca/water/en/info/pubs/FS/e_FSa5.htm

A couple of images that might help in understanding the hydrological cycle as well:






And for good measure, Public Works (Gov. of Canada) explaining why water useage is a major concern, despite our plentiful supply.

http://www.tpsgc-pwgsc.gc.ca/biens-p...age-6-eng.html


I hope some of this can convince you otherwise. It is very important for the future of this country that we stop thinking water is a renewable resource. We will never gain more water, we have what we have and that is it. It is a closed system (globally).

Edit: I want to clarify this last point, while water is a renewable resource in that through the hydrological cycle it both recharges ground storage, lakes, rivers etc..

It is not a renewable resource in the sense that we only have the water that is currently available in our system. Meaning that we do not get water from an outside source, like the sun (incoming short wave radiation), we get our water from what is already inside of the Earth's atmosphere. So GLOBALLY, it is a closed system. Which means we can enjoy the benefits of fresh water as a renewable resource AS LONG AS WE WORK TO MAINTAIN THE QUALITY OF OUR CURRENT SUPPLY. This means, not wasting fresh water by lowering our water consumption levels and preventing the pollution of our available supply.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Here's a great movie to watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqxENMKaeCU

I think it only works in HD and it's better if you can watch on your tV.

Who narrates that. I also love how Europe gets none of the blame and most of the credit at the end.

[The Yen Man]

All I'm saying is, people should solve their own problems before criticizing others.

[Resolute 14]

Well thank god the world has signed these wonderful environmental treaties such as Kyoto to... oh, wait. Nevermind.

[Five-hole]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

All I'm saying is, people should solve their own problems before criticizing others.

I don't agree. Obviously, hypocrisy should be avoided but there's no reason why the world's biggest polluters shouldn't be condemned by the global community.

Further, there's significant evidence that the larger industrialized nations should lead by example to induce change in the global attitude. Think of it like our beloved captain not hustling on defense ... why should a fourth-liner bother if the face of the franchise doesn't care?

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Looks a lot like any first world country did when they were just starting to industrialize.

Not. Far from it.
China is becoming the cesspool of the world and nobody seems to be willing to hold them accountable.

Because they are a "developing nation" they seem to get a free pass.... even though they are responsible for an enormous amount of polution and they are the now the world's largest producer of co2 gases.

I just don't understand why everybody is willing to cut China, a world power, so much slack and at the same time they take such pleasure in beating up on Canada which has miniscule pollution problems compared to China.

Instead of saying lets clean up the very minor problems in our own back yard, I say lets first clean up the cesspool that exists in the next street over. Cleaning up the cesspool will have a WAY greater effect on the environment than doing the little bit of housekeeping that is required in Canada.

Lets get our priorities straight folks. Stop sweeping China's mess under the rug!

[GreenLantern]

The little bit of housekeeping that is required in Canada?

http://www.drinetwork.ca/

You should read this site.. $2 billion lost in revenue over a 6 year drought is quite significant I think. And the 20th century was un characteristically wet for this part of the world. Couple that with Global Warming and I think there is a major cause for concern, very close to home.

[Resolute 14]

The beauty of the hypocrisy of environmentalists is the use of "per capita" stats. The earth doesn't care how many people live in Canada vs. China. It only cares how much damage is being done to it. We in Canada need to improve, there is no doubt about it. But China has much, much farther to go, and it is hard to take the entire green movement seriously when the world simply won't hold the worst polluters accountable.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern

Ok so I read through your post a few times Calgryborn and I can't tell if it is a sarcastic bait.. or if you are serious.. I am going that you are serious and wish to change your mind.

That is the exact opposite of what we are trying to teach Canadians. Where did you learn this? Is it a personal opinion or did someone actually tell you this? I want their email if possible.

Here is a website that will help you better understand what we are talking about mainly when we mention "fresh water".

http://www.ec.gc.ca/water/en/info/pubs/FS/e_FSa5.htm


I hope some of this can convince you otherwise. It is very important for the future of this country that we stop thinking water is a renewable resource. We will never gain more water, we have what we have and that is it. It is a closed system (globally).

I did go to your web site and read what they had to say. There were some good points but, a lot of it was talking about waste treatment which is another issue all together. Yes there is a cost to treat the water we use and that does include a environmental cost like anything we do but, compared to the size of the resource we govern the impact is small. Living in a large metropolitan center like say Toronto increases the impact to the local environment and therefore conservation should have greater consideration. After all they have to live there.

Canada as a whole uses very little of their water resource. According to "CIA World Factbook" Canada has 3300 cu km's of water under her management. Our useage is only 44.72 cu km a year. Russia beats us on quantity with 4498 cu km of fresh water under their stewardship but does use a slightly higher percentage of her resource. They consume 76 cu km of water per year. Both seem to be pretty responsible usage-wise compared to the volume of there resources. Also 12% of Canada's annual water usage is dedicated to growing food for ourselves and the world. There is a reason why the prairies are known as the "worlds bread basket".

I'm not saying Canada shouldn't continue to improve their resource management. What I am saying is that as we stand now we have an environmentally friendly government that has a record of continued improvement in the area of environmental stewardship. Most of the nation's of the world(if not all of them) impact their environments negatively much more than Canadians do. Canada has much they can be proud of. Conversely China and India shouldn't use a head count of their population as an excuse to rape their environment for the benefit of a very few of their populous.