Going paperless, Ald. Dale Hodges and the series of tubes

[Wookie]

Wow, some of you sound ridiculous.

Seriously, the guy likes a hard copy to read. What's the friggen problem. Maybe he reads it in bed, at the table, etc. and doesn't want to set-up wireless and use a laptop. I hate laptops and could never use one.

Maybe staring at a screen for hours hurts his eyes?

The guy doesn't want to deal with a 10,000 page PDF and would prefer a hard copy. OH NO!! Let's just drag him out back and shoot him.

[jammies]

Hodges sounds like this guy that used to work at one of my clients - first off, he had to be the slowest typist in history, as it took him about 2 minutes to type in an email address. Actual emails, all of 2 to 3 lines, were works of a half to full hour of typing, using the "two fingers but completely forget which letters are where and have to scan the keyboard every time for them" method.

Then, he was unable to comprehend that if you typed in the email address wrong (which, at 1/2 a word per minute you'd think would be hard to do), the message would not go to the person you intended, and would come back as a failure. He would always call me and ask if the email system was down every time it happened: "Geez jammies I sent a message and I got this weird message back saying some gibberish about "not finding the recipient". Is the email down?" Once I asked him to forward me the message and he managed to type MY email address wrong (which was even harder, considering it was a generic email address at the company called "Bell") and got another error, which of course confirmed his suspicions that the whole system was falling apart and that technology was way over-rated.

Anyway, he was a nice enough guy, and not really dumb, but he just annoyed the living hell out of me because when I gently suggested I could hook him up with a program to help him learn to type, his response was "I don't have time for that, I'm a busy man." Really? You have time to spend an hour (and I'm not exaggerating, I actually watched him type a three sentence email in over an hour while I was by his desk installing a new computer for someone else) for each short email you write, but you don't have time to learn to cut that down to maybe a couple minutes?

This smacks of the same blindness to sense - as CMPunk said, he can always print out his own copy on his own paper if he is that addicted to it. Otherwise, he should realize that it's the same data either way, and if he's carrying "piles of paper" that only fit in his trunk, a decent laptop is going to be lighter and just as portable.

[Muta]

I read this story, and then thought to myself...

...how the frick does this make the news?

Seriously, this is the best the Herald can come up with? There isn't anything more interesting locally, or abroad to talk about?

Geezus.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by Wookie

Wow, some of you sound ridiculous.

Seriously, the guy likes a hard copy to read. What's the friggen problem. Maybe he reads it in bed, at the table, etc. and doesn't want to set-up wireless and use a laptop. I hate laptops and could never use one.

Maybe staring at a screen for hours hurts his eyes?

The guy doesn't want to deal with a 10,000 page PDF and would prefer a hard copy. OH NO!! Let's just drag him out back and shoot him.

Yah, I'm sure he's flipping through a 10 000 page document on his bed - until it flips him and the mattress over with the weight.

The "problem" is that it costs the taxpayers money to keep supplying him with his paper fix. Another "problem" is that his stated excuse - that he doesn't want to fix up his place with the internet - is pretty weak. As for eye strain, not that he mentioned it, buy a real monitor of 22 inches or better that you can use in portrait mode, and that issue goes away.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

Hey, I didn't learn computers just yesterday. YOu make it sound like I learned computers just for this. Exemplary for my age group? Give me a break; you make me sound ancient. I bought my first computer nearly two decades ago. It was a 95 MB beauty (a friend thought 95 was a lot) and the PC and printer cost me $3500. My computers now have many times the capability at a small fraction of the cost. I disagree that someone who is not computer literate is obsolete. I've met some of your council members but don't know the alderman in question but someone can be a great alderman despite not understanding computers. I'm a financial planner and I use computers all the time but I know colleagues who are great at what they do but don't understand computers.

Fredr, I'll get the information you asked for.

Sorry bro! Your post made it sound like you and your peers had in fact at age 50-60+ learned the ins and outs of computers as a part of your Alderman job.

I remember being in kindergarten with a 286 with 2mb of Ram, 40mb hard drive, PC Tools, and a 2400-baud modem. Cost $3000.

[RougeUnderoos]

"he'd have to wire his house with Internet connections"

Huh?

I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that there are telephone lines built right in to that house.

[icarus]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

"he'd have to wire his house with Internet connections"

Huh?

I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that there are telephone lines built right in to that house.

Heh. Or--and this will blow Hodge's mind--wireless. Internets in the air.

Seriously though, I hope people like this don't actually make decisions pertaining to the choice and implementation of technology for running municipal systems.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by Wookie

Wow, some of you sound ridiculous.

Seriously, the guy likes a hard copy to read. What's the friggen problem. Maybe he reads it in bed, at the table, etc. and doesn't want to set-up wireless and use a laptop. I hate laptops and could never use one.

Maybe staring at a screen for hours hurts his eyes?

The guy doesn't want to deal with a 10,000 page PDF and would prefer a hard copy. OH NO!! Let's just drag him out back and shoot him.

Totally agree. I can't believe some of the freak-outs over this. Hell, I've been using computers since I was 10 years old, but any contract or document that requires critical attention, I print. Even it it's 100 pages.

MoneyGuy's post was informative and I agreed with his assertation that some people just need the paper copy. My memory is wired a little funny and when I remember something that I read, I remember whereabout on the page it was. In the middle, toward the top, at the beginning of a large paragraph...
Reading something on a computer doesn't lend me that same ability.

As for paper wastage, I hope all you guys get your bills electronically and have told your bank to stop sending paper statements. And Rogers. Tell them to stop sending the 14 page bill with every call you made that month.
That's a waste of paper and it's also a security risk for identity theft.

[Clarkey]

Pincott is proving to be quiet the wingnut--trying to implement all kinds of social engineering b.s.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Wookie

Wow, some of you sound ridiculous.

Seriously, the guy likes a hard copy to read. What's the friggen problem. Maybe he reads it in bed, at the table, etc. and doesn't want to set-up wireless and use a laptop. I hate laptops and could never use one.

Maybe staring at a screen for hours hurts his eyes?

The guy doesn't want to deal with a 10,000 page PDF and would prefer a hard copy. OH NO!! Let's just drag him out back and shoot him.

Originally Posted by 4X4

Totally agree. I can't believe some of the freak-outs over this. Hell, I've been using computers since I was 10 years old, but any contract or document that requires critical attention, I print. Even it it's 100 pages.

MoneyGuy's post was informative and I agreed with his assertation that some people just need the paper copy. My memory is wired a little funny and when I remember something that I read, I remember whereabout on the page it was. In the middle, toward the top, at the beginning of a large paragraph...
Reading something on a computer doesn't lend me that same ability.

As for paper wastage, I hope all you guys get your bills electronically and have told your bank to stop sending paper statements. And Rogers. Tell them to stop sending the 14 page bill with every call you made that month.
That's a waste of paper and it's also a security risk for identity theft.

Its already been said but if he wants a hard copy why doesn't he just print one off?

Just because they are delivering the reports by email doesn't mean that is the only way that he can read them.

And of course his comment of getting internet at his house isn't just ignorant it unbelievably stupid.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by moon

Its already been said but if he wants a hard copy why doesn't he just print one off?

Just because they are delivering the reports by email doesn't mean that is the only way that he can read them.

Agreed

Originally Posted by moon

And of course his comment of getting internet at his house isn't just ignorant it unbelievably stupid.

I interpreted that as him not wanting to have to read at his computer. In other words, he didn't want to have a computer in every room of his house. kermit already pointed out that a laptop solves that (to an extent).


I used to hate it when my parents would answer my questions with things like "you'll understand when you grow up". As far as this debate goes, I can't believe that people are so quick to judge and throw out opinions like "if he can't use a computer, he's useless and needs to go".
Just so pathetically wrong. Such an insolent and childish thing to say.
I was thinking about this a bit tonight and it occurred to me that no matter how much the world embraces text talk, I'll always write out my words. No amount of persuasion can change the fact that I prefer to read full words and that I read them faster and more comfortably. And if some young punk were to write me off as a dinosaur for this, I suppose I'm old enough to roll my eyes and know that he has alot of learning to do if he has such a ridiculous attitude.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

Well done for learning the computer! I understand the difficulty and you are most certainly an exemplary credit to your age group!

Adapting to the computer age, if for nothing else than enviornmental stewdardship is something to be taken very seriously. Not mentioning the fact that we live in 2008 and computer communications are the way of the world.

I agree with the poster who said that this is very obvious proof that Alderman Hodges is not appropriate for the position anymore.

Actually, he's pathetically obsolete.

If one cannot use a computer effectively in 2008, they have no business in public office. The fact that the people in charge can be so arrogant as to tell us what to do while they feel justified in living in their 1980 mentality makes me sick.

This is such a crappy post. You (Traditional_Ale) are the one who is arrogant. You really think that your few years of wisdom trumps a guy who has been a civic servant for 25 years?
You'll understand when you grow up.

[moon]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I interpreted that as him not wanting to have to read at his computer. In other words, he didn't want to have a computer in every room of his house. kermit already pointed out that a laptop solves that (to an extent).

It seems like an awful lot of paper to print off for his comfort. Which again can be solved by him printing it personally.

I used to hate it when my parents would answer my questions with things like "you'll understand when you grow up". As far as this debate goes, I can't believe that people are so quick to judge and throw out opinions like "if he can't use a computer, he's useless and needs to go".
Just so pathetically wrong. Such an insolent and childish thing to say.

Well if using a computer is part of his job and is super easy to learn to do, I think he does need to go if he refuses to learn it. It isn't as though he is expected to cut off his arm or learn a new language.

The change would not affect his life one bit if he didn't want it to. To me it is him that is coming off as extremely childish and pathetic in the article.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by moon

It seems like an awful lot of paper to print off for his comfort. Which again can be solved by him printing it personally.




Well if using a computer is part of his job and is super easy to learn to do, I think he does need to go if he refuses to learn it. It isn't as though he is expected to cut off his arm or learn a new language.

The change would not affect his life one bit if he didn't want it to. To me it is him that is coming off as extremely childish and pathetic in the article.

Sure. Works for you. Works for me. We both know how to restart a frozen computer. We both know how to download whatever we want, whenever we want. The guy is 60 years old. I guarantee that he's better at some stuff than you or I will ever be. So the guy needs to read from paper. It's really not the end of the world. He doesn't need to be crucified for it. If you are a better alderman than he is, why aren't you running for office?

[Rathji]

I agree with 4X4.

Now before people start peggin me as a 90 year old computer illiterate who can't find his internets because his monitor is turned off. I am young, have used computers for 20 years and am halfway through a Computer Science degree at UofC.

I cannot read and be expected to understand any file that is more than a page or 2 long. My brain just doesn't work well that way and I need a hard copy in front of me or it takes twice as long. I would certainly hope that someone who is responsible for running a part of my city is able to get his information in a format that is understandable and easy to process for him.

I certainly don't care if we are footing the bill for 40 reams of paper in a year. It is better than half the crap our government spends money on.

[transplant99]

War & Peace is almost 1400 pages long....maybe that should be published only as a document any longer too then? One of th great literary pieces of all time.....and it would be nearly impossible to get through on a computer screen. Would that not be a shame to deny a general populace the ability to pick it up and read it?

There really is something to be said about hard copy, and those that prefer it are no more "unfit" to serve their function in government or business than those whom seem to believe that computers are the only way to go. Sure saving trees is a noble idea, and one that the computer age has been able to put a large dent in I am guessing.

That being said, I want my officials to be as comfortable as possible when reading important documents that could have a large effect on my life in one way or another. There is no reason that this Alderman should not be allowed to receive his agendas in his preferred way. To suggest otherwise is merely petty and shows a complete misunderstanding of the way things were done for CENTURIES.

[Wookie]

Imagine if his readings came in one of those plastic packages http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=62470. Poor stupid old man wouldn't have any idea what to do!

Then we'd really have to shoot the useless old SOB.

[onetwo_threefour]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

Sorry bro! Your post made it sound like you and your peers had in fact at age 50-60+ learned the ins and outs of computers as a part of your Alderman job.

I remember being in kindergarten with a 286 with 2mb of Ram, 40mb hard drive, PC Tools, and a 2400-baud modem. Cost $3000.

Ha 2MB!

I remember our first computers starting to show up in about Grade 2 or 3. Commodore PETs and Vic-20's. I think they maxed out at about 32K of Ram. No such thing as an HDD. My first home 'puter was a Commodore 64C in about 1986. I had trouble convincing my dad it was a worthwhile expense and that I didn't just want to play games on it. (Which of course I did)

As for the topic of this thread specifically. My boss just got a computer in his office this year for the first time. He is in his late 40's. I have spent a significant amount of time teaching him how to read his own emails so he's not wasting one of our assistant's time printing them all out.

[Titan]

Originally Posted by Wookie

Imagine if his readings came in one of those plastic packages http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=62470. Poor stupid old man wouldn't have any idea what to do!

Then we'd really have to shoot the useless old SOB.

Wow. Hilarious. I have not laughed out loud at a post in a long long time until now. Perfect!! I would give you a red square. If I had the power. And the russians were done with it.

[Cowboy89]

I wonder how much fossil-fuel energy is required to power your laptop for a day's work vs. the energy it takes to print a hundred pages a day. I don't even think there's a realistic environmental arguement for this let alone feel high and mighty enough to condemn people as being incompetent in their position for not having an internet connection at home. Also talk to your optomitrist about how damaging reading from a computer screen is versus reading from paper.