Man kills grandson in hunting accident...with an AK-47?

[Displaced Flames fan]

[quote=Azure;1343027]

Well obviously you have a problem with assault rifles. I know a lot of people who hunt with them, or take them along for some target practice when they go camping. They've never had an issue. And they're certainly not 'idiots.'

No, I don't have a problem with assault rifles in general. You know 'a lot of people' who hunt with them? Well, maybe then you can answer the question I've posed above. Why do they? What is the advantage? What is the point of hunting with an assault rifle over a conventional hunting rifle?

For all you know the guy was probably just out for some target practice with his grandson. Considering that the hunting season is over and all.

I'm guessing the article would've said they were target shooting (or on their way to target shoot) rather than hunting.

Gun safety is the issue here, not some 'idiot' who killed his grandson because he was hunting with an AK-47

Yes, gun safety is the issue. But this is the 4th time I've told you that him hunting with an AK-47 has ZERO to do with my point. I'm telling you that it says something about him as a person, which includes him being an idiot among other things.

[Montana Moe]

This is a tragic story, and could have been prevented. It's a shame things like this happen with folks that should know better.

There are a few issues that I feel should be adressed about the story. It is still illegal to own a fully automatic rifle in the United States unless you have a certain federal license, which is difficult to obtain. As Bring_Back_Shantz stated above, it is likely a semi-automatic.

They may have been hunting wild pigs, for which there is no season in Texas. They are considered a nuisance animal and therefore can be killed at any time. A semi-auto would be advantageous for hunting pigs as it usually takes multiple shots to down a wild pig.

The ammunition is relatively inexpensive for most assault rifles, so that may be another reason why this was the weapon of choice. They usually have a shorter barrel than most hunting rifles, which is more effective for hunting in dense Texas brush. Most AK-47's I have been around are relatively heavy, so I would certianly not make it my pick for hunting hogs.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

You might have a point had the grandfather been drunk. Or anything 'close' to that. But he wasn't.

We're talking about an accident here, not vehicular homicide.

I equate improper handling of a loaded firearm with your 14 year old grandson in the line of fire to drunk driving on a negligence level. Why you don't is a mystery.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Montana Moe

This is a tragic story, and could have been prevented. It's a shame things like this happen with folks that should know better.

There are a few issues that I feel should be adressed about the story. It is still illegal to own a fully automatic rifle in the United States unless you have a certain federal license, which is difficult to obtain. As Bring_Back_Shantz stated above, it is likely a semi-automatic.

They may have been hunting wild pigs, for which there is no season in Texas. They are considered a nuisance animal and therefore can be killed at any time. A semi-auto would be advantageous for hunting pigs as it usually takes multiple shots to down a wild pig.

The ammunition is relatively inexpensive for most assault rifles, so that may be another reason why this was the weapon of choice. They usually have a shorter barrel than most hunting rifles, which is more effective for hunting in dense Texas brush. Most AK-47's I have been around are relatively heavy, so I would certianly not make it my pick for hunting hogs.

Thanks for the insights Moe. You could be right about the hogs...and I agree...still wouldn't use an AK-47.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

I equate improper handling of a loaded firearm with your 14 year old grandson in the line of fire to drunk driving on a negligence level. Why you don't is a mystery.

Because there is a difference.

People who are involved in an accident might have been able to do something to prevent that. But we shouldn't take away their drivers license because of it.

And you've handled guns....so you know very well what can go wrong. We all make mistakes from day to day....the problem with 'guns'....is if you make a mistake, someone can wind up dead.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

Because there is a difference.

People who are involved in an accident might have been able to do something to prevent that. But we shouldn't take away their drivers license because of it.

And you've handled guns....so you know very well what can go wrong. We all make mistakes from day to day....the problem with 'guns'....is if you make a mistake, someone can wind up dead.

I'm sorry...what part of your post explains the difference you claim?

[Montana Moe]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Thanks for the insights Moe. You could be right about the hogs...and I agree...still wouldn't use an AK-47.

Indeed, there are many mountain hunting rifles with shorter than normal barrels that would do the job better, just tough to find one that is not bolt action. A lot of hunters I knew in Louisiana used lever action 30-30's for deer, pigs, etc. Blew my mind coming from Montana where bolt action high caliber rifles are the norm.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

I'm sorry...what part of your post explains the difference you claim?

The difference is that someone 'intentionally' drinks and drives, while someone does not 'intentionally' ....'accidentally' shoot their grandson.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Montana Moe

Indeed, there are many mountain hunting rifles with shorter than normal barrels that would do the job better, just tough to find one that is not bolt action. A lot of hunters I knew in Louisiana used lever action 30-30's for deer, pigs, etc. Blew my mind coming from Montana where bolt action high caliber rifles are the norm.

They've always been the norm for me too. In my time in Colorado though, we saw a lot of hunters with 30-30's. Of course, it's entirely possible they were all from Texas and Louisiana too. No joke.

Aren't Ak-47's notoriously problematic? Jams, misfires etc?

[I_am_Beast]

also with Ak-47's is the most common name, the SK-47 looks exactly the same just with a pin to prevent the "automatic firing" which is also easily converted...back to the AK version....
ods are being his "grandfather" he picked up the weapon from some action eariler in his life...sure it might be pardon the pun "overkill" but it's like buying a car that can go 250km hr when the speed limit is 100...

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

The difference is that someone 'intentionally' drinks and drives, while someone does not 'intentionally' ....'accidentally' shoot their grandson.

Very few drunk drivers intentionally crash or intentionally run over a pedestrian.

Sorry, but you're reaching big time.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Very few drunk drivers intentionally crash or intentionally run over a pedestrian.

Sorry, but you're reaching big time.

No, but they 'intentionally' put themselves in that position.

I'm not reaching at all. Unless you want to argue that 'hunting'....is intentionally putting yourself in a position where you can 'accidentally' shot someone.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

No, but they 'intentionally' put themselves in that position.

I'm not reaching at all. Unless you want to argue that 'hunting'....is intentionally putting yourself in a position where you can 'accidentally' shot someone.

Nice bob and weave!

This is how I see it....

Driving=hunting
being drunk=walking behind your 14 yr old grandson with the safety off.

How do you see it?

[Montana Moe]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

They've always been the norm for me too. In my time in Colorado though, we saw a lot of hunters with 30-30's. Of course, it's entirely possible they were all from Texas and Louisiana too. No joke.

Aren't Ak-47's notoriously problematic? Jams, misfires etc?

Yeah, we get out of staters all the time up here, they make for great stories of what not to do.

I've heard the quality of the AK is very origin dependent, Chinese vs. Romanian, etc. I don't own one, nor do I really have a desire, but I had heard the AK was much more reliable than the M16-A1 in the Vietnam era.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Nice bob and weave!

This is how I see it....

Driving=hunting
being drunk=walking behind your 14 yr old grandson with the safety off.

How do you see it?

Well, improper gun safety, including walking around with the safety off is a problem. Now, did he intentionally slip the safety off, or did it happen by mistake? You don't know that.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

Well, improper gun safety, including walking around with the safety off is a problem. Now, did he intentionally slip the safety off, or did it happen by mistake? You don't know that.

Really doesn't matter. One might be more reckless than the other but both would've been his responsibility.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Really doesn't matter. One might be more reckless than the other but both would've been his responsibility.

Agreed, and his punishment, as severe as it may be, was ending up fatally shooting his grandson.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

Agreed, and his punishment, as severe as it may be, was ending up fatally shooting his grandson.

Let's hope that it is punishment for him, there are those out there.....

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

Let's hope that it is punishment for him, there are those out there.....

[peter12]

Isn't the AK-47 notoriously inaccurate for target fire. I think it was designed to be a hand-held automatic weapon with excellent penetrating power. No idea why this would be brought along on a hunting trip...

I could see something like CAR-15. Aren't those like a .22 target rifle?