Conservatives try to bribe independent MP?

[MarchHare]

This smells like another Liberal smear. if you through enough s*** at the wall, so of it is bound to stick.

How could this possibly be a Liberal smear when the allegations are being made by Cadman's widow who is running in the next election as a Conservative?

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

How could this possibly be a Liberal smear when the allegations are being made by Cadman's widow who is running in the next election as a Conservative?

She has agreed to the offer the Liberals have made of a cabinet post if she wins as a Conservative and then crosses the floor. Meanwhile the daughter is on board as a marriage has been arranged to a prominent Liberal billionaire.

It will all come out when she gets smeared as a Liberal after the marriage goes horribly bad and the daughter turns on her.

[Ford Prefect]

It was noted in an article in today's Herald by Don Martin that Cadman himself is on record as stating nobody offered him a bribe to try to influence his vote ... Conservative, Liberal or otherwise. So this is a case of his widow's word against a deadman's. Pretty sordid no matter how this washes out, but it does sound like she might be trying to sell a few books IMO. It's strange that she would contradict her dead husband's words otherwise, and repugnant if that is her motivation.

[RougeUnderoos]

Well there seemed to be something going on. According to the article they even have Harper on tape talking about giving the guy money. It's not like they just made it up.



But Harper is quoted in the book, and he appears to confirm that some sort of financial arrangement was offered to Cadman. CBC News has obtained a copy of the audio recording of the interview.
"The insurance policy for a million dollars, do you know anything about that?" Zytaruk asks.
"I don't know the details. I know that there were discussions," Harper replies on the tape. "This is not for publication?"
"This will be for the book, not for the newspaper," answers Zytaruk, who works for a Surrey newspaper.
Harper goes on to explain on the tape that the offer to Cadman was "only to replace financial considerations he might lose due to an election." He adds that the offer was carried out by people who were "legitimately representing the party."

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Well there seemed to be something going on. According to the article they even have Harper on tape talking about giving the guy money. It's not like they just made it up.



But Harper is quoted in the book, and he appears to confirm that some sort of financial arrangement was offered to Cadman. CBC News has obtained a copy of the audio recording of the interview.
"The insurance policy for a million dollars, do you know anything about that?" Zytaruk asks.
"I don't know the details. I know that there were discussions," Harper replies on the tape. "This is not for publication?"
"This will be for the book, not for the newspaper," answers Zytaruk, who works for a Surrey newspaper.
Harper goes on to explain on the tape that the offer to Cadman was "only to replace financial considerations he might lose due to an election." He adds that the offer was carried out by people who were "legitimately representing the party."

Pretty confusing and it sounds like Zytaruk has broken faith in that Harper asked if this was for publication, wich Zytaruk replied it was for a book not for a paper, then all of a sudden it shows up on the CBC.

Its not damning in that he didn't know the details of discussions about insurance but he did know what was earlier confirmed that he would get financial considerations if he lost his seat for voting against his party.

Plus you could read Harper's answers that he wasn't confirming the insurance discussions, but he did know they talked money.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

She has agreed to the offer the Liberals have made of a cabinet post if she wins as a Conservative and then crosses the floor. Meanwhile the daughter is on board as a marriage has been arranged to a prominent Liberal billionaire.

It will all come out when she gets smeared as a Liberal after the marriage goes horribly bad and the daughter turns on her.

Yeah, I'm sure it's all a big conspiracy.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Pretty confusing and it sounds like Zytaruk has broken faith in that Harper asked if this was for publication, wich Zytaruk replied it was for a book not for a paper, then all of a sudden it shows up on the CBC.

Oh OK. I guess that since this is only a matter of law and order he should be able to go off the record? This is hilarious. If this was a Liberal scandal I hardly think that you would agree that someone should be able to shield themselves with this flimsy comment!

I agree that this is an odd situation. Maybe there was no impropriety...but seriously no matter which party you support you have to think that this needs to be looked at by an impartial body of some sort.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Slava

Oh OK. I guess that since this is only a matter of law and order he should be able to go off the record? This is hilarious. If this was a Liberal scandal I hardly think that you would agree that someone should be able to shield themselves with this flimsy comment!

I agree that this is an odd situation. Maybe there was no impropriety...but seriously no matter which party you support you have to think that this needs to be looked at by an impartial body of some sort.

Come on Slava thats a huge leap by you.

It does need to be looked at, I've never said it doesn't.

The problem with the tapes showing up with the paper is that it means that anyone in government office should never discuss anything at all with the press on or off of the record because its going to end up being used against you.

To me, the fact that the tapes have shown up in the papers after the author confirmed that they wouldn't reflects a big ethics problem.

Harpers statements didn't confirm anything about the insurance offer, he did confirm that consideration would be given for a loss of the seat.

If this was a court of law, the tapes would be thrown out as evidence, I would be interested to see who delivered the tapes to the CBC.

I would also be interested in hearing more about why the widow and her daughter are claiming this, while the dead father denied it.

Its a screwed up thing, but frankly, if it needs to be investigated by the RCMP, then so does the actions of the Liberal party when they were in power and offering all kinds of inducements to the Conservative members to keep themselves in power.

[Slava]

Well a million dollar life insurance offer to a man with terminal cancer is nothing but a million dollar bribe flat out. It can't be viewed as anything else. If the allegation is something of this magnitude, and purely illegal then why discuss it if you think its off the record? If there is an ethics problem here, but you can't seriously believe its with the guy who recorded the interview?

It will be interesting to see Harper "govern as if he has a majority" if they can't discredit this story though.

[FurnaceFace]

I've voted for both the Liberals and PCs in the past. I'm a big support of leaders like Mulroney who said popular opinion be damned, I'm doing what is best for the country.

While I think most parties have done what the CPC has done, it's more disturbing when it comes from the Harper led government.

Harper's platform was "Stand Up for Canada" where he states:

For those Canadians seeking accountability the question is clear: which party can deliver the change of government that’s needed to ensure political accountability in Ottawa? We need a change of government to replace old style politics with a new vision. We need to replace a culture of entitlement and corruption with a culture of accountability. We need to replace benefits for a privileged few with government for all.

Perhaps naively, I expect his promise of greater accountability to be delivered. Instead I see actions similar to what other governments have done in the past. He's just fallen into the same "whatever it takes to gain power" trap. His party isn't any different than the others, the only different so for is he hasn't (yet) gotten caught with a hand in the cookie jar like Mulroney, Chretien, Martin, and others did.

When you're the pot, stop talking about the colour of the kettle.

Of the leaders out there right now Harper is definitely the best option. I think he's got a plan for the country and would be a good leader.

Dion is not his equal. Dion's leadership is an utter failure. He makes Joe Clarke look like a thespian. I have memories of someone like The Air Farce doing a parody of Clarke and the actor had idiot mitts on - it was fitting at the time and a reprise for Dion would be warranted. Dion comes off clueless and out of touch much like a certain provincial leader we are all familiar with.

My recommendation to Harper would be to lead. Get your plans out there, show you aren't a fuddy duddy, talk to the media, challenge the media if you have to, get in their face. Don't hide behind the curtain and try and manage the media. you come off weak, scared, and with something to hide. Use the media to talk to us. You know the CBC is going to have a certain bias, we know they have a certain bias, don't worry about it. You're message if it's clear and concise will get through and you'll win votes from people like me.

[peter12]

I've been in Ottawa this week when the scandal broke. I can say without revealing too much that this is being seen by many people on the Hill as too suspicious. Something more is happening that hasn't been made public knowledge, yet. Almost safe to say, it looks like the Conservatives are not at fault.

[Slava]

^ Could well be the case peter. It is an odd situation to say the least. Just strange how things have come to light, and so murky.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well a million dollar life insurance offer to a man with terminal cancer is nothing but a million dollar bribe flat out. It can't be viewed as anything else. If the allegation is something of this magnitude, and purely illegal then why discuss it if you think its off the record? If there is an ethics problem here, but you can't seriously believe its with the guy who recorded the interview?

It will be interesting to see Harper "govern as if he has a majority" if they can't discredit this story though.

I have a lot of problems with the million dollar life insurance bribe. Nobody is going to give a dying man a million dollar life insurance policy.

And yes I do think that its an ethic problem as well from the point of the press.

At this time there's no proof that this bribe actually happened in this form.

If its actually proven that this happened in terms of the life insurance offer, I'll have problems with it. But right now this thing smell to high heaven.

With the Liberal bribes there was pretty conclusive proof.

In this case, until I see something indisputable, and Harper's statement isn't indisputable, then I'll jump on the prosecution bandwagon.

[peter12]

I am anything but a partisan conservative. In fact, I don't like Ottawa politics too much myself, so I don't have much bias in favour of anyone. Most people think the Liberals may be up to a little more than they should be.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by peter12

I am anything but a partisan conservative. In fact, I don't like Ottawa politics too much myself, so I don't have much bias in favour of anyone. Most people think the Liberals may be up to a little more than they should be.

How are the Liberals being implicated in this?

The person who admitted to the (alleged) bribe attempt is planning to run for the Conservatives in the next election. This sounds more like an internal party dispute.

If the allegations were made in the book, then the Liberals absolutely should being asking the RCMP to investigate.

[llama64]

It's interesting to read the opinions in this thread...

If allegations that the Liberals had done this, conservative minded people would be jumping up and down screaming about immorality and boon-doggles. Yet, the Conservatives get implicated and it's "business as usual".

I'm not surprised to find out the Conservatives used dirty tactics. I expect any politician to use such maneuvers. But what I find offensive is that its somehow alright for the Conservatives to do such a thing while the Liberals burn in hell.

That said... I wish the Liberals would get rid of their moron for a leader and start focusing on policy. They are channelling Harper's opposition tactics now, focusing entirely on the governing party rather then doing their job -- governing.

I'd probably be a libertarian if it wasn't for my education. Politicians give me a bad rash.

[Claeren]

There is an audio piece of HARPER himself talking, while leader of the opposition, saying that he had heard about 'some financial incentive being offered to Cadman' but that 'he had no idea of the details, who was involved, or what was offered'.

On one hand he distances himself immediately from the allegations but on the other, it is not terribly ethical for the leader of a party to 'not know the details' of a bribary offer.


There are few things worse then hypocrisy, and those who would ride the Liberals about this sort of thing but won't because they are Conservatives need to really think how that serves their interests as Canadians. I don't like this anymore then i like the Lideral scandals.




The fact Cadman denied there being an offer before his death is not a shock, he was likely good friends with whomever made the offer and had no incentive to go burning bridges. While he apparently said 'no', that does not mean he wants his old friends in jail either.



Claeren.

[Calgaryborn]

I wonder how much insurance his family got because the government didn't fall. If this has any truth to it at all it might just be an attempt by the Conservatives to cover his family if the government fell and they lost there government insurance policy. Not suggesting it was right but, neither would voting for the Liberals to retain your insurance.

[Claeren]

^ UGh, no, that was not their intention at all. They were using high level connections to provide what would amount to a basic guarenteed payout when he died in exchange for his vote in a way that was the least likely to go detected.

More to the point though, even if it was what you are saying, it would STILL amount to a federal offense likely punishable with prison time if proven. Which is exactly why Cadman denied the offer after the fact despite not taking the money. He himself was a long time conservative and did not want his former friends in the party taking heat for what upclose may well have appeared as just good politicking.



Claeren.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Before we going making final determinations and accusing conservative supporters that they are being biased, why dont we wait until the truth comes out. We were able to let load on the Libs because they had an enquirery and we had the facts to make statements. We dont have the facts yet.

Stay tuned.