Christian Groups Claim Pro-Atheist 'Stealth Campaign' in Nicole Kidman Fantasy Film '

[RougeUnderoos]

I would never have heard of these books and I certainly wouldn't care to go to a Nicole Kidman movie (and still don't) if these morons hadn't started shouting about it. I'm sure I'm not alone.

These people just like to get on the news. That Donohue fathead is all over the place bitching about people bitching about the Catholic church. All he does is draw attention to these things. He's probably in on it.

"Hey, we've got this obscure movie that nobody knows about but we blew the marketing budget on Hairspray. Can you make some noise about it? I'll donate a hundred thousand dollars to The Church of Your Heavenly Pockets".

[The Yen Man]

I always find it kind of ironic how these public outcry actually attracts more people to the movie than it deters. By making such a big stink, they're actually being counterproductive. But I guess whenever they can get their 15 seconds of fame and satisfy their egos, they'll continue with these pointless "public outcries" every time.

[Resolute 14]

Speaking of irony, how is it that a movie that involves a quest to kill God could possibly be pro-atheist? You can't kill a god that does not exist, and atheists do not believe in a god. Ergo, since the movie argues the existence of God, it is actually arguing that atheists are wrong.

[Flashpoint]

No such thing as bad controversy when you are marketing your movie.

I probably wasn't going to go see it. I will now.

Goooooooooooo ATHEISTS!

[ernie]

Originally Posted by Snakeeye

Speaking of irony, how is it that a movie that involves a quest to kill God could possibly be pro-atheist? You can't kill a god that does not exist, and atheists do not believe in a god. Ergo, since the movie argues the existence of God, it is actually arguing that atheists are wrong.

Except in the books when they do kill God they find out he's no god at all and just a phony.

[Resolute 14]

Oh sure, spoil the ending for me!

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Snakeeye

Speaking of irony, how is it that a movie that involves a quest to kill God could possibly be pro-atheist? You can't kill a god that does not exist, and atheists do not believe in a god. Ergo, since the movie argues the existence of God, it is actually arguing that atheists are wrong.

SPOILER ALERT

According to the article -- in the books the characters end up killing God only to find out that he's a phony.

Follow the Yellow Brick Road.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Snakeeye

Speaking of irony, how is it that a movie that involves a quest to kill God could possibly be pro-atheist? You can't kill a god that does not exist, and atheists do not believe in a god. Ergo, since the movie argues the existence of God, it is actually arguing that atheists are wrong.

I know nothing about the plot of this film or the book upon which it was based, but perhaps the hero's quest is to kill a being who claims to be a god, and the hero shows that anyone who follows the god was worshipping a false deity?

[Edit]
Ha, I was beaten! And I was good at guessing the plot, it would seem.

[ernie]

Originally Posted by Snakeeye

Oh sure, spoil the ending for me!

Sorry but it was in the article....

[Thor]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Does he have a point? Is this an Atheist conspiracy? What about the role of the church and its magic men in Movies and Television?

A children’s fantasy film that stars Nicole Kidman and features a little girl on a quest to kill God has some Christian groups upset over what they believe is a ploy to promote atheism to kids.
"These books denigrate Christianity, thrash the Catholic Church and sell the virtues of atheism," said Bill Donohue, president and CEO of the Catholic League.

Golden Compass article

Religion is making it sooo easy for Atheists.

I mean really, its just not a fight its a slaughter!

The great thing is I'm sure the moral christian groups will continue to fight to ban books, movies, and anyone who dares question them.

Because they know, deep down, that its a losing battle when logic and reason go up against mythology and worship in deities.

[AC]

Having actually read the books and read comments by the author himself, it's clearly anti-religious.

Is that a problem? Of course not.

In fact: http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/compass.asp

Books of the trilogy have sold more than 15 million copies around the world, with Northern Lights winning the Carnegie Medal for Children's Literature in 1995 and in 2007 being awarded the 'Carnegie of Carnegies' for the best children's book of the past 70 years. The Amber Spyglass, the final book of the series, won The Whitbread Prize in 2001, making it the first children's book to do so.

"My books are about killing god."

I do plan to see the movie, it was a part of my childhood and I find it to be an interesting commentary on religion.

Is it an effort to indoctrinate children into an atheist view? I very much doubt it. But its certainly an attempt to allow critical thinking about current abusive and corrupt powers that affect us.

Besides, the notion that the Catholic League feels its an attempt to indoctrinate children is quite funny in itself.

Religion is rooted in fear and ignorance, and it thrives best when these conditions are maintained.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by AnthonyCook

Having actually read the books and read comments by the author himself, it's clearly anti-religious.

Is that a problem? Of course not.

In fact: http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/compass.asp

Books of the trilogy have sold more than 15 million copies around the world, with Northern Lights winning the Carnegie Medal for Children's Literature in 1995 and in 2007 being awarded the 'Carnegie of Carnegies' for the best children's book of the past 70 years. The Amber Spyglass, the final book of the series, won The Whitbread Prize in 2001, making it the first children's book to do so.

"My books are about killing god."

I do plan to see the movie, it was a part of my childhood and I find it to be an interesting commentary on religion.

Is it an effort to indoctrinate children into an atheist view? I very much doubt it. But its certainly an attempt to allow critical thinking about current abusive and corrupt powers that affect us.

Besides, the notion that the Catholic League feels its an attempt to indoctrinate children is quite funny in itself.

Religion is rooted in fear and ignorance, and it thrives best when these conditions are maintained.

Well said

[AC]

Bumping this thread with two quotes from the author addressing his atheism and the books:

From: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21595083/

How do you respond to the claim that your books are anti-Catholic and promote atheism? Lyndsay Petersen, Parkersburg, Iowa

Hello, Lyndsay: In the world of the story — Lyra’s world — there is a church that has acquired great political power, rather in the way that some religions in our world have done at various times, and still do (think of the Taliban in Afghanistan). My point is that religion is at its best — it does most good — when it is farthest away from political power, and that when it gets hold of the power to (for example) send armies to war or to condemn people to death, or to rule every aspect of our lives, it rapidly goes bad. Sometimes people think that if something is done in the name of faith or religion, it must be good. Unfortunately, that isn’t true; some things done in the name of religion are very bad. That was what I was trying to describe in my story.

I think the qualities that the books celebrate are those such as kindness, love, courage and courtesy too. And intellectual curiosity. All these good things. And the qualities that the books attack are cold-heartedness, tyranny, close-mindedness, cruelty, the things that we all agree are bad things.


Is there an underlying message for atheism in your book or did you simply want to write a fantasy story, like Tolkien? Kim Mapstead, Friday Harbor, Wash.

Hello, Kim: What I was mainly doing, I hope, was telling a story, but not a story like Tolkien’s. (To be honest I don’t much care for “The Lord of the Rings.”) As for the atheism, it doesn’t matter to me whether people believe in God or not, so I’m not promoting anything of that sort. What I do care about is whether people are cruel or whether they’re kind, whether they act for democracy or for tyranny, whether they believe in open-minded enquiry or in shutting the freedom of thought and expression. Good things have been done in the name of religion, and so have bad things; and both good things and bad things have been done with no religion at all. What I care about is the good, wherever it comes from.

------------------------
Quotes from: http://www.christianpost.com/article/20071105/29957_%5C'Golden_Compass%5C'_Author_Denies_Promoti ng_Atheism_in_Books.htm

In his appearance on the “Today” show Thursday, Pullman implicitly denied that his work is selling “atheism for kids” when ”Today” host Al Roker brought up the accusations made by the Catholic League.

“Well, you know, I always mistrust people who tell us how we should understand something. They know better than we do what the book means or what this means and how we should read it and whether we should read it or not,” said Pullman.

“I don’t think that’s democratic,” he continued. “I prefer to trust the reader. I prefer to trust what I call the democracy of reading – when everybody has the right to form their own opinion and read what they like and come to their own conclusion about it. So I trust the reader.”

Donahue's response:

“The last thing Pullman trusts is the people,” Donohue said in a statement Thursday. “That is why he tries to sneak his atheism in back-door to kids. If he had any courage, he’d defend his work, but instead he continues to do what he does best – practice deceit.”

“We at the Catholic League never had to run from our work,” added Donahue. “How pitiful it is to see a grown man slip kids his poisonous pill and then pretend he trusts the reader.”

------------------------

Friends of my girlfriend's recently advised her not to see the movie (they're relatively devout catholics), which I thought was simultaneously funny and kinda sad.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by AnthonyCook

Bumping this thread with two quotes from the author addressing his atheism and the books:

From: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21595083/

How do you respond to the claim that your books are anti-Catholic and promote atheism? Lyndsay Petersen, Parkersburg, Iowa

Hello, Lyndsay: In the world of the story — Lyra’s world — there is a church that has acquired great political power, rather in the way that some religions in our world have done at various times, and still do (think of the Taliban in Afghanistan). My point is that religion is at its best — it does most good — when it is farthest away from political power, and that when it gets hold of the power to (for example) send armies to war or to condemn people to death, or to rule every aspect of our lives, it rapidly goes bad. Sometimes people think that if something is done in the name of faith or religion, it must be good. Unfortunately, that isn’t true; some things done in the name of religion are very bad. That was what I was trying to describe in my story.

I think the qualities that the books celebrate are those such as kindness, love, courage and courtesy too. And intellectual curiosity. All these good things. And the qualities that the books attack are cold-heartedness, tyranny, close-mindedness, cruelty, the things that we all agree are bad things.


Is there an underlying message for atheism in your book or did you simply want to write a fantasy story, like Tolkien? Kim Mapstead, Friday Harbor, Wash.

Hello, Kim: What I was mainly doing, I hope, was telling a story, but not a story like Tolkien’s. (To be honest I don’t much care for “The Lord of the Rings.”) As for the atheism, it doesn’t matter to me whether people believe in God or not, so I’m not promoting anything of that sort. What I do care about is whether people are cruel or whether they’re kind, whether they act for democracy or for tyranny, whether they believe in open-minded enquiry or in shutting the freedom of thought and expression. Good things have been done in the name of religion, and so have bad things; and both good things and bad things have been done with no religion at all. What I care about is the good, wherever it comes from.

very well said by the author. i may have to track down a copy of these books and give them a read. one thing i will definitely give credit for and was very pleased to read is that the author was giving religion a nod saying that there are many good points about it. in these types of debates its usually "the other side is the root cause of everything wrong in the world and there is no good in it at all" - and yes, both sides are guilty of this. its refreshing to see someone that appears to have a decent head on their shoulders and have a little bit of objectivity discuss this.

[driveway]

These books are outstanding and I've been looking forward to the films since I first read the books back in 2003. (incidentally, I called Sam Elliot playing the part of the Aeronaut).

The books aren't atheist as God, angels, et al. are all characters in the books, but they do promote a decidedly anti-dogmatic, anti-organized-religion, anti-revealed-truth message.

If you are a devout Christian or other monotheist, you should absolutely fear these books. If you have an open mind about spirituality and the human condition, these books are fantastic.

That the books are more interesting, better written, and more morally coherent than the Bible itself is what should really worry Christians.

[Locke]

This certainly seems like a reasonable claim....

[cSpooge]

Originally Posted by driveway

These books are outstanding and I've been looking forward to the films since I first read the books back in 2003. (incidentally, I called Sam Elliot playing the part of the Aeronaut).

The books aren't atheist as God, angels, et al. are all characters in the books, but they do promote a decidedly anti-dogmatic, anti-organized-religion, anti-revealed-truth message.

If you are a devout Christian or other monotheist, you should absolutely fear these books. If you have an open mind about spirituality and the human condition, these books are fantastic.

That the books are more interesting, better written, and more morally coherent than the Bible itself is what should really worry Christians.

I'm Catholic (not hardcore mind you) and I absolutely loved the books. To me it was a nice change of perspective compared to the mostly pro-Christian literature.