C-Train Rant Thread

[STeeLy]

I think that the transit systems in each Canadian metropolis is overall very good with the exception of Calgary.

Toronto and Montreal has Subway/Metro which runs mostly underground and when it IS above ground, u don't worry about stop lights and with it mostly underground, weather shouldn't be a big factor here. Where as the Skytrain out in Vancouver is mostly above ground and its usually on bridges so u don't have to worry about lights either, but weather might cause delays.

Calgary lacks such transportation system because nobody could imagine this quick growth over the past couple years, so all they have are buses that has to run in traffic, C-Trains that have to stop at every red light downtown. However, I don't think that the government would think about building anything mass transit systems yet, but I'd think they should at least use something like the transitway system in Ottawa where its bus services and emergency vehicles only so that the bus don't have to deal with traffic all the time.

As for rants:
Its a lot like other people's rants...
- Just because ur friend needs a ticket doesn't mean you should hold the train up for them, be patient and wait for the next train in 5-10 minutes.

- If you're on ur phone, please talk quietly, turn up ur mic volume on ur phone if u have to, because if I'm at the other end of the car and I can hear you telling whoever's on the other end of the phone about what u did with ur gf last night, thats way too loud.

- Parents with kids in strollers, please, hold the damn stroller, because when the train/bus needs to suddenly brake and ur stroller with kid falls over, don't blame us for trying to reach out to hold it but miss and it ACTUALLY Falls over.

- Get to the middle of the damn train and stop clogging up the damn doors.

- Don't pound on the window when ur friends just got off... it annoys the HELL out of me

- If the seat is for 2 people, and I've taken up one, don't try to sit u and ur friend on it, it gets very uncomfortable very quickly.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

3. SMOKERS SMELL! quit, it's gross, and when i'm 4 inches from your rancid body I'd rather not inhale your embedded smoke stench.

My biggest peeve also.

You'd be surprised by the number of smokers who don't realise they stink. It's a rude, filthy, and disgusting habit.

[someguy51]

While I definitely agree with some the complaints people have made overall I really enjoy taking the C-Train/Bus to and from work. * Its way quicker then driving if you work downtown. I play on my work's softball team and the people who take the Train then drive to the diamond get there quicker then the one's who drive from downtown. * I can't imagine paying what some people pay for parking. * Its more environmentally friendly. * Its a really good chance to catch up some new music if you've got an mp3 player. * Its more relaxing then driving. * You can catch up on your reading. * Don't know if its true or not but a friend of mine said that the average transit user gets their minimum daily exercise by walking to and from the C-Train/Bus Stops.

[albertGQ]

I don't mind taking the C-train to and from work at all during rush hour. Its so packed that they never check for validated tickets. I do the park and ride so I never end up paying the fare. So I save $4.50 a day. Spend $7 on lunch a day. So my true cost for lunch is only $2.50

[Flames_Gimp]

oh....don't even get me started

[MatsNaslund]

I've rode both.
The C-Train seems worse. I think it is largely because the trains don't/can't keep on schedule. The above ground level crossings downtown were an altogether bad idea. That screws with the schedules, so people get even more testy. Then, as mentioned, there seem to be regular breakdowns of trains to further irritate the users. Regular users can't trust the system, so every irritation in addition is just magnified.

I drive c-train and used to work just morning and afternoon rush hours. Now I start my day at 6:00pm and am done by 1 am and enjoy it way more.

From my perspective there's definately a few things wrong with the system. Things that most riders won't understand. Some of those things are:

The schedules are super tight (5 minutes during rush hour) and the schedules assume that doors only open for 18 seconds at each station and that the train will get all green traffic lights as well as all green train lights. In rush hour it is more like 45 seconds to a minute at each station and sometimes when there's major door holding it is more than 2 traffic lights. Each light missed screws up the sequence of lights for the train. For example, if a guy holds the doors for an extra minute at 4 St. station so his buddy 2 blocks away can get in along with letting someone validate a ticket then what's going to happen is we are probably going to stop at each of the traffic lights in between 4rth and 7th st. stations. Normally there should be no stopping in between the stations. So that will put you back 2-3 minutes and in 5 minute service what happens is you hold back all the other trains going in the same direction by 2-3 minutes as well. Unfortunately with trains the options for getting back on schedule are limited. On the NE line there are no options to short turn between Bridgeland and Marlborough. If anything happens there, the entire line will be effected. On the 201 line in the NW, short turns can be done at either University or Brentwood. In the South There's Fish creek or Anderson for quick turn arounds. The unpleasant thing is you have to dump off all the passengers that want to continue further at whatever station you turn around at. The only other options for getting back on: miss a trip and sit at an end point (rarely used except the NE line) and Train Swaps. Train Swaps only work if 2 or more trains are running late and they are running close to the other train's schedule. Somebody can hold onto the door for life and there's nothing that we can do other than make "PA's" asking them to stop or if Transit police happen to be on the train (never in rush hour).

To all the people that think its fun pressing the Passenger Emergency Button: Each and every passenger emergency has to be checked out by the driver. The button has to be reset and the emergency dealth with and called in on radio before the Train moves further. During false alarms it only eats up about 3 minutes or so but its enough in rush hour to throw ALL trains off schedule. During a real emergency its enough to cause major delays.

Another problem is entering and leaving downtown. At the City Hall interlocking, in the offpeak the 202 City Centre is supposed to go WB first followed by the 201. In Rush hour 201 seems to get the preference but really its whoever gets there first. At this interlocking you need both the correct train signal and the traffic signal (fresh green). If you don't have the train signal it is likely because there is another train in the interlocking that is going a different direction. A lot of times you have the train signal but have to sit out an entire traffic light.
On the other end at O'Niel interlocking between 10 st and 8 st stations, the 202 Whitehorn train is supposed to wait for the 201 Somerset train on each trip even during rush hour. The problem is that 201 is rarely ever on time due to the major slowdown at 19 st. tunnel near Lions Park (Why is it 20 km/h?????) as well as slow downs around SAIT and Sunnyside. Whitehorn trains have to sacrifice 1-3 minutes each trip to do this. In rush hour both City Hall and O'Niel can get very congested in regards to train traffic as only 1 train can go at once and after the entire train clears a certain section of track, then the switches will change for the next train and give it the correct signal.

The biggest problem is that one problem on 1 train can effect the entire system. For example a train at 39th Avenue in the morning that has either a 'Door problem that won't clear' or a 'Passenger Emergency' or that requires waiting for EMS or Police due to a real emergency will cause all other trains behind it and even others heading southbound to be delayed. It throws off schedules for everyone and eventually will effect Whitehorn trains too.

I don't have time to explain what all the lights mean but generally (there are many more lights and I'm simplifying): green means go at maximum posted speed, yellow means no more than 60 km/h and slow down because next light is red, red means stop and if you run it will will shut the train off automatically and for the driver it means they will be facing disciplinary action later on. How is anyone supposed to keep a schedule when you see all Yellow or red train signals from Somerset to Stampede and then has to sit an extra light at each downtown station and then again all Yellow and Red train signals from Sunnyside to Dalhousie?. Another rule is that 1 train cannot enter the block where another train is sitting. That means if I'm at the lights at Mcleod trail and there's a train at Olympic Plaza then I have to sit until he's cleared the intersection.

Weather definately effects things. When it gets cold, really cold the max speed on all track is changed from 80 km/h to either 60 km/h or 70 km/h. When our schedules are measured in seconds and not minutes, that again effects things. During Rain, especially on the NE line where at Bridgeland there are greasers that grease certain parts of track, hydroplaning is an issue when it first starts to rain. Same thing if the weather is slushy or wet snow. During winter, coming into Barlow Maxbell at full speed, it can become hard to stop going downhill so most drivers will drop their speed a little bit all on their own.

I really like the City's plans to goto 3 minute service from the 5 minute service we have now, but right now we are barely meeting the 5 minute service and are at capacity for the max # of trains on 7 Ave at 1 time and without changes to address the topics I've brought up above it will be very hard to improve upon it. We have buses on 7 Ave and many times they try to beat out trains and I'll see 3 of them leave to beat my train (only 1 is allowed to do this according to the rules as 1 is allowed per block on 7th Ave). That is another thing that puts back the train another traffic light.

I don't miss rush hour at all. Sure you have to deal with street people and 'sleepers' who think that this is another form of the Drop-in Center and have to be removed by Police at the end of the night but its still quiet most nights and I can keep the schedule instead of running late all the time.

[tete]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

I don't mind taking the C-train to and from work at all during rush hour. Its so packed that they never check for validated tickets. I do the park and ride so I never end up paying the fare. So I save $4.50 a day. Spend $7 on lunch a day. So my true cost for lunch is only $2.50

Umm... oookaaayyy....

I take the train from downtown to the north, so I miss most of the crowds, but I agree with the people who had complained about people pushing their way onto the train before the people get off. For the love of god people, you can wait the extra 20 seconds and actually be able to get on the train with less crowds!! I'm going to have to remember the 'Gordie Howe elbow' tonight as I try to get off the train at 8th St.

I've seen plans/proposals for the early C-Train development in the 1970's and there were plans for it to go underground downtown initially. I sure wish that they would have gone that way.

[Madman]

Originally Posted by gottabekd

But rant away...(copied from previous ranting)

I can't believe how accurate these are!

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Scrambler

I have to say I'm a big fan of the Skytrain out here in Vancouver. It goes into the far reaching suburbs like Surrey, Coquitlam, New West and soon Richmond/Airport.

Also, it's fast and doesn't stop at intersections and for traffic. I always hate whren the Ctrain enters downtown and has to wait at red lights for traffic after having taken eons to get around the corners into downtown.

Frequency is another good thing with the Skytrain, during rush hour, it literally feels like there is one every minute. I guess they have to or they would all be sardine cans.

except for the serious crime issues that are centered around skytrain, so much so that transit security are now armed...
________
Medical marijuana dispensary

[ericschand]

Originally Posted by MatsNaslund

I drive c-train and used to work just morning and afternoon rush hours. Now I start my day at 6:00pm and am done by 1 am and enjoy it way more.
[edited]
...the major slowdown at 19 st. tunnel near Lions Park (Why is it 20 km/h?????)
[edited]

Wow. Thanks for the response. I didn't realize just how much there
was to keeping trains on schedule, and just how tight it is.

Also, a train driver complaining of speed limits?! That's a first.

ers

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

oh....don't even get me started

I'm all ears!

[Bobblehead]

Thanks Mats - good post.

I'm guessing that if the trains had gone underground in the downtown that a lot of these scheduling issues would not exist. There would still be issues in other areas, but the downtown wouldn't exacerbate things.

[albertGQ]

As much as we hate the Calgary Transit system, I agree with Flames gimp. The Handi-bus is 10,000 times worse. I try to go to movies, dinners, etc with my brother who relies on it, but I just can't do it anymore due to the unreliability of Handi-buses

We get mad at the bus being 5-20 minutes late. Try waiting for 2 hours!!! Or we've had instances where we'd call after the bus not showing up after 15 minutes. They tell us its on the way. Wait another 15 minutes. They tell us it should be there in 5. Call them back and then they tell us they don't see a booking!!!

VERY frustrating. I think the city should pump some more money into the Handi bus service before the Transit system. Between Handi bus and AISH, the severely handicap are getting SCREWED!!!

[Dion]

Maybe Mats can explain why drivers won't wait that extra second when someone is getting their ticket validated.

Or you're running up to the door and driver takes off, even though he sees you coming.

[ericschand]

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wi...,7129806.story

Seems appropriate.

Dion: I think Mats explained why quite well. His schedule just doesn't allow
it. He's scheduled in seconds, so those few seconds you take add up for
other trains. He just can't wait and has to move onto the next station.

ers

[MatsNaslund]

Maybe Mats can explain why drivers won't wait that extra second when someone is getting their ticket validated.

Because doors only open for 18 seconds or more depending on however long people hold them. Doors only open once per station. At certain locations like 8 St. it can take forever to close doors. There is no such thing as an extra second. If doors re-open you are going to be there at least another 1/2 minute or more. There is an endless supply of people wanting on the train from 3 blocks away. If you don't close the doors they will keep coming. In 5 minute service every second is precious. In 5 minute service the next train is only minutes away.

Opening the Doors AGAIn will also delay other trains behind you. THe idea is to get to a station Open and then press the close door button right away and then hope that people don't hold them and then get on the PA and ask them to 'stand clear'.

When it is 10 or 15 min service and the light is still not going to change for awhile then I have no prob opening the doors again but this does not happen a lot. One time I opened a door for a senior. He held it for his entire family (8 people and a stroller) who were 2 blocks away. Cost me 3 lights. Since that time I do not open more than once per station.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by MatsNaslund

Because doors only open for 18 seconds or more depending on however long people hold them. Doors only open once per station. At certain locations like 8 St. it can take forever to close doors. There is no such thing as an extra second. If doors re-open you are going to be there at least another 1/2 minute or more. There is an endless supply of people wanting on the train from 3 blocks away. If you don't close the doors they will keep coming. In 5 minute service every second is precious. In 5 minute service the next train is only minutes away.

OK. That makes sense. I can understand the downtown thing, but mine was with Anderson Station.

Thanks for the explanation

[Dan02]

Originally Posted by Dion

Maybe Mats can explain why drivers won't wait that extra second when someone is getting their ticket validated.

Or you're running up to the door and driver takes off, even though he sees you coming.

explain why everyone else should be delayed because you couldn't be bothered to get to the train station on time.

[PowerPlayoffs06]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

VERY frustrating. I think the city should pump some more money into the Handi bus service before the Transit system. Between Handi bus and AISH, the severely handicap are getting SCREWED!!!

My wife has been using Access Calgary for the past year or so and she's had so many horror stories about cabs and busses being late and their rediculous schedualing. You can't complain to anybody though, because they'll blacklist you and mark on your file that you're some kind of troublemaker so they'll make your life hell by always giving you crappy drivers or never getting you stand-by rides.

She once called in to book her trips to work for the week and was on hold for over an hour, finally they answer her call at 1:05pm and then tell her that she can't book trips for the next day because it's after 1pm. Or the time that her ride was 45 minutes late because he stopped for lunch. Then there's the idiot cabbies who show up in the big minivans and don't have stepping stools, yet wont do anything to help her try and climb up into the van, then stand and grumble and complain that she's making them late. My favorite was the day she got picked up from physio by the wrong driver because he was asking for "Stella" but she couldn't understand his accent and thought he was saying her name, "Starla." He gets about 5 minutes from our house, finds out he's got the wrong passenger, so he turns around and drives 15 minutes back to the physio place rather than just drop her off at home and have my wifes driver take the passenger he was supposed to have.

Handi-busses and Access Calgary are way worse than Calgary transit.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Dan02

explain why everyone else should be delayed because you couldn't be bothered to get to the train station on time.

Explain what? I think Mats cleared up a misunderstanding on my part.