Should Favre Retire?

[Bench Warmer]

Originally Posted by Swayze11

How do you figure Rodgers is brutal? Hes taken what 14 regular season snaps?

The reverse could be said as well - how do you figure he's good? He's a speculated to top 5 draft pick who plummetted to 24th. He's done nothing in practice or his limited game time to prove he's ready to take over the starter's role. If he was, the Packers organization may not be begging Favre to come back every year. They love Favre in GB but let's face facts - if there was a better option, they'd take a serious look at it. Nobody is giving any sort of endorsement to Rodgers.

[Lurch]

Originally Posted by transplant99

They were ONE win away from the playoffs THIS year. 8-8.

And I would suggest that the DEFENSE, not the Offense (you know, the part of the game he plays in) were far more responsible for the losses than anything Brett Favre did or didnt do this past season.

6th in the entire NFL in passing yards, 16th in the entire NFL in Passing TD's, more completeions than guys named Brady, Palmer, E. Manning GROSSMAN, Romo, Roethlisberger, Vick, Delhomme, Mcnair, Young etc etc etc.....

Yeah...he sure cant play the game anymore at all.

You can selectively cherry pick one or two stats to try and prop the guy up, but the bottom line is his time is passed. He is a first ballot hall of famer, but at this point he is a below average NFL quarterback. He was the 25th rated quarterback by passer rating (which actually accounts for most stats, not just the 1 stat where he was above average), and if you look at the top of that list (excluding Huard who only played about 5 games with a crazy 11 to 1 TD to INT ratio), it's the who's who of 2006 NFL quarterbacks (not all time, just right now).

In 2005, Favre was even worse, beating only Kyle Orton, Aaron Brooks and JP Losman by QB rating. Bottom of the barrel. 29 picks. In 2004, Favre was at his career average (roughly) of 92, and very similar in 2003. In a career where he was near 90 or higher in every year up until the last 2, and then drops to 70 for two straight, which is rookie/horrible level, it seems ridiculous to suggest he is still even a shell of his former self.

If you ignore that it is Brett Favre, and everybody loves aw shucks Brett, there are two years of evidence that he is a bottom 1/4 QB - perhaps even bottom 10%. He isn't capable of being a caretaker QB like McNair or Dilfer for the Ravens, b/c a team like that can't afford to 20 to 30 picks he throws due to horrible decision making. He used to have the raw talent to overcome this failing, but no longer. I just don't see the point of a quickly fading legend playing out the string on a mediocre team.

[transplant99]

You can selectively cherry pick one or two stats to try and prop the guy up, but the bottom line is his time is passed.

Thats your opinion...everyone has one.

The stats i posted are what they are....i actually watched every game last year, and he was on an island many times with little running support some games and a very inexperienced line to protect him.

He was a very good player on a very weak team. Period.

In 2004, Favre was at his career average (roughly) of 92, and very similar in 2003. In a career where he was near 90 or higher in every year up until the last 2, and then drops to 70 for two straight, which is rookie/horrible level, it seems ridiculous to suggest he is still even a shell of his former self.

Correct...his numbers fell when he lost 3/5ths of his O line, including two pro-bowlers that were replaced with rookies. What a bum!

[Bench Warmer]

Originally Posted by Lurch

By good numbers, you mean #25 passer rating, behind such luminaries as Rex Grossman

I wonder how many Bears fans would've rather had Favre and his poor passer rating yesterday than Grossman...

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by transplant99

They were ONE win away from the playoffs THIS year. 8-8.

And I would suggest that the DEFENSE, not the Offense (you know, the part of the game he plays in) were far more responsible for the losses than anything Brett Favre did or didnt do this past season.

6th in the entire NFL in passing yards, 16th in the entire NFL in Passing TD's, more completeions than guys named Brady, Palmer, E. Manning GROSSMAN, Romo, Roethlisberger, Vick, Delhomme, Mcnair, Young etc etc etc.....

Yeah...he sure cant play the game anymore at all.

Well they didn't win one more game. and their 8th win was against a team that mailed it in ... just ask Rex he said as much.

I don't know if Rodgers is any good but they basically wasted a #1 on him and we may never know if he can play.

My two points are that this team is stuck in quickmud until they move on but more importantly nobody DESERVES to play. Nobody, not even #4 is above the game or above his team. If he is the teams best option, then fine, but for everyone to say he deserves to go out on his own terms is rediculous.

Football is the ultimate team sport, regardless of whoever your QB is.

[transplant99]

My two points are that this team is stuck in quickmud until they move on

Lemme see if i understand what you are saying....Favre is the reason that the Packers have missed the playoffs the last two seasons, no other factors played into it? Not the loss of two pro-bowl O linemen? Not the loss of pro bowl WR Javon Walker? The injuries to RB's that had them starting Samkon Goddo at one point?

OK then.

but more importantly nobody DESERVES to play

Of course they do....thats why they have training camps. People deserve spots because they are earned.

I don't know if Rodgers is any good but they basically wasted a #1 on him and we may never know if he can play

He is 23 years old....how is he a waste and he will get his chance at some point.

Nobody, not even #4 is above the game or above his team. If he is the teams best option,

He is the teams best option or he wouldnt be starting every game the last 2 years....make that 15 years actually.

but for everyone to say he deserves to go out on his own terms is rediculous.

WHo said that? He has EARNED the right to play another year if he so chooses, and no matter how much one poster wants to pin everything on QB rating, his numbers have been pretty good on a below average team.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Lemme see if i understand what you are saying....Favre is the reason that the Packers have missed the playoffs the last two seasons, no other factors played into it? Not the loss of two pro-bowl O linemen? Not the loss of pro bowl WR Javon Walker? The injuries to RB's that had them starting Samkon Goddo at one point?

OK then.

Other things have contributed to, never said there weren't other things going on, but wheeling out Farve again is another one you can stack on the list.

Originally Posted by transplant99

He is 23 years old....how is he a waste and he will get his chance at some point.

Age is irrelevant. Length of his deal is. And every year #4 plays is one less year to see what Rodgers is made of and an extra year of frustration for Rodgers.

Originally Posted by transplant99

He is the teams best option or he wouldnt be starting every game the last 2 years....make that 15 years actually.

We'll never know, nobody else gets a chance.

Originally Posted by transplant99

WHo said that? He has EARNED the right to play another year if he so chooses, and no matter how much one poster wants to pin everything on QB rating, his numbers have been pretty good on a below average team.

3 people in this thread, including your implication just now. What he has done in the past means nothing. What his potential for 2007 is, is the only important information. If people think he can play fine, he's OK, not bad, not great, but he doesn't DESERVE to play if the Pack have better options.

[pack_fan91]

As of right now, yes, Favre is the best option for the team. We don't have much choice. Say Aaron Rodgers isn't any good. Then we wouldn't have him at starting QB, or even let him have a chance if he wasn't any good. Favre did just fine last season. He had less INTs last year than QBs such as Roethlisberger, Rex Grossman, Jon Kitna, and Eli Manning had just as many as he did. And so many people are out there saying "Favre's gonna get the INT record!" Well not with NFL QBs like that he won't.

[Lurch]

WHo said that? He has EARNED the right to play another year if he so chooses, and no matter how much one poster wants to pin everything on QB rating, his numbers have been pretty good on a below average team.

I'd hardly say his QB rating is the only reason I think the guy is no longer very good. I'd also say he may or may not be the best QB in Green Bay, but as long as he chooses to play management is under a lot of pressure to let him extend his streak and try and break Marino's last few career records.

As for being on a team with no running game/terrible O-line, the stats certainly don't back it up, but I'll certainly defer to completely unsubstantiated opinions. However, just as a note, Green Bay was 21st or 23rd in rushing by total/avg, about in line with Favre's passing numbers. Better yet, they gave up the 5th fewest sacks despite having the MOST pass attempts - obviously a terrible O-line in pass protection.

As for Green Bay's defense, they were ranked 12th overall in YPG against, but 25th against by points. I suspect some of that is due to having the 7th most turnovers by the offense, and some due to a mediocre to poor defense.

[Swayze11]

Originally Posted by Bench Warmer

The reverse could be said as well - how do you figure he's good? He's a speculated to top 5 draft pick who plummetted to 24th. He's done nothing in practice or his limited game time to prove he's ready to take over the starter's role. If he was, the Packers organization may not be begging Favre to come back every year. They love Favre in GB but let's face facts - if there was a better option, they'd take a serious look at it. Nobody is giving any sort of endorsement to Rodgers.

I suppose but cant you say the same thing for Lienart? I mean Rodgers was a college star but really hasnt been giving a slight chance. The only way hes going to get good is take some regular season snaps. But greedy Favre has to break records just to hurt his team. They need to develop a better/younger QB. Rodgers isnt getting any better sitting on the bench.