Metal detectors, pat downs and fingerprinting

[Superfraggle]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@Oct 15 2004, 05:15 PM


"If you've got nothing to hide" is a lame argument.

A "lame" argument? What are we, 6? You dislike it as an argument because you can't refute it. I can accept that you aren't comfortable with giving them your information and don't trust them not to use it. But please, try to keep your arguments at a reasonable maturity level.

[Resolute 14]

Originally posted by KevanGuy@Oct 15 2004, 04:23 PM
My personal info isnt something I think bars should be privvy to UNLESS I do something that would cause them to need it. Rules are in effect that limit what businesses can do with your personal info once they receive it but I think that by voluntarily handing that info over to them you are opening yourself up to the possibility that your ifo will be put on a list and used for any number of things.

And, food for thought, what if you match the description of someone that stabs someone and takes off? Could be a hastle.

I know hotels and the like need to have written permission from you to keep your personal information on file. I would presume that the same would apply here. They could probably scan your ID to let you in, but would not be allowed to save or share your information without your permission. To do otherwise would likely put Vickers into a huge legal mess.

[RougeUnderoos]

Do you guys really want to go to a bar where being stabbed or shot is something you reasonably have to be afraid of? I don't know how old you guys are, but the last place in town I want to go is a place that caters to 20 year old punks who are so violent/stupid that you have to take their fingerprints before you let them in the door.

[Agamemnon]

The best way not to get stabbed/shot in a bar is obvious. You get out of those types of situations what you put in. I know several friends who have gotten into bar fights, and I can honestly say they deserved to have they're ass kicked every time.

I on the other hand, am a smartass and a bigmouth, and yet I haven't been attacked in a bar once! It's all about knowing when to keep your mouth shut and when to realize that 'fronting' is probably going to get you hurt (or killed) on day.

The biggest way to prevent bar violence is to have more security, cameras, good lighting, etc. As someone previously said, most stabbings happen outside the club, not inside (where all those damn witnesses dancing get in the way!)

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by Superfraggle+Oct 15 2004, 06:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Superfraggle @ Oct 15 2004, 06:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-RougeUnderoos@Oct 15 2004, 05:15 PM


"If you've got nothing to hide" is a lame argument.

A "lame" argument? What are we, 6? You dislike it as an argument because you can't refute it. I can accept that you aren't comfortable with giving them your information and don't trust them not to use it. But please, try to keep your arguments at a reasonable maturity level. [/b][/quote]
Larf. Who are you, the CP language police?

What kind of name is Superfraggle anyway? What is your real name? How much money do you make? What is your address? Why don't you scan your driver's license and post it in here? Give us your phone number while you are at it.

I mean, if you have nothing to hide...

[KevanGuy]

Originally posted by Snakeeye+Oct 15 2004, 06:11 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Snakeeye @ Oct 15 2004, 06:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-KevanGuy@Oct 15 2004, 04:23 PM
My personal info isnt something I think bars should be privvy to UNLESS I do something that would cause them to need it. Rules are in effect that limit what businesses can do with your personal info once they receive it but I think that by voluntarily handing that info over to them you are opening yourself up to the possibility that your ifo will be put on a list and used for any number of things.

And, food for thought, what if you match the description of someone that stabs someone and takes off? Could be a hastle.

I know hotels and the like need to have written permission from you to keep your personal information on file. I would presume that the same would apply here. They could probably scan your ID to let you in, but would not be allowed to save or share your information without your permission. To do otherwise would likely put Vickers into a huge legal mess. [/b][/quote]
Well, I would assume that the IDs are kept in a database so they could be retrieved if someone does something in the bar.

[Resolute 14]

Originally posted by Agamemnon@Oct 15 2004, 05:20 PM
The best way not to get stabbed/shot in a bar is obvious. You get out of those types of situations what you put in. I know several friends who have gotten into bar fights, and I can honestly say they deserved to have they're ass kicked every time.

I on the other hand, am a smartass and a bigmouth, and yet I haven't been attacked in a bar once! It's all about knowing when to keep your mouth shut and when to realize that 'fronting' is probably going to get you hurt (or killed) on day.

The biggest way to prevent bar violence is to have more security, cameras, good lighting, etc. As someone previously said, most stabbings happen outside the club, not inside (where all those damn witnesses dancing get in the way!)

Sometimes it is not that easy. I've put myself in the middle of two domestic disputes in the past because I couldnt stand idly by and let a conflict escelate. One time was a good friend with minimal risk, but the other was to defend a perfect stranger who called out for help. For all I knew, the guy could have had a knife. Fortunately he backed down, but quite frankly, I'd rather get stabbed than stand around and let someone else get hurt where I could have acted.

Or, to make the story short, Sometimes you have no choice but to fight, no matter how little you want it.

Kevan - I'm sure the first person to get charged as a result of this identification process will be challenging it's legality in court. I'd presume they could store your data on file until the end of the buisness day (afterall, hotels have to do this in order to keep track of you), but if there is nothing to report, the data would have to be dumped.

Then again, as someone said, Vickers is regarded as a slimeball, so who knows what will happen in truth.

[Mike__]

The best way not to get stabbed or shot is not to go to the club/bar in the first place. I can't believe some of the stuff that happens at these places. Whatever happened to one-on-one fist fights? Now, when you p*ss someone off it ends up four guys on one with weapons. I could think of better ways to have fun without worrying about being attacked for looking at someone.

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by Snakeeye@Oct 16 2004, 04:00 AM
Sometimes it is not that easy. I've put myself in the middle of two domestic disputes in the past because I couldnt stand idly by and let a conflict escelate. One time was a good friend with minimal risk, but the other was to defend a perfect stranger who called out for help. For all I knew, the guy could have had a knife. Fortunately he backed down, but quite frankly, I'd rather get stabbed than stand around and let someone else get hurt where I could have acted.

Or, to make the story short, Sometimes you have no choice but to fight, no matter how little you want it.

Kevan - I'm sure the first person to get charged as a result of this identification process will be challenging it's legality in court. I'd presume they could store your data on file until the end of the buisness day (afterall, hotels have to do this in order to keep track of you), but if there is nothing to report, the data would have to be dumped.

Then again, as someone said, Vickers is regarded as a slimeball, so who knows what will happen in truth.

Sure, I hear ya, but you've got to admit, it was your own actions that put you in danger (well... you already 'admitted' that )

Makes sense that when someone yells out for help you help them, but you're taking on a lot of responsibility when you make that choice. That's the kind of thing where your chances of getting injured go up 1000%. It comes down to the specific situation, and whether you value your own person more than the person who's calling for help.

I'd probably help... and I might get injured. Just saying that its the choices you make that increase/decrease your chances of injury. Just like the choice to respond to a guy mouthing you off at the bar, or walk away.

There's probably a lot more chance of getting hurt getting into a mouth match at a bar then responding to a distress signal from someone on the street (though God knows what for).

[soulchoice]

Originally posted by Doggy Dogg@Oct 15 2004, 06:59 PM
Fingerprinting... man that is nuts.

Calgary clubs are getting more and more ridiculous. I thought that they were meant to have fun at. Now its like you can never be safe going to a club because the people inside have guns and knives.


I guess if fingerprinting is what needs to be done to keep people safe, then so be it.

I have never understood why people make comments like this. I understand your concern and reasoning, but to say that they are surprised this is happening in Calgary bars is very naive. How can one be surprised with this. Come on people, Calgary is approaching a million people, its not a small town. Violent crime happens and will continue to occur. Its not only Calgary that has violence like this. Every major centre has violent occurrences in clubs, etc. Unfortunately society has become this way.

No longer is it going to be a fist match anymore. It just is not like that. It would be great if it was, but its not anymore. Something we all have to live and deal with nowadays. I always tell people, if you don't want something bad happen to you, keep your mouth shut and stay away from trouble. Because, you never know who you may be dealing with and what he is prepared to do to you

[Superfraggle]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos+Oct 15 2004, 06:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (RougeUnderoos @ Oct 15 2004, 06:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

A "lame" argument? What are we, 6? You dislike it as an argument because you can't refute it. I can accept that you aren't comfortable with giving them your information and don't trust them not to use it. But please, try to keep your arguments at a reasonable maturity level.

Larf. Who are you, the CP language police?

What kind of name is Superfraggle anyway? What is your real name? How much money do you make? What is your address? Why don't you scan your driver's license and post it in here? Give us your phone number while you are at it.

I mean, if you have nothing to hide... [/b][/quote]
Naw, man. If i was the language police, I'd have to take you to task for "larf" :P . Superfraggle comes from the show Fraggle Rock. My real name is Josh. I make very little money, as I'm a full time student right now with an extremely part time job. My address, license, and phone number I will keep to myself, I think, because I trust the bars and bouncers I go to more than I trust random internet people.

[RougeUnderoos]

In a nutshell, you've got something to hide.

Me too.

[Superfraggle]

Originally posted by RougeUnderoos@Oct 17 2004, 02:40 PM
In a nutshell, you've got something to hide.

Me too.

I never said I didn't