Retired Ontario priest pleads guilty to 47 charges on sex assaults

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Also, the catholic church is one of the largest therefor, it would be safe to say that they would have a higher number of cases.

This seems a fair assessment until you consider that the church is passing itself off as the highest moral authority of mankind while it is rotten to the core. The Catholic church has even moved clergy around so they won't be found out and can start out with a new group of innocent children.

That this seems to be problem only in NA and GB could be that we are the only ones who have investigated.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Also I believe the church wants their priests to be 'married to God'

But this begs the question, why didn't nuns abuse their pupils sexually like priests did? If it's the forced abstinance which is repressing natural sexual urges, one would think that nuns would face the same issues. As a matter of fact, because women get more sexually with age, hitting their peak around 40, while men get less sexual with age, hitting their peak around 20, you'd think that nuns would've had an even harder time repressing their sexual urges... Food for thought.

Maybe the Nuns take out the abuse in different ways? Can you picture the Nun in the schoolroom with naughty boy stuck in a corner offering prayer for forgiveness?
Men and women take out frustrations differently...women as opposed to being physical are more apt to abuse children mentally? Speculation perhaps and nothing to back me up on it.

[Cheese]

Found some other horrifying links on abuse by the Church....an active message board and running tab called Abuse Tracker...

Abuse Tracker

Snap Survivors Network

Im still searching for the same thing regarding other professions with no luck.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Again not be too picky...in the post that offered the links I said....
"thought Id do a quick search on clergy facing lawsuits of this type."
I didnt suggest my search was based solely on Priests. Im sure if you went through most of the links that a great majority would be on the Catholic side because of the nature of the beast...ie Priests being celibate vs Pastors allowed to marry. Of course where adults are given unfettered access to children the problem "could be larger", but I havent seen the news supporting that yet...perhaps you can dig something up. There are quite a few men or young men working in the Daycare field, why arent we seeing the same cases there?

I realize that you didn't specifically say the links you posted had to do with Catholics, but I thought I better point it out because I know what people were going to automatically think.

I think Catholics would be the majority of the cases because they are the single largest Christian sect in the world.

As for the daycare question, there are in fact many cases of daycare abuses, but keep in mind that the number of men daycare workers with unsupervised access to children is likely way smaller than the number of clergy in the same situation in North America, so obviously there will be more reported cases in the media. Another thing to keep in mind is that many sex abuse scandals only come to light once the victims are adults. Since men as daycare workers is a relatively new thing, again, there are likley going to be less reports.

Anyway, some links for you because you asked...

http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal...daycare/1.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clevela..._abuse_scandal

http://users.cybercity.dk/~ccc44406/smwane/Rascal.htm

Well, here's the whole google search. There are countless sources that state daycare abuses occur quite often.

http://www.google.ca/search?q=daycar...hl=en&safe=off

http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=...e+Search&meta=

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I realize that you didn't specifically say the links you posted had to do with Catholics, but I thought I better point it out because I know what people were going to automatically think.

I think Catholics would be the majority of the cases because they are the single largest Christian sect in the world.

As for the daycare question, there are in fact many cases of daycare abuses, but keep in mind that the number of men daycare workers with unsupervised access to children is likely way smaller than the number of clergy in the same situation in North America, so obviously there will be more reported cases in the media. Another thing to keep in mind is that many sex abuse scandals only come to light once the victims are adults. Since men as daycare workers is a relatively new thing, again, there are likley going to be less reports.

Anyway, some links for you because you asked...

http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal...daycare/1.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clevela..._abuse_scandal

http://users.cybercity.dk/~ccc44406/smwane/Rascal.htm

Well, here's the whole google search. There are countless sources that state daycare abuses occur quite often.

http://www.google.ca/search?q=daycar...hl=en&safe=off

yep truly horrifying...and better yet the vast majority are caught and sentenced harshly! How many Priests or clergy get off with a transfer to another city, or a slap on the wrist and Community service?
Certainly Im not making light of the Daycare issues....but as mentioned before, the Church assumes it is the moral authority over people, thus making it a more heineous event.

Horrid case

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Cheese

yep truly horrifying...and better yet the vast majority are caught and sentenced harshly! How many Priests or clergy get off with a transfer to another city, or a slap on the wrist and Community service?
Certainly Im not making light of the Daycare issues....but as mentioned before, the Church assumes it is the moral authority over people, thus making it a more heineous event.

Horrid case

I don't know about that.

In one of the stories I just finished reading, the guy got 5 years for molesting 99 kids. Another one ended in hung jury even though all the evidence was there.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

That this seems to be problem only in NA and GB could be that we are the only ones who have investigated.

Maybe, but maybe not. It's not really fair to make that assumption without evidence.

It could also have to do with our community and family structure. In many European countries, clergy play a more active role in families and communties. They aren't isolated or ostracized. People get to know their clergy better than here.

I think it's the case in general where people who are societal outcasts will behave in sociopathic ways.

I think the cultural component to this is huge.

[RedMan12]

Let the men marry. Jesus Christ already.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Maybe, but maybe not. It's not really fair to make that assumption without evidence.

It could also have to do with our community and family structure. In many European countries, clergy play a more active role in families and communties. They aren't isolated or ostracized. People get to know their clergy better than here.

I think it's the case in general where people who are societal outcasts will behave in sociopathic ways.

I think the cultural component to this is huge.

Culturally perhaps South Americans and Africans arent as educated? Perhaps this lack of education suggests that they would feel as though they would be punished for "telling on their local Priest"? They might feel they would be ostracized for squealing on the church?
There are more variables in this entire schmozzle than we could shake a stick at....but id be willing to bet almost anything that it isnt a North American or UK issue alone.
I would think the clergy are more involved in South America and perhaps Africa then they might be in Industrialized nations.
Education of the masses tells the children this is a crime...hence the vast publicity in our areas.

[chris lindberg]

There were liklely thousands of native children who were sexually abused by Preists and Nuns in Residential schools that will never report it, due to their ethics of non-interference of another person's life.

[PYroMaNiaC]

My question is which comes first? The pedophilia or the priesthood. Do people here really believe that supression of sexual urges causes pedophilia? (No sarcasm intended) Or do pedophiles become priests because it is a haven for their perversions?

There is at least one school of thought out there that believes that pedophilia is a sexual orientation, like hetero or homo.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedophilia

If this is true, that would explain why it doesn't respond to treatment. It would also mean that it is part of who you are, not subject to change by your enviroment. That would then mean that pedophiles have been flocking to the Catholic Priesthood to hide, not that the priesthood has made them that way.

If it is the other way around, and pedophilia is a mental disorder, how does it develop? What factors, besides abstinence, would the Catholic faith embrace that make it a breeding ground for this? I say besides abstinence because most of us have had periods of time without getting any and most of us don't turn to fantasies of children during the dry spells. On top of that, the same idea of "leader" or "position of authority" could lend itself to a more discreet affair with a woman. The ramifications of getting caught are a whole lot less severe, I would think.

[FireFly]

Trust my sister to bring up the chicken or the egg question...

[Calgaryborn]

My wifes grandfather was an orphan in Switzerland during WW2. He wasn't touched himself but he witnessed it. He also has a brother who was sexually abused at a different catholic orphanage.

You will find that pedophiles will often pick an occupation that gives them access to children. Priests and other clergy as well as teachers and coaches will have a disproportional number of pedophiles within their ranks.

The catholic priesthood has attracted sodomites for centuries because it relieved them of societal pressure to marry and put them beyond punitive laws against sodomy. Monastic life appealed to many as well for obvious reasons.

Now I seen an public service announcement a number of years ago that suggested that 1 in 4 girls get sexually abused by adulthood and 1 in 5 boys. If that statistic is true(I don't remember the source) and only 5 to 7 percent of the population is homosexual what percentage of homosexuals are pedophiles? Also if 25 percent of girls are sexually abused by men; how many men within your circle of acquaintances would statistically be guilty of such a crime?