The coming shocks faced by Gen Y'ers

[duncan]

they had a seminar in our area a year ago, that was to prepare employers for the replacement of the babyboomers by Gen. Y. Two of the main points were that the employer should expect a transient workforce, and Gen Y expected to bypass starting salaries and entry level jobs. This group had interviewed 1000 under-graduates and recent grads, and through the interviews, noted a drastic change in attitudes. They found that G-Yers had witnessed their parents lose jobs to corporate downsizing, etc, and felt apathy towards the employer. However, with the loss of 'careers' and a rise in the cost of living, came two income families and 'latch-key kids', that tended to have no loyalty to the parents or labour groups.
They predicted a workforce that would seek only personal gratification and craved praise, one that would leave quickly if they did not receive one or the other. They claimed employers would need to forget the days of employees doing anything for the good of the company, or employees sticking around for 25 years. The new workforce expected to start at the top, both in pay and position. Generation Y felt it would be beneath them to start at the bottom, and demanded the wages their parents received. They said that Gen Y saw their University education as far superior to their parents life education, and expected employers to come to them.
We returned to our workplace, both employer and union, wondering how much of this was true. A new batch of employees came in, and we both paid closer attention to their approach. The new employees were hired as entry level, call-in, part-timers, but within weeks, expected every other weekend off, questioned the year wait for their merit raise, and demanded better hours. Within 60 days, 2 of 8 were gone, looking for straight days, and better pay. Comments from the group also included "We are the new wave, we just finished the course, and know more about the job. We don't need to listen to the 'old-school'."
THEY ARE THE BIGGEST WORKLOAD FOR THE UNION.

[Ironhorse]

Interesting information, Duncan.

Instant gratification anyone?

[Tron_fdc]

For most of the reasons duncan posted, I'm really hesitant to hire anyone under 25. We're in an industry where it would be catastrophic to have an employee get trained by us, then jump ship to a competitor at the first sight of a better offer. From the young 'uns I've talked to, I get the feeling gen Y is much more prone to doing something like that than someone from the 30+ crowd.

[Agamemnon]

I'm just guessing... but might the increased probability of a 'Gen Y'er' jumping ship to another company be because there are plenty of jobs out there to be had? As the baby-boomers get older, they're going to retire, and those jobs are going to be open. There are more people retiring than entering the workforce. Seems to me that this will create more opportunities for people horizontally, and they may take the extra 5-10 grand to do the same job at a different company, because the old coot who did that job is off to Jamaica.

With all this doom and gloom about what Gen Y'ers expect, it seems that the fact that there 'should' be a lot of jobs floating around gets lost. Maybe they're vocationally mobile because they can be, rather than because they're a bunch of spoiled brats? (and by they, I mean we).

[looooob]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

, and they may take the extra 5-10 grand to do the same job at a different company, because the old coot who did that job is off to Jamaica.

? (and by they, I mean we).

well at least you pesky gen y'ers respect your elders

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

(and by they, I mean we).

Not we, YOU!! I'm Gen X mofo.....paving the way for all you lazy layabouts

I just really get the impression from the young folk that they would be jumping from job to job regardless of the market (although it does have a factor, but in my experience it has more to do with attitude).

I'd only hire one of you guys if it was a last resort. I may be missing a young, dynamic superstar staff member by having that attitude, but I'm not going to take the chance in case I get some lazy, unloyal unmotivated knob that got his education paid for by his rich parents, that wants to work 4 days a week and abuse his expense account.

I also equate the "instant gratification" thing to theft....not getting your immediate reward? STEAL IT!! Whereas an older employee might take issue with management and resolve it through those channels, young kids are more prone (from what I've seen....and I've seen it on SOOOOOO many occasions) to swipe it from you instead.

/stereotype

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Originally Posted by duncan

THEY ARE THE BIGGEST WORKLOAD FOR THE UNION.

Certainly the Gen Y desires have to have Unions worried, where notions such as 'Seniority', Pay Scales based on tenure, and "Seniority" are scoffed at. The two would seem to be completely incompatible. It'll be interesting to see if organized labor can/will change it's model & principles to more contemporary views.

I recently hired 2 new grads, one from MRC and one from UofC HSB. I'm glad to say that there are certainly exceptions to Gen Y - you just have to be on top of your interviewing. Then again, I might have been lucky....

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

Not we, YOU!! I'm Gen X mofo.....paving the way for all you lazy layabouts

I just really get the impression from the young folk that they would be jumping from job to job regardless of the market (although it does have a factor, but in my experience it has more to do with attitude).

I'd only hire one of you guys if it was a last resort. I may be missing a young, dynamic superstar staff member by having that attitude, but I'm not going to take the chance in case I get some lazy, unloyal unmotivated knob that got his education paid for by his rich parents, that wants to work 4 days a week and abuse his expense account.

I also equate the "instant gratification" thing to theft....not getting your immediate reward? STEAL IT!! Whereas an older employee might take issue with management and resolve it through those channels, young kids are more prone (from what I've seen....and I've seen it on SOOOOOO many occasions) to swipe it from you instead.

/stereotype

Lol, I didn't mean you... but when I kept referring to 'them' as 'they', it didn't ring true, given that I'm in that bracket myself.

My opinion (since that's basically the only 'evidence' any of us can bring forward here) is that every older generation probably feels this way about the one coming up. They're always lazier, coc_kier, less loyal, etc. I'm sure when I become the employer rather than the employee, I'll think it looks the same way as it does to you guys now. Did Generation X look like a bunch of young go-getting loyalists, looking for the 30 year job? I can't say... but I doubt it.

My dad was also screwed over by his company when oil tanked in the 90's. He was with them for 20 years, and when the layoffs came, he was one of the first on the block. I totally understand why they did it... and it really clarified why I won't be sacrificing myself for a company during 'my' hard times, because they certainly won't be doing it for me. It makes sense to find the best paying job with the best benefits and get what you can now, because your company essentially does the same thing.

It's about time employees started figuring out how to act like businesses themselves, rather than self-sacrificing automotons.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

It's about time employees started figuring out how to act like businesses themselves, rather than self-sacrificing automotons.

Interesting. That's twice now in this thread where anecdotal evidence was used as an excuse for behaviour (not saying it's right or wrong, only making an observation).

Could Gen Y's opinions have been formed by watching the treatment of their parents, who were most likely extremely loyal to the corporation and got soaked because of it? It must have something to do with it. Can't say I've ever considered that.

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

It makes sense to find the best paying job with the best benefits and get what you can now, because your company essentially does the same thing.

"Get what you can now". This really stands out to me.

If I understand this correctly, why should I then give a hoot about you as an employee if you're just chasing the next rainbow anyway? You're just being a mercenary.

If you want to earn some respect as an employee or for that matter as a professional, I don't think this is the best way to go about it...

[duncan]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I'm just guessing... but might the increased probability of a 'Gen Y'er' jumping ship to another company be because there are plenty of jobs out there to be had? As the baby-boomers get older, they're going to retire, and those jobs are going to be open. There are more people retiring than entering the workforce. Seems to me that this will create more opportunities for people horizontally, and they may take the extra 5-10 grand to do the same job at a different company, because the old coot who did that job is off to Jamaica.

With all this doom and gloom about what Gen Y'ers expect, it seems that the fact that there 'should' be a lot of jobs floating around gets lost. Maybe they're vocationally mobile because they can be, rather than because they're a bunch of spoiled brats? (and by they, I mean we).

With mandatory retirement all but out the window, and babyboomers being the biggest spenders, many are holding on to their jobs longer. Generation X are taking the next step up, and 'Y' is still refusing to lower the expectations, and work their way up.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

"Get what you can now". This really stands out to me.

If I understand this correctly, why should I then give a hoot about you as an employee if you're just chasing the next rainbow anyway? You're just being a mercenary.

If you want to earn some respect as an employee or for that matter as a professional, I don't think this is the best way to go about it...

Er... well, to begin with, were this a job interview, I think I'd be singing a different tune.

And you _need_ to 'give a hoot' about your Gen Y employees, because pretty soon they'll make up the bulk of your workforce. I have the respect of my workplace, and I think of myself as a professional. If I work hard, I expect to be rewarded for my hard work. If I'm not, and another employer would like to give me better compensation for what I do, why shouldn't I go? My company is not a member of my family; it's a job. Not my life. I'll sacrifice for friends, family, health, ideals, etc. My corporation (unless they're compensating me massively accordingly) falls below those things.

When your company starts to tank, and you need to cut employees, how much is my loyalty going to be worth then? Honestly, I'll bust my ass for a company that busts it's ass for me. It's not like they're rare. As companies begin to vie for labour, they offer better deals.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

"Get what you can now". This really stands out to me.

If I understand this correctly, why should I then give a hoot about you as an employee if you're just chasing the next rainbow anyway? You're just being a mercenary.

If you want to earn some respect as an employee or for that matter as a professional, I don't think this is the best way to go about it...

Also, my Dad worked his butt off for years for his company, and showed 100% loyalty. That didn't save him from the layoffs. Why should I act the same as him, when I know how that story ends? Why should an employee be more loyal to the company, than the company to the employee?

If the workplace was a desperate struggle, that's one thing. But here, now, it's not. As far as I'm concerned, it's an employee's marketplace right now, not an employer's. But that may just be where I'm from.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by duncan

With mandatory retirement all but out the window, and babyboomers being the biggest spenders, many are holding on to their jobs longer. Generation X are taking the next step up, and 'Y' is still refusing to lower the expectations, and work their way up.

Fair enough. But I still firmly believe that there are a LOT of 50+ year olds in the workplace, who, over the next 2 decades, are all going to be leaving it. I assume someone will have to fill those middle-upper management shoes... likely lower-management type Gen-X'ers.. and it all trickles down, because younger people will take those jobs.

I realize that mandatory retirement is less of an issue these days, but I'm fairly sure a lot of those people probably wouldn't mind retiring. I don't see most retirees as kicking and screaming to keep their jobs, while being forced out. They buy RV's and do what they always wanted to do.

[Cowperson]

With mandatory retirement all but out the window, and babyboomers being the biggest spenders, many are holding on to their jobs longer.

I agree . . . . and that also relates to the fact people are simply living longer and generally haven't planned financially for living far longer than they had thought and lastly, many are in demand for their experience.

Its quite interesting to see the number of 50 and 60 year-olds who formally retire from their companies then are immediately re-hired as consultants, working three or four months in the year and earning mid to upper five figures or even six figures for that short span of time.

They can keep that up quite a while and still enjoy a pretty decent retirement.

Gen Y'ers are banking on a demographic gap opening up opportunities but might be surprised to find the fogies are still there, either through choice or necessity.

Cowperson

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Also, my Dad worked his butt off for years for his company, and showed 100% loyalty. That didn't save him from the layoffs. Why should I act the same as him, when I know how that story ends? Why should an employee be more loyal to the company, than the company to the employee?

If the workplace was a desperate struggle, that's one thing. But here, now, it's not. As far as I'm concerned, it's an employee's marketplace right now, not an employer's. But that may just be where I'm from.

Agamemnon, loyalty does pay off. I wouldn't consider job-jumping one bit when I know I have a future with a certain company who believes I can excel in their workplace. In this sense, I guess it all depends where you work. I have no plans of leaving my current job with my small firm, but they are begging me every time I come in not to leave them, and they are accomodating to no end when it comes to making me enjoy my work.

I would say the onus is on the employee to prove their worth; no company should show any loyalty if an employee isn't going to pay their duty of fidelity. I guess it's a two-way street. Of course, this is coming from a business student, but just because the job market is hot right now doesn't mean it will be tommorow.

BTW, where you work, I hear nothing but praise for you and your workforce, that's definetely something to be proud of!

[JiriHrdina]

The one thing that I think young people overlook is that many employers will avoid individuals that haven't shown the ability to stick with a job. If I get a resume and see 4 jobs in 2 years or something similar, chances are I won't hire the person. I don't want to invest time and money into someone only to have them leave 6 months later for supposed greener pastures. When you're starting you're career I think its important to stay with one company for at least a 2-3 year period.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Agamemnon, loyalty does pay off. I wouldn't consider job-jumping one bit when I know I have a future with a certain company who believes I can excel in their workplace. In this sense, I guess it all depends where you work. I have no plans of leaving my current job with my small firm, but they are begging me every time I come in not to leave them, and they are accomodating to no end when it comes to making me enjoy my work.

I would say the onus is on the employee to prove their worth; no company should show any loyalty if an employee isn't going to pay their duty of fidelity. I guess it's a two-way street. Of course, this is coming from a business student, but just because the job market is hot right now doesn't mean it will be tommorow.

I hear you, and more or less agree. I guess I'd pose this question to you; if someone offered you 20 grand more a year to do the same job you're doing now for another company, would you take it? How important is building up a 'long term' commitment with one company, when another is willing to offer you a significant amount more?

BTW, where you work, I hear nothing but praise for you and your workforce, that's definetely something to be proud of!

I've been lucky, and find myself and my workplace the exception to the 'get what you can/jump ship' rule. I don't think every company is necessarily as accomodating and great to work at as the one I've found! But thanks!

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

The one thing that I think young people overlook is that many employers will avoid individuals that haven't shown the ability to stick with a job. If I get a resume and see 4 jobs in 2 years or something similar, chances are I won't hire the person. I don't want to invest time and money into someone only to have them leave 6 months later for supposed greener pastures. When you're starting you're career I think its important to stay with one company for at least a 2-3 year period.

Right.. but I think what you're saying here plays into the 'new' way of looking at an employee. Heck, you're saying '2-3 year period' when it used to be '10-15 year period'. I've always been told (by older generations) to expect to switch careers 2-3 times at least, as opposed to the 'old' way, which was getting in at 18 and out at 65 of the same profession, maybe even the same workplace. I think the very fact that you're saying 2-3 years shows that the expectations of length of employment are already trending downwards... my two cents.